rider82 Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 I currently have a factory STI Eagle 38super. I made the mistake of shooting an open gun the other day, and am considering having my Eagle turned into a open gun. I want to keep the cost to a minimum, so my question is can I use the same slide and purchase an STI comp/barrel. I assume the the front sight cut would be an issue, as well as the rear sight cut, when they are removed. I am not shooting IPSC type matches, but love shooting steel. If I do the conversion, am I better off going 9mm. I have pretty much an unlimited supply of 40 cal brass, and would consider a 40 Open gun, but I don't think 38 super slide would work. Am I better off just selling my current gun and buying an open gun, or converting my current gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoshidaex Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 i think the gun you have would be a good base for an open gun. a barrel/comp assembly and maybe a jpoint/docter would work as a good open gun. you could leave the front sight if you go the jpoint/docter route. from a cost perspective staying with the 38 super for you would be cheaper (same mags, same slide). though having to pick up your brass might get old real quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDB Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 This has been talked about numerous times here. Short answer, Yes it can be done,with little trouble and probably for under $450. But what you will more than likely hear here is save up for a different gun, used ones can be had fairly cheap, and stick with .38 super/SC. There are pros and cons to every setup. Talk to the smith doing the work and see what he thinks. Then balance your goals, what it will take to achieve it and what you are willing to spend for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 It would make a great base for an open gun. If it is a bushing barrel, have the slide cut back 1/2" or so, add a cone comp and you are set. Mill out the rear sight crap or add a slide racker that is designed for the Bomar cut. Add the CMore mount of your choice and you are good to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistolPete Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 It really depends on what you're looking to do. If you want to stay with steel challenge and not shoot USPSA then you might be able to stick with the .38 super and simply add a scope mount and C-more along with having a comped barrel fitted to your gun. You can remove the front and rear sight and be fine and call it a day. Or, you could get add the C-more and mount and get a new top end. Another option would be to have the slide milled to be fitted with a J-Point red dot and simply remove the front sight. This would be an easy solution as well. Then if you wanted you could have a comped barrel fitted to your gun. Keep in mind with a comp setup you will typically remove the barrel bushing and convert to a bull barrel. Or, if you don't want a Frankenstein gun you could sell your Eagle and buy an open gun. Keep in mind that open guns can be VERY picky if not built properly so if you do a simple conversion it may not run 100%. Good luck and welcome to open. It's a blast for sure!!!! Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 I want to keep the cost to a minimum, That phrase never seems to go with Open guns very well If you have a local gunsmith who's a friend and is willing to be flexible, and they know how to make a 2011 that will run (it's not the same as a 1911...honestly, it's not), it might be doable without much trouble. Other than that your best bet might be to sell the Eagle and buy a quality, used Open gun and go from there. If you convert the current gun, stick to 38S/SC...I've had a couple of the best custom smiths out there tell me that 38SC is the absolute easiest to make run reliably even though they can get there with the others. Aside from those few folks who prefer the recoil impulse of the 9mm over the 38S/SC the only reason to use anything else is to save a little bit on brass costs and even that depends on a ready supply of cheap 9mm cases that not everyone has. R, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoShooter Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 I have shot a bunch of steel matches, and have hosted a monthly 1/2 steel match for 16 years. I shot an "open" 40 cal for 10 years and shot my first world shoot with a 40 open. A 40 will hold you back = go with 38 no mater what you do with your slide. My first 40 had iron sights and a comp barrel = I learned a bunch. you could just have a trubor barrel fit to your slide in 38, take off the rear sight and have the frame taped for a C-More mount. The C-more will save you head and mind strain when the other scopes break I have a long story's of broken scopes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLM Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 Great advice from everyone already. I'll second talking to the 'smith that you are going to have do the work. They will be the best source of information. I talked to several before I had my first Open gun built. It started out as a 38 Super gun and I wanted a 9mm gun. On that gun the entire top end got sold except for the Aftec and a complete new top end built on a STI 9 slide. The gun has run and run and run. My spare gun has a 38 breechface slide but the barrel is set up for 9mm. I bought it used for a very good price. I did have to do some extractor tuning and changed the ejector and now it too runs and runs. I guess what I'm getting at is sure, your 38 slide will work with 9mm. Actually I'm pretty sure HSMITH (Howard) prefers the 38 slide for 9mm builds but that decision is best left to the 'smith that you are going to have build the gun. Let him/her decide what's best on the parts front, conversion, same, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 I guess what I'm getting at is sure, your 38 slide will work with 9mm. Actually I'm pretty sure HSMITH (Howard) prefers the 38 slide for 9mm builds but that decision is best left to the 'smith that you are going to have build the gun. Let him/her decide what's best on the parts front, conversion, same, etc. I think that STI has stopped making 9mm slides with the little ridge on the side of the breach face (intent was to help with extractor tension if I recall correctly) so now they're all basically 38 Super slides and you just use a different barrel and extractor setup for 9mm. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's the way things have evolved recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rider82 Posted September 2, 2008 Author Share Posted September 2, 2008 Thanks for all the replies. I think I'm going to find a gunsmith first, then make a decision. It sounds like staying with 38 super is the way to go. Man, I should have never shot that open gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Arendt Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 Man, I should have never shot that open gun. Hehe... Welcome to the dark side.... but don`t panic-> we have cookies Benny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyin40 Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 (edited) Man, I should have never shot that open gun. Hehe... Welcome to the dark side.... but don`t panic-> we have cookies Benny He can blame me because I let him shoot my Open gun Funny thing, I went to a new range to try it out because my club was hosting the Ohio State IDPA Championship over the weekend and I couldn't get on the range. I ended up meeting Rider82 and his buddy and wouldn't you know it, he is a forum member He loved the open gun........ It was good to meet you guys and had fun shooting with you. As far as you gun your good to go. It depends what you want to do with it. Basically cut the slide back, comp barrel and sight. It you want slide lightening like the rear scallop and you can have the front of the slide lightened also. Its all up to you. Your other choice can be to sell the eagle and put it towards an open gun. Talk to a couple smiths. Take a look at alot of open gun and see what you like as far as looks Flyin Edited September 3, 2008 by Flyin40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rider82 Posted September 3, 2008 Author Share Posted September 3, 2008 Flyin, it's nice to see that you fessed up. When I think back, I did notice an EVIL GRIN on your face when you handed me that gun. If I do this, the least you could do is is talk to my wife, or let me live at your house when I get my a$$ kicked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 I have converted several Eagles to Open guns and built top ends for several more factory guns, I won't do any more. A couple things play here, first is value the customer takes home. You take a $1500 gun and put another $1000+ in it and it isn't worth $2500+, not even close actually, more like $1800-2000. Second, conversions and especially conversions using existing parts, are not always able to get everything perfect. The flaws in the factory fit will remain for instance, things like slide to frame fit and barrel fit, unless the parts are replaced or re-fitted which isn't always a good idea. Trying to build an Open gun on a budget is a bad idea in my opinion. The end result isn't any cheaper than a build from scratch, and often times is more expensive. The end result also won't be the equal of a scratch build by a good smith. I call it the 'installment plan' approach, dropping another thousand is easier than dropping three thousand, but the reality is that the end result doesn't pay. Don't get me wrong, you can make a kick ass Open gun out of your Eagle, I have done it. I do think there is a better way though and the money can be spent better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpl Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 I agree with Howard on this, 100%. I, too, have done "conversions" for customers and they never seem to come out as good as a scratch build. I'm in the business and pistol work is my profession. It still amazes me the trouble and expense some want to go through to make something they have into something they want, and how much better off they would be financially, if nothing else, to just sell what they have and buy or have built exactly what they want. I'm also like Howard in that I won't do any more "conversions". As the pistolsmith you are forced into too many compromises and the quality of the finished product is generally not up to the standards that you have set for your "product". I know I have been disappointed with some results and the customer ends up with a substantial amount of money in something that isn't exactly "right". You'll be much better off and have a much nicer finished pistol, to have what you want built from scratch on new, unfit parts or buy a used pistol that is what you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 A 40 will hold you back = go with 38 no mater what you do with your slide. I don't understand this ?? I do like the prices of 9mm bullets compared to 40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 A 40 will hold you back = go with 38 no mater what you do with your slide. I don't understand this ?? I do like the prices of 9mm bullets compared to 40. He's got to be referring to mag capacity since .40 tends to be quite reliable in an S_I and with light bullets you can use a slow enough powder to generate enough gas to work the comp. I'd guess nobody is getting much more than 26-27 in a .40 big stick. Lots of field courses can be comfortably shot without a reload if you've got a 30-32 round gun, but not quite with a 27-28 round gun. With more and more folks sporting 31 round big sticks it seems like a lot of course designers are coming up with 30-32 round stages....probably trying to sucker folks into trying it without a reload Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoShooter Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 after ....After you get your cool 'OPEN Gun' Check in about getting into the SOB club Snobby Opengun Bullies so that you can Bully the stages around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 A 40 will hold you back = go with 38 no mater what you do with your slide. I don't understand this ?? I do like the prices of 9mm bullets compared to 40. He's got to be referring to mag capacity since .40 tends to be quite reliable in an S_I and with light bullets you can use a slow enough powder to generate enough gas to work the comp. I doubt Alamo is referring to capacity of 40 in a Steel Challenge gun. Still wondering why 40 would hold somebody back... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoShooter Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 (edited) A 40 will hold you back = go with 38 no mater what you do with your slide. I don't understand this ?? I do like the prices of 9mm bullets compared to 40. He's got to be referring to mag capacity since .40 tends to be quite reliable in an S_I and with light bullets you can use a slow enough powder to generate enough gas to work the comp. I doubt Alamo is referring to capacity of 40 in a Steel Challenge gun. ? No not mag capacity I was referring to target / sight recovery time. even with a light bullet in the 40 -"I think" the 38 is faster. I did not find a bullet powder combo that was even close to as good as my 38 super is now. I wanted the 40 to work , I had the gun and I had shot 40 cal for 14 years, and I had a 40 revolver that I shot too. The gun was stolen and the replacement was in 38 super Edited September 8, 2008 by Flexmoney to fix quote tags Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 I doubt Alamo is referring to capacity of 40 in a Steel Challenge gun. Still wondering why 40 would hold somebody back...? Gotcha....I was thinking of steel matches like Rio's Tues night steel rather than Steel Challenge where capacity doesn't matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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