MG Bullet Problems?

[1SOW]

I ordered 2000 Montana Gold 124gr 9mm CMJ bullets and received two boxes of 1000 bullets each.

The first box had 10 small boxes of 100 bullets each. They loaded smoothly and shot well. The second box had a plastic bag of 1000.

I had problems getting a consistent COAL with the second box. I measured 250 bullets and found up to a .016+" variation, ranging from OALs .584" to .600". It wasn't just a few. 30% were .584"-.589", 25% were .590"-.593", 40% were .594"-.597 (normal range for these bullets) and 5% were up to .600" I went ahead and loaded them using 3 different COALS.

I emailed MG about the problem, and this was their reply the next day:

Thank you for letting me know about the bullet problem. the only time we would ship retail packaged bullets is if we were out of stock on bulk bullets. variations in oal that you have is out of spec for our 124s. i supect packaging grabed set aside bullets at the machine instead of waiting for the normal flow and procedures. in any case, we will ship you a thousand 124cmjs at no charge. we sorry you had this problem. norm

I got the shipping notice by email at the same time I got MG's response.

I'm not happy about the mistake, but I'm very pleased with MG's quick action.

Has anyone else had any QC problems with MG bullets?

Edited November 10, 2009 by 1SOW

[G-ManBart]

I'm not happy about the mistake, but I'm very pleased with MG's quick action.

Has anyone else had any QC problems with MG bullets?

Yeah, it's pretty hard to fault a company that takes you for your word and makes it right without question.

I've loaded cases and cases of their bullets in .355 and .40 and haven't seen any sort of variation to speak of. I weigh a sample of each batch just to make sure and they've always been spot on. I've never measured them with any regularity, but my OAL's haven't varied enough to warrant that. The 121IFP with the exposed lead tip does have some variation, but that's just the nature of the beast with that bullet. R,

[GentlemanJim]

We have shot a truck load of those bullets

No problems found...good folks to deal with

not surprised how they fixed you up

Jim

[DrawandDuck]

I have shot the MG 124 gr JHP exclusively for 4 years without ANY problems......I will not shoot another brand of bullet....They resolved the issue like I would expect them to.....

Randal

[1SOW]

Thanks for the responses.

I've never heard any quality criticisms about MG, and I like companies that stand by their products.

I already have Zero 125 HPs on backorder, but I'll order MGs again.

[tooslo]

I have shot the MG 124 gr JHP exclusively for 4 years without ANY problems......I will not shoot another brand of bullet....They resolved the issue like I would expect them to.....

Randal

What are your fav loads with these? I'm sitting on 3K.

[G-ManBart]

I have shot the MG 124 gr JHP exclusively for 4 years without ANY problems......I will not shoot another brand of bullet....They resolved the issue like I would expect them to.....

Randal

What are your fav loads with these? I'm sitting on 3K.

You might want to narrow that down to what kind of gun, Major or Minor etc....

[tooslo]

I have shot the MG 124 gr JHP exclusively for 4 years without ANY problems......I will not shoot another brand of bullet....They resolved the issue like I would expect them to.....

Randal

What are your fav loads with these? I'm sitting on 3K.

You might want to narrow that down to what kind of gun, Major or Minor etc....

G17 minor

[LPatterson]

124JHP 9 minor, 155JHP 40 Open, 185JHP 45 Open & 230JRN 625 Revo. Made in Montana.

[1SOW]

P.S. I received the 1000 rds from MG today. A sampling measured consistent lengths in the normal range. The delivered cost on the invoice was $101 but no charge.

I'm going to try two hundred Saturday at an AASA Fun Shoot and in a USPSA league. Maybe they'll bring me luck, like finding some Federal SPPs.

[Al Capizzo]

I'm going to email them and tell them their bullets disappear shortly after I receive them. Think they'll send me a thousand?

[njl]

I wish PD had customer service like that. I found around 1.5% of their bullets had split jackets. I emailed them about it and included macro closeup pictures of several examples. They told me they had trouble opening the pictures and they'd get back to me. They never did. I haven't ordered from them again.

[JeffWard]

I switched to Moly 147s, because I was having accuracy issues with the MG 147s. They're cheaper than the Zeros, and more expensive than "Black bullets", but not near as accurate in MY GUN, as the Zeros, or the Moly/Leads.

I get 1-1.5" groups at 15 yards with Zeros/Molys and 3-4" with the MGs. I've heard they have sizing issues, running under .355. That said, I haven't measured them...

They are a good company to deal with, and they deliver quickly! Order out the same day, even with my little 100 bullet order... Still waiting for an answer back on my latest Black-Bullet order... I wish the MGs shot as tight as the others... I'd order nothing but.

Jeff

[ron59]

I switched to Moly 147s, because I was having accuracy issues with the MG 147s. They're cheaper than the Zeros, and more expensive than "Black bullets", but not near as accurate in MY GUN, as the Zeros, or the Moly/Leads.

I get 1-1.5" groups at 15 yards with Zeros/Molys and 3-4" with the MGs. I've heard they have sizing issues, running under .355. That said, I haven't measured them...

I'm "glad" to hear you say that, because now I'm thinking it's not just me. I've gone through 7000 MG 147grainers, and only recently tried to do some *serious* tests for accuracy. I got some sandbags and went to the range, and shot from a solid rest position. I shot 20 rounds through my G17 with WWB 115gr (Wally World) vs. 20 of my reloads (3.4gr S-1000 @ 1.132 OAL). The results? Dismal.

The WWB was pretty much blowing out the center of my target, while mine? All over the place. And that was at SEVEN yards! I can't imagine the results at 25 yards freehand. I may need to shoot another 40 or 50 (each) to make sure I'm getting reliable results, but that was eye-opening, for sure.

Which Molys are you shooting? Bear Creek? I've been meaning to try some of those, may have to do it... I am NOT happy with my current results.

Also... what powders are you using ?

[01G8R]

In my short reloading career I've never had accuracy problems with MG bullets. My Dad and I have gone through about 30k rounds (all MG in 9mm and 40). Every time we practice we do some group shooting and the results have been very consistent. Groups as good or better than factory ammo

We had a local shooter that was having some key holing with MG bullets out of a Glock. Our resident ammo expert (a commercial reloader) suggested that the crimp wasn't correct. I can't remember if it was too tight or too loose. Long story short the crimp was adjusted and the problem went away. I'm don't know how much of an effect the crimp can have on group size, but I'm sure someone with a lot more experience than me can speak to that. I've used 231, Titegroup and am now using Silhouette for 9mm Minor, 9mm Major and 40 Major. Hope this helps.

[JThompson]

I switched to Moly 147s, because I was having accuracy issues with the MG 147s. They're cheaper than the Zeros, and more expensive than "Black bullets", but not near as accurate in MY GUN, as the Zeros, or the Moly/Leads.

I get 1-1.5" groups at 15 yards with Zeros/Molys and 3-4" with the MGs. I've heard they have sizing issues, running under .355. That said, I haven't measured them...

They are a good company to deal with, and they deliver quickly! Order out the same day, even with my little 100 bullet order... Still waiting for an answer back on my latest Black-Bullet order... I wish the MGs shot as tight as the others... I'd order nothing but.

Jeff

It's to early to point fingers, but at 25yds with my Tanfo I'm seeing a lot less accuracy than I would expect. MG124 FMJ

[LPatterson]

I switched to Moly 147s, because I was having accuracy issues with the MG 147s. They're cheaper than the Zeros, and more expensive than "Black bullets", but not near as accurate in MY GUN, as the Zeros, or the Moly/Leads.

I get 1-1.5" groups at 15 yards with Zeros/Molys and 3-4" with the MGs. I've heard they have sizing issues, running under .355. That said, I haven't measured them...

I'm "glad" to hear you say that, because now I'm thinking it's not just me. I've gone through 7000 MG 147grainers, and only recently tried to do some *serious* tests for accuracy. I got some sandbags and went to the range, and shot from a solid rest position. I shot 20 rounds through my G17 with WWB 115gr (Wally World) vs. 20 of my reloads (3.4gr S-1000 @ 1.132 OAL). The results? Dismal.

The WWB was pretty much blowing out the center of my target, while mine? All over the place. And that was at SEVEN yards! I can't imagine the results at 25 yards freehand. I may need to shoot another 40 or 50 (each) to make sure I'm getting reliable results, but that was eye-opening, for sure.

Which Molys are you shooting? Bear Creek? I've been meaning to try some of those, may have to do it... I am NOT happy with my current results.

Also... what powders are you using ?

Accurate does not have pistol listing for Solo 1000, so where did you come up with that for a load? Was it only through a chronograph? When I develop a load I set the chrono at 15 feet and a bullseye target at 15 yards because it doesn't matter what the power factor is if it won't group. I don't have a chrono reading for white box but Winchester and American Eagle 147's are in the 975 -1000 FPS range thru my G17 and higher thru the XD9 Tactical. When trying to make a steel calibration load I think we measured white box around 132 so thats about 1150. Before you start bad mouthing MG try making some changes to your load, increase/decrease powder charge or crimp or change powder. If you think moly's are the answer, I like BBI.

[tooslo]

In my short reloading career I've never had accuracy problems with MG bullets. My Dad and I have gone through about 30k rounds (all MG in 9mm and 40). Every time we practice we do some group shooting and the results have been very consistent. Groups as good or better than factory ammo

We had a local shooter that was having some key holing with MG bullets out of a Glock. Our resident ammo expert (a commercial reloader) suggested that the crimp wasn't correct. I can't remember if it was too tight or too loose. Long story short the crimp was adjusted and the problem went away. I'm don't know how much of an effect the crimp can have on group size, but I'm sure someone with a lot more experience than me can speak to that. I've used 231, Titegroup and am now using Silhouette for 9mm Minor, 9mm Major and 40 Major. Hope this helps.

What is your Silhouette load?

[JThompson]

I switched to Moly 147s, because I was having accuracy issues with the MG 147s. They're cheaper than the Zeros, and more expensive than "Black bullets", but not near as accurate in MY GUN, as the Zeros, or the Moly/Leads.

I get 1-1.5" groups at 15 yards with Zeros/Molys and 3-4" with the MGs. I've heard they have sizing issues, running under .355. That said, I haven't measured them...

I'm "glad" to hear you say that, because now I'm thinking it's not just me. I've gone through 7000 MG 147grainers, and only recently tried to do some *serious* tests for accuracy. I got some sandbags and went to the range, and shot from a solid rest position. I shot 20 rounds through my G17 with WWB 115gr (Wally World) vs. 20 of my reloads (3.4gr S-1000 @ 1.132 OAL). The results? Dismal.

The WWB was pretty much blowing out the center of my target, while mine? All over the place. And that was at SEVEN yards! I can't imagine the results at 25 yards freehand. I may need to shoot another 40 or 50 (each) to make sure I'm getting reliable results, but that was eye-opening, for sure.

Which Molys are you shooting? Bear Creek? I've been meaning to try some of those, may have to do it... I am NOT happy with my current results.

Also... what powders are you using ?

Accurate does not have pistol listing for Solo 1000, so where did you come up with that for a load? Was it only through a chronograph? When I develop a load I set the chrono at 15 feet and a bullseye target at 15 yards because it doesn't matter what the power factor is if it won't group. I don't have a chrono reading for white box but Winchester and American Eagle 147's are in the 975 -1000 FPS range thru my G17 and higher thru the XD9 Tactical. When trying to make a steel calibration load I think we measured white box around 132 so thats about 1150. Before you start bad mouthing MG try making some changes to your load, increase/decrease powder charge or crimp or change powder. If you think moly's are the answer, I like BBI.

I tend to agree... it's why I need to do some looking before I point any fingers. At this point it could be the gun the load or both. I need to do some research before I say a bullet is at fault, in fact I doubt very much it's the bullets....

[G-ManBart]

Accurate does not have pistol listing for Solo 1000, so where did you come up with that for a load? Was it only through a chronograph? When I develop a load I set the chrono at 15 feet and a bullseye target at 15 yards because it doesn't matter what the power factor is if it won't group. I don't have a chrono reading for white box but Winchester and American Eagle 147's are in the 975 -1000 FPS range thru my G17 and higher thru the XD9 Tactical. When trying to make a steel calibration load I think we measured white box around 132 so thats about 1150. Before you start bad mouthing MG try making some changes to your load, increase/decrease powder charge or crimp or change powder. If you think moly's are the answer, I like BBI.

Here's a link to a thread that has a link to some older Scott data as well as some newer data that Accurate sent to one of the folks here.

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...st&p=984208

[gm iprod]

It's to early to point fingers, but at 25yds with my Tanfo I'm seeing a lot less accuracy than I would expect. MG124 FMJ

I have two handguns that will not shoot MG bulllets as well as other brands of JHP. I have not tried the 124gr FMJ in question I only use JHP.

One is a Tanfoglio P19 Limited HC, 5" barrel 9mm. It will shoot Sierra, Hornady and Zero 115 and 125jhp very well (2" at 25Y maximum). MG just a little worse (3" mostly but occaisionally 4"). Use lead and I have a rifled shotgun.

The other is a Custom Springfield framed NRA AP Open gun, Lisner barrel. It is just plain awful with MG (3-4" at 25), I bought it as the previous owner could not make it shoot. I got it cheap, really cheap as he thought he had a dog, tried the MG (he gave me 2K) and I confirmed it was the ammo not the nut, ran my Zero loads through it and it was smokin. 1.5" at 50Y. Tried the left over MG loads in my STI metallic gun and they would all stay in and around 2.5" at 50, so go figure.

We have used MG and Zero interchangably in all sorts of guns for years. But the Tanfoglio and the Springfield just won't work with them.

You just have to match the bullet to the gun and go from there. Try other bullets in the handgun and see if they shoot better.

[JThompson]

It's to early to point fingers, but at 25yds with my Tanfo I'm seeing a lot less accuracy than I would expect. MG124 FMJ

I have two handguns that will not shoot MG bulllets as well as other brands of JHP. I have not tried the 124gr FMJ in question I only use JHP.

One is a Tanfoglio P19 Limited HC, 5" barrel 9mm. It will shoot Sierra, Hornady and Zero 115 and 125jhp very well (2" at 25Y maximum). MG just a little worse (3" mostly but occaisionally 4"). Use lead and I have a rifled shotgun.

The other is a Custom Springfield framed NRA AP Open gun, Lisner barrel. It is just plain awful with MG (3-4" at 25), I bought it as the previous owner could not make it shoot. I got it cheap, really cheap as he thought he had a dog, tried the MG (he gave me 2K) and I confirmed it was the ammo not the nut, ran my Zero loads through it and it was smokin. 1.5" at 50Y. Tried the left over MG loads in my STI metallic gun and they would all stay in and around 2.5" at 50, so go figure.

We have used MG and Zero interchangably in all sorts of guns for years. But the Tanfoglio and the Springfield just won't work with them.

You just have to match the bullet to the gun and go from there. Try other bullets in the handgun and see if they shoot better.

That's not what I wanted to hear, but I'm glad you told me. I'm seeing 2-3 shots within my wobble zone then a couple out form that then like two of them 4-6. Just horrible, I sand bagged it and was still out to 5. Here's a question, does anyone shoot a Tanfo with MG and have good results? If so, load data please.

If I remember right, I had good luck with it shooting precision Deltas, but that was some time back and I don't remember if I ever really looked at it more than 15y.

Thanks for the input pal....

JT

Edited December 10, 2009 by JThompson

[G-ManBart]

That's not what I wanted to hear, but I'm glad you told me. I'm seeing 2-3 shots within my wobble zone then a couple out form that then like two of them 4-6. Just horrible, I sand bagged it and was still out to 5. Here's a question, does anyone shoot a Tanfo with MG and have good results? If so, load data please.

If I remember right, I had good luck with it shooting precision Deltas, but that was some time back and I don't remember if I ever really looked at it more than 15y.

Thanks for the input pal....

JT

Curious, but I got my first shipment of MG 147 CMJs on Monday (ordered late Thurs!) and loaded up 20 last night for some chrono work (will post results in a few). Out of total coincidence I came home to find my order of Precision Delta 147 FMJ's waiting for me (ordered them in Sep and they said it would be Dec/Jan, so they were good as their word). I was checking the two and comparing....seems the MG's all mic just a bit under .355" and the PD's mic a bit under .356". That suprised me as I thought the MG 115 JHPs I've been using have always mic'd right at .3555". I'm very curious as to how they'll do for accuracy (chrono results were good). R,

[JThompson]

That's not what I wanted to hear, but I'm glad you told me. I'm seeing 2-3 shots within my wobble zone then a couple out form that then like two of them 4-6. Just horrible, I sand bagged it and was still out to 5. Here's a question, does anyone shoot a Tanfo with MG and have good results? If so, load data please.

If I remember right, I had good luck with it shooting precision Deltas, but that was some time back and I don't remember if I ever really looked at it more than 15y.

Thanks for the input pal....

JT

Curious, but I got my first shipment of MG 147 CMJs on Monday (ordered late Thurs!) and loaded up 20 last night for some chrono work (will post results in a few). Out of total coincidence I came home to find my order of Precision Delta 147 FMJ's waiting for me (ordered them in Sep and they said it would be Dec/Jan, so they were good as their word). I was checking the two and comparing....seems the MG's all mic just a bit under .355" and the PD's mic a bit under .356". That suprised me as I thought the MG 115 JHPs I've been using have always mic'd right at .3555". I'm very curious as to how they'll do for accuracy (chrono results were good). R,

Wanna sell the Deltas?

[G-ManBart]

Wanna sell the Deltas?

Hey, I haven't even tried shooting them yet I loaded up 50 to try today alongside the MG 147 CMJ's. Other than a slight difference (very slight) in OAL everything is the same. I did note I have to flare the case mouth a bit more to get them to seat compared with the MGs. Range report later. R,