USPSA Production Legal Guide rod and spring for G34

[kevin c]

Not to be argumentative, but I'm pretty sure that, even though not expressly listed, it's OK to use an OFM G34/35 mag release in a G17? At least that used to be OK. I will email JA and ask to be sure.

KC

eta: email to JA sent

Edited September 23, 2008 by kevin c

[Singlestack]

I have a tungsten in mine and it passed the weight test at the Nats. I use the tungsten with a 12 LB Wolff spring.

Same here Bob...they weighted my G34 at Area 6 and I had no problems.

They were just collecting data at A6.

[kevin c]

I have a tungsten in mine and it passed the weight test at the Nats. I use the tungsten with a 12 LB Wolff spring.

Same here Bob...they weighted my G34 at Area 6 and I had no problems.

They were just collecting data at A6.

Greg Lent weighed every Glock in my squad at the Production Nats. He didn't write anything down, so I think he was looking for compliance. (I'd hate to have to remember the OEM wt of every listed Production gun...yeeesh...).

splg edt

Edited September 25, 2008 by kevin c

[Jman]

As I suspected and Charlie indcated the ruling is for Vanek's Ultimate and GM triggers groups. Here's a copy of yesterdays email and my reply.

Hi Jim,

There is an NROI ruling approved by the BOD that does not allow the Vanek trigger in Production guns. It goes back to 2006 and can be found on uspsa.org click on match rules link on left then scroll to NROI rulings, I have included it below.

Question:

There has been a question recently regarding the use of Vanek Triggers in Glock Pistols in Production Division The question is whether this is an external modification. The only thing visible from the outside of the gun is: the trigger is slightly further back in the frame due to an internal decrease in pre travel, the rear of the trigger safety is trimmed a few thousandths so that it was will still engage and act as a safety, and, I think part of the front of the trigger safety is smoothed as well.

Ruling:

The Vanek trigger, much like the Speed Bump trigger, has an external modification that makes it illegal for Production division. The Speed Bump trigger has the travel screw mounted to the rear of the trigger and is visible externally, the Vanek trigger, has relocated the pivot pin about 3/16" above the factory specs, and has filled in the original hole with a black material that is still visible on inspection.

Regards,

John Amidon

John,

The ruling describes Vanek's GM and Ultimate trigger groups and indeed would not be allowed in Production division. The trigger group in question is his Classic. (circa 2007) As stated, absolutely no external modifications. It's simply an internally polished Glock trigger group with after market springs and connecter. The ruling accurately describes Vanek triggers allowed only in limited and open divisions today. It does not however describe the Classic trigger designed specifically for USPSA Production competition. Thank you very much for your help.

Regards,

Jim M

[racerba]

I have a tungsten in mine and it passed the weight test at the Nats. I use the tungsten with a 12 LB Wolff spring.

Same here Bob...they weighted my G34 at Area 6 and I had no problems.

They were just collecting data at A6.

Greg Lent weighed every Glock in my squad at the Production Nats. He didn't right anything down, so I think he was looking for compliance. (I'd hate to have to remember the OEM wt of every listed Production gun...yeeesh...).

Compliance at Nats.

Collecting data at A6.

[Micah]

^

I am aware of that, but if you know how much a stock G34 SHOULD weight, and your G34 w/tungsten guiderod weighs within the 2oz spread, then one can conjecture that one is shooting within the rules.

[kevin c]

Not to be argumentative, but I'm pretty sure that, even though not expressly listed, it's OK to use an OFM G34/35 mag release in a G17? At least that used to be OK. I will email JA and ask to be sure.

KC

eta: email to JA sent

And here is his very prompt reply:

Hi Kevin,

There is an NROI ruling on this, it can be found at uspsa.org, under match rules link on left, then scroll down to NROI rulings, I have copied it below.

Question:

May I replace external parts on my Production gun with aftermarket parts.

Ruling:

Aftermarket parts are allowed but restricted to those listed in Appendix D4, any other part must be OEM, either offered on an approved model for Production or in their catalog.

Regards,

John Amidon

edited for brevity

Edited September 25, 2008 by kevin c

[vluc]

Good that JA has re-verified the external items. Now for the answer on internal parts and if aftermarket connectors are okay.

[Jman]

Recieved another email from John and he is going to get back to me (us) on the connecter specific issue.

Jim

[dohboy]

They weighed my G34 at the nationals and it made it with Sevigny sights, Wolffe steel guide rod and Tru-Grip tape.

[BR]

They weighed my G34 at the nationals and it made it with Sevigny sights, Wolffe steel guide rod and Tru-Grip tape.

Ditto, except with a G17. Greg Lentz said they were weighing production guns to determine 2 oz. compliance. He said they use the weights listed on the USPSA approved production gun list at the NROI website here http://www.uspsa.org/rules/production_list.php

Ciao.

-br

[vluc]

They weighed my G34 at the nationals and it made it with Sevigny sights, Wolffe steel guide rod and Tru-Grip tape.

Ditto, except with a G17. Greg Lentz said they were weighing production guns to determine 2 oz. compliance. He said they use the weights listed on the USPSA approved production gun list at the NROI website here http://www.uspsa.org/rules/production_list.php

Ciao.

-br

Interesting. Glock's webpage lists the 34 w/ no mag at 22.92 ounces (32.79 with magazine), USPSA has it at 25.75 ounces. I wonder if USPSA has "added" the 2 oz and this figure is the absolute highest it can go or if 27.75 is the limit? Regardless, a difference either way.

Edited September 25, 2008 by vluc

[EkuJustice]

MY guess would be glock listed the weight a little light. With alot of people going after light weight for carry duty etc it makes sense for glock to list it a little light

[racerba]

MY guess would be glock listed the weight a little light. With alot of people going after light weight for carry duty etc it makes sense for glock to list it a little light

But where did USPSA get it's weight?

[vluc]

I don't know where the weight came from, but I did find this in the 2008 rulebook in Appendix D4 Production:

18 Maximum weight Yes, 2 ounces over weight listed on approved pistol list

So as I read this, 27.75 ounces in the maximum weight for a Glock 34 (25.75 from approved list plus 2 ounces)

Edited September 26, 2008 by vluc

[Rob D]

The trigger connector question no longer applies to me either.

I cleaned my gun last night, and after putting it back together noticed that my trigger pull was getting heavier almost with every shot. Took the gun apart and looked it over, then reassambled it. The first few trigger pulls were normal then it started getting really heavy again. Swapped out the ghost rocket for my original glock connector and it fixed the problem. I'm no gunsmith, and I'm not SURE the ghost rocket caused the problem, but swapping it out definitely fixed it.

[Rob D]

I appreciate the thread drift as I pretty well started it, but back to my original post. My new guide rod and springs came in the mail today. I put in a reduced weight striker spring and a wolff trigger return spring that tightened up the trigger pretty well, but I'm having a little trouble with the new rod and recoil spring.

I got the LWD stainless guide rod and a 14lb wolff recoil spring. I didn't know whether to order a round wound wolff spring or a flat wound ISMI, but the guide rod said it would work with both so I got the wolff since I had heard good things about their springs.

When I work the slide, I can hear the spring creeking and clicking inside the gun, almost as if it's catching on something. Anybody have any experience with these springs binding up? The spring came with a washer to install on the guide rod to keep it captive, and I noticed the spring sticks out from the side of the washer about 1/16" on one side because it's sort of wrapped around the guide rod like a helix. Since that's the end that actually fits into the muzzle end of the slide, I didn't think it would matter, but I'm no expert.

I'm back to my factory rod and recoil spring and feeling bummed about spending $ on parts that don't seem to help anything. Was the "round wound" spring my mistake? any suggestions?

[racerba]

When I work the slide, I can hear the spring creeking and clicking inside the gun, almost as if it's catching on something. Anybody have any experience with these springs binding up?

I have the Wolf 12Lb spring and I think I know the sound you are refering to. Does it on mine also. Haven't had a problem. I did have problems with the ISMI since the OD on the spring is a little bigger than the ID of the receiver where the spring rides. I didn't have any sounds, but it was binding.

If you want, you can put the stock recoil on the SS rod. I've run it that way also.

Don't understand what would be the problem with the rocket connector. Doesn't make sense, but since it is fine with the stock connector, I'd stay with that then.

Edited September 29, 2008 by racerba

[Rob D]

I have the Wolf 12Lb spring and I think I know the sound you are refering to. Does it on mine also. Haven't had a problem. I did have problems with the ISMI since the OD on the spring is a little bigger than the ID of the receiver where the spring rides. I didn't have any sounds, but it was binding.

If you want, you can put the stock recoil on the SS rod. I've run it that way also.

Don't understand what would be the problem with the rocket connector. Doesn't make sense, but since it is fine with the stock connector, I'd stay with that then.

Good point. Maybe I shouldn't judge it off of the sound. I'll put some rounds through it tomorrow and see how it does.

I think the overtravel stop on the ghost causes the trigger bar to push the connector outward, pushing the angle of the L on the connector past 90 degrees away from the trigger housing. Maybe the angle change was making it harder for the bar to slip past the little flange on the end? Again, I'm no expert.

[Suburban Commando]

I've used the 14 pound Wolff spring on a guide rod made for stock or ISMI flat springs in a G17 with no problems. That same pistol now has a compensator, and a 10 pound ISMI 1911 spring, which is an even worse fit on the guide rod, and it still works fine.

Back OT: It might help the trigger weight problem if you trimmed the trigger stop tab a bit more. The problem you describe sounds like too much overtravel stop. Just remember, metal is easier to remove than put back on.

Edited September 30, 2008 by Suburban Commando

[Jman]

A month wont go by without at least one fellow Glock competitor approaching me about his bulky gun. I keep extra stock recoil spring assemblies for such occasions. There is not a single spring in the Glock system that is not wholly dependent on the normal function of all others. It's a suspension. You can't change the components on one corner of a car and expect good performance. Ain't gonna happen.

Don't want to come on as some know it all. I'm not. Actually I'm a bit slow. It's just that I have frigged up my Glocks enough to know that Gaston had it right to begin with.

Jim

[Singlestack]

It's just that I have frigged up my Glocks enough to know that Gaston had it right to begin with.

Jim

As long as you don't mind a 5lb trigger.

[Flexmoney]

As long as you don't mind a 5lb trigger.

That is the very thinking that starts folks on the journey. Which might be fine if that is where they ended up. Often, instead of them arriving in high-performance glock'ville, we see them over on this boat:

[Rob D]

As long as you don't mind a 5lb trigger.

That is the very thinking that starts folks on the journey. Which might be fine if that is where they ended up. Often, instead of them arriving in high-performance glock'ville, we see them over on this boat:

I don't want the front falling off and I DEFINITELY don't want to sacrifice reliability as that is the very reason I switched to a glock from an STI Spartan that I couldn't get to run. So what would you guys suggest for making my glock trigger as nice as it can be without sacrificing reliability? Polish up the stock parts?

[lugnut]

That is the very thinking that starts folks on the journey. Which might be fine if that is where they ended up. Often, instead of them arriving in high-performance glock'ville, we see them over on this boat:

For the most part I tend to agree. My G34 has a Vanek Classic drop in trigger and Dawson sights. All was good but I "needed" to try lighter recoil springs. I think in my last match my timing was out of whack and I had a bunch of high shots. Went back to the range today and installed the stock recoil spring. I think any additional improvements are just going to have to come from me!