115JHP vs 124JHP in my open glock

[ormondopen]

because I have to load short (1.130-1.335) making major with MG124JHP and WSF powder is not happening. If I want to continue to use the WSF, because I have so much, will switching to a 115JHP use less powder so I can get to major?

using 6.8gr of WSF fills the case so seating the bullet will cause it to be compressed.

please adivse.

[JThompson]

because I have to load short (1.130-1.335) making major with MG124JHP and WSF powder is not happening. If I want to continue to use the WSF, because I have so much, will switching to a 115JHP use less powder so I can get to major?

using 6.8gr of WSF fills the case so seating the bullet will cause it to be compressed.

please adivse.

No. You will use more powder with a lighter bullet

[yoshidaex]

you're gonna need more powder to push that 115 grainer to make major. unless you have a magic powder that increases velocity the less there is

[L9X25]

In my experience, WSF does not react well at maximum pressures.

I was using 540 when Winchester introduced their "improved" powders like WSF, WST, WAP, etc... I was told that WSF would be a cleaner alternative to 540 so I tried it out. While 540 has a linear pressure curve, WSF becomes unpredictable at higher pressures, particuarly with compressed loads. I could add powder and lose veloctiy. Velocity and pressure would become inconsistent, to the point of being dangerous.

I have used it many times for minor loads with good sucess.

Be careful.

[maineshootah]

because I have to load short (1.130-1.335) making major with MG124JHP and WSF powder is not happening. If I want to continue to use the WSF, because I have so much, will switching to a 115JHP use less powder so I can get to major?

using 6.8gr of WSF fills the case so seating the bullet will cause it to be compressed.

please adivse.

6.8 of WSF should not be a compressed load, you should be able to get close to 7.0 before it does, using 1.145-1.148 as a length.

Why do you need to load so short? My open glock (and the mags) handle anything up to 1.150.

115's are going to force you to have even more powder and get your crono speed up around 1450 just to squeak by with Major.

I would stick with the 124's and go with a longer AOL.

[smokshwn]

I would give serious consideration to switching powder. From doing a little reading here you can find several guys making major in glocks with HS6, Ramshot Silhouette, VV 3n37 etc. at lengths that will feed in the glock mags.

[JThompson]

I agree.... HSmith turned me on to Silhouette. I was using VV powders, but they are so much more $$ I don't see or feel much, if any dif between the two. There was also a heat issue... I practice a lot and I was going to melt my barrel down using 3n37. The stuff shoots flat and I don't have any pressure issues and the gun loves it.

$50 for 4 pound? Send me 16 please.

[ormondopen]

because I have to load short (1.130-1.335) making major with MG124JHP and WSF powder is not happening. If I want to continue to use the WSF, because I have so much, will switching to a 115JHP use less powder so I can get to major?

using 6.8gr of WSF fills the case so seating the bullet will cause it to be compressed.

please adivse.

6.8 of WSF should not be a compressed load, you should be able to get close to 7.0 before it does, using 1.145-1.148 as a length.

Why do you need to load so short? My open glock (and the mags) handle anything up to 1.150.

115's are going to force you to have even more powder and get your crono speed up around 1450 just to squeak by with Major.

I would stick with the 124's and go with a longer AOL.

I can't go longer with the bullet I am using now.

I bought a lb of HS6 this weekend to give it a try, we will see. the WSF seems to be a little softer in my gun. I read here somewhere HS6 is good for shorter OAL's. for what ever reason if I load past 1.135 w/ JHP's it will not seat completely in the chamber but works fine when case guaged. I am considering FMJ/CMJ, I can load out to 1.160 with round nose bullets and it seems to work fine. Could the throat on my KKM be shorter for some reason?

[Kingman]

Sounds like exactly that a short throat.

As others said a 115 takes a bit more powder to make major. I load to 1.155 and can make major with hs6 and longshot without a problem. Several others have worked for me also, but those are my favorites.

[ormondopen]

I called KKM and was told their 9mm barrels are what they are supposed to be (1.169).

when I load dummy rounds out to 1.145 and try to cycle the gun it feels like the rounds are stuck in the barrel and are a

b_ _ch to extract out.

is there a device out there that will measure the depth of the throat?

And are gunsmith fit barrel throats different than a drop-in barrel throat? I would not think so not sure.

[ormondopen]

one more thing:

if I use round nose bullets all is as it should be, should I just use round nose and be done with it or figure out why JHP's won't work?

Edited December 11, 2007 by ormondopen

[ormondopen]

Sounds like exactly that a short throat.

As others said a 115 takes a bit more powder to make major. I load to 1.155 and can make major with hs6 and longshot without a problem. Several others have worked for me also, but those are my favorites.

wouldn't a short throat be a short throat? If a JHP won't work wouldn't that be true for a round nose bullet?

Or am I way off?

[HoMiE]

How much crimp are you using? I have loaded 124 MG JHPs as long as 1.165 in my glock with KKM barrel.

[ormondopen]

How much crimp are you using? I have loaded 124 MG JHPs as long as 1.165 in my glock with KKM barrel.

.377-.378, tried more crimp but I started to get bulging.

[Kingman]

I know from other barrel makers that a gunsmith barrel normally needs the chamber final cut. This may or may not be true with KKM on Glocks. Now the thing is think of the shape of the round bullet, it gets away from the edge of the barrel in a quick manner. Most JHP's have flat sides then taper away. The flat side will come into contact quickly if the chamber is not long enough.

To test start by dropping a new unfired case into the chamber, does it go in to where it is supposed to. Not familiar enough with glocks to tell you how it should look there.

[HoMiE]

If you don't have new unfired cases, try a resized case, with no bell or crimp yet, just try it after resizing(no primer) and see if the case will go in the chamber.

[ormondopen]

If you don't have new unfired cases, try a resized case, with no bell or crimp yet, just try it after resizing(no primer) and see if the case will go in the chamber.

unprimed, resized case drops in like a champ.

is it possible that the actual bullet might be a little larger than the .356 actual sizing?

[HoMiE]

If you don't have new unfired cases, try a resized case, with no bell or crimp yet, just try it after resizing(no primer) and see if the case will go in the chamber.

unprimed, resized case drops in like a champ.

is it possible that the actual bullet might be a little larger than the .356 actual sizing?

Doubt it, the 124 bullets are pretty consistent. Next thing I would check is how much are you belling the cases? You might have too much or too deep and the crimp can't get rid of all of it. I just barely bell the case mouth probably less than 1/16", you don't need to over work the brass. Just enough so you don't scratch the bullet when seating. Make a dummy round (no primer, no powder) try using less case mouth bell, seat a bullet 1.169" and just barely crimp it.

[ormondopen]

If you don't have new unfired cases, try a resized case, with no bell or crimp yet, just try it after resizing(no primer) and see if the case will go in the chamber.

unprimed, resized case drops in like a champ.

is it possible that the actual bullet might be a little larger than the .356 actual sizing?

Doubt it, the 124 bullets are pretty consistent. Next thing I would check is how much are you belling the cases? You might have too much or too deep and the crimp can't get rid of all of it. I just barely bell the case mouth probably less than 1/16", you don't need to over work the brass. Just enough so you don't scratch the bullet when seating. Make a dummy round (no primer, no powder) try using less case mouth bell, seat a bullet 1.169" and just barely crimp it.

no luck in either of my 2 9mm KKM's

worked fine in my case gauge and my stock glock barrel. actually all my rounds loaded out to 1.145 and longer have worked in the case gauge and stock barrel

?????????????

I guess my only options at this point is to have them re-throated to the correct dimension or just switch over to round nose bullets.

[HoMiE]

If it works in your stock barrel/case guage then I would say the KKM barrels are cut too short.

[Okie-Glocker]

OrmondOpen,

I know you guys are talking major 9mm but I have some insight...

On my Production G-34 with KKM "drop in" barrel, I had an issue with my long loaded rounds at first. After waisting a bunch of time dealing with KKM on the phone, I sent the barrel to a local custom shop and had them lengthen the throat ($25). The smith said it was indeed cut short at the KKM factory.

My standard Production load (minor of course) is with the Montana Gold 124gr JHP loaded out to 1.150" OAL. Could load a tad longer if I wanted. Point is, before I had this barrel modified, this load would not fully chamber as the bullet would get stuck in the rifling. Now my OAL length is only restricted by the Glock magazines.

Hope this helps,

Okie

Edited December 12, 2007 by Okie-Glocker

[ormondopen]

OrmondOpen,

I know you guys are talking major 9mm but I have some insight...

On my Production G-34 with KKM "drop in" barrel, I had an issue with my long loaded rounds at first. After waisting a bunch of time dealing with KKM on the phone, I sent the barrel to a local custom shop and had them lengthen the throat ($25). The smith said it was indeed cut short at the KKM factory.

My standard Production load (minor of course) is with the Montana Gold 124gr JHP loaded out to 1.150" OAL. Could load a tad longer if I wanted. Point is, before I had this barrel modified, this load would not fully chamber as the bullet would get stuck in the rifling. Now my OAL length is only restricted by the Glock magazines.

Hope this helps,

Okie

that is EXACTLY what is happening to me.

I am having Venry, from Radicial Precision Design build me a new upper and he is going to lenthen the throat in the barrel so my problems should be solved.

thanks for everyones help figuring out my problem.

[The Outsider]

Here's some info in your quest to run Open Major on a Glock...

I have a Briley gunsmith-fit barrel on my Open G17C. 6 port comp on the front and 4 popple holes that vent through the stock G17C cuts in the slide. I ran 125gr Zero JSP, 8.1gr HS6 @ 1.155" OAL (use data at your own risk). Chroned 10 rounds and it averaged at 169 PF. No adverse pressure signs, besides a little primer flow. Without the popple holes it should run above 170 PF. Just make sure you have good brass!

It's a stiff round, but very controllable. I've felt Yoshidex's super hot 115gr JHPs... a little too violent for me.

[yoshidaex]

oh come on! its not that bad. Man up and deal with it. 1550 fps is nothing.