bberkley Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 Many, many moons ago when I was a younger lad in the employ of Uncle Sam, I injured my back waterskiing. Since then I've periodically tweaked something back there which caused severe pain that I was able to work through, and get back to normal in a week or so. Back in 1999 it hit me really hard, and caused severe burning pain and numbness from my lower back all the way down the back side of my left leg to my 3 small toes. It took many months to get back to normal. Fast forward 7 years, and Monday this past week it flares again. Worst .... Pain .... Ever! Pain meds, muscle relaxers, and now prednisone, and I can still barely walk, stand, or sit for any duration. It has lessened somewhat, but the numbness is still there (and most likely will be for several months). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 I hope it pass soon man, be well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Run n Gun Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 I hope it pass soon man, be well. +1! Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 That kind of pain is horrible....hang in there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 Man I know exactly where you are coming from. I truly hope you get well soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Baier Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 Man I know exactly where you are coming from. I truly hope you get well soon. As I was reading this post earlier today I was in bed with a heating pad on my back. Brother, I feel your pain. Get well soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bberkley Posted March 17, 2006 Author Share Posted March 17, 2006 Thanks for all the support. What makes me hate it even more is that I've been on a workout plan and lost 15 pounds in the last 7 weeks, going to the gym 2 hours a day, 5 days a week. Now I've not been all week, but haven't put any of that weight back on (which is a good thing). I forsee yoga in my future (and probably a MRI when I can lay on my back for an hour without moving). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dunn Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 I don't know what kind of work up you have had. If it fails to improve you need to be evaluated by a spine surgeon and most likely get an MRI. No offense to primary care providers, but they can't read a spine MRI, and even radiologists miss a bunch of stuff a good spine guy will pick up on. Lot's of folks get tremendous relief with an epidural steroid injection or selective nerve root block, so don't worry about a good surgeon only recommending surgery. The good ones view it as a last resort. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 Yoga might really help. I had chronic severe back pain for many years. Started a stretching program - in a real serious way - helped enormously. Does not cost you a dime to try it...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chendersby Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 Read this book Healing Back Pain by Dr. John Sarno www.Healingbackpain.com Chris Endersby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bberkley Posted March 19, 2006 Author Share Posted March 19, 2006 Read this bookHealing Back Pain by Dr. John Sarno www.Healingbackpain.com Chris Endersby Read that the 1st time back in 1999. Pretty good read. Went and had a massage today, numbness is decreasing, pain is almost gone. The difference between 1999 and now is that I was prescribed Prednisone this time, last time was just pain killers and muscle relaxers. I'm gonna call the Spine Clinic Monday and go see a specialist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trey Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Brian, Hope you feel better. Our prayers are with you. Trey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
straightshooter1 Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 I have a similar problem but it is a muscule disease in the MD family. I have found massage by someone who can really work deep into the muscles is far better for pain relief than any of the muscle relaxers or pain medicenes. Hard part was finding someone who could do the type of massage I need rather that the relaxation type that the therapists usually offer. I found one and get the massage twice per week, helps me live a relatively normal life. Hope you get past this. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Many, many moons ago when I was a younger lad in the employ of Uncle Sam, I injured my back waterskiing. Since then I've periodically tweaked something back there which caused severe pain that I was able to work through, and get back to normal in a week or so.Back in 1999 it hit me really hard, and caused severe burning pain and numbness from my lower back all the way down the back side of my left leg to my 3 small toes. It took many months to get back to normal. Fast forward 7 years, and Monday this past week it flares again. Worst .... Pain .... Ever! Pain meds, muscle relaxers, and now prednisone, and I can still barely walk, stand, or sit for any duration. It has lessened somewhat, but the numbness is still there (and most likely will be for several months). I hear you. back pain is what God put here to show us what hell is like. I get various pinched and stressed nerves along my spine. As I type, I am unaware of the "normal" sensation I always have of my foot being dipped in hot water kind of feeling... and tingling in the toes. There is one nerve in my low back that (when tweaked) causes pain which can not be described..... sort of like getting hit by lightning. It's not like it hurts in one place, the pain is bigger than my whole body. All I can do is lay on the floor and blink my eyes, takes 6 - 8 weeks to get back to "baseline" pain from one of those. Interesting thing about pain that severe is that it causes a person to go immediately into shock.... you get pale and clammy and cold sweat and usually start puking. Ain't life fun? Yoga might really help. I had chronic severe back pain for many years. Started a stretching program - in a real serious way - helped enormously. Does not cost you a dime to try it...... Stretching is unquestionably the most dangerous thing any person with a back injury can do. Even under doctor's supervision, they had me doing "therapy" that was aggravating my condition. I started my own program of avoiding all: "Hey, that makes me worse you f---ing moron!" stretches, and went to a chiropractor. A good one can really help you. Kaiser and their Physical terrorists almost killed me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdragon Posted March 24, 2006 Share Posted March 24, 2006 The sciatic is a nerve, Nerves will not stretch. I have had the same trouble. Ivan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted March 24, 2006 Share Posted March 24, 2006 Yoga might really help. I had chronic severe back pain for many years. Started a stretching program - in a real serious way - helped enormously. Does not cost you a dime to try it...... Stretching is unquestionably the most dangerous thing any person with a back injury can do. Even under doctor's supervision, they had me doing "therapy" that was aggravating my condition. I started my own program of avoiding all: "Hey, that makes me worse you f---ing moron!" stretches, and went to a chiropractor. A good one can really help you. Kaiser and their Physical terrorists almost killed me. Thanks for that Dr. BH. I am sorry your stretching program did not work for you. Perhaps I should have added - YMMV. I go to a chiropractor at times when needed and feel mine does me a world of good. If you go, when you go, I would suggest you ask the Dr. what he feels about a stretching program. (insert shrugging shoulders icon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdragon Posted March 24, 2006 Share Posted March 24, 2006 Merlin, I will bet the weight that you lost helped you more than the stretch! Less stretch for the nerve! Ivan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted March 24, 2006 Share Posted March 24, 2006 For the record, the reason stretching is so dangerous: sciatica is the result of discs or disc material pushing into the sciatic nerve along the spine. Any motion that compresses the disc will aggravate it. Most stretches used to treat lower back will compress, anybody with back pain should only do wha are called "extension" motions which decompress the spine. The problem is that muscle spasms almost always accompany any type of spine or neck problem, and stretching the muscles provudes temporary relief from that source of pain.... usually at the expense of aggravating the underlying condition. "Hamstring" stretches can be particularly damaging because they invariably apply compression force to the discs in the low back. The single biggest reason why most back pain sufferers don't get relief from doctors is really pretty simple: the doctors don't know exactly what is causing the pain. And it's been my experience that chiropractors are more skilled at treating chronic back pain than doctors whose standard treatment is pills followed by physical therapy.... which can make the problem worse. Merlin,I will bet the weight that you lost helped you more than the stretch! Less stretch for the nerve! Ivan That is the greatest truth on earth, because the weight of the torso presses downward on the spinal column which stresses the discs. If you take weight off that down force, the discs are not so compressed. In my case, I can actually feel the sensation in my feet carrying something that weighs as little as five or ten pounds in my arms (pulled in tight to my chest). The added weight is enough to make the spinal compression push the disc out and touch the nerve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdragon Posted March 24, 2006 Share Posted March 24, 2006 Through out my Martial arts training (Along time ago) I would have trouble with my sciatic nerve. Always thought that "I Stretched it". It was my weight gain. Just my 2 pennys. I had a good PT that clued me in to me being fat! Ivan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill H Posted March 25, 2006 Share Posted March 25, 2006 I have had the chiropracter,the shots, the muscle relaxers and the thing that made me good to go was getting the deep tissue massage. I was twice a week then once a week now I am at once every 3 weeks but still feel great after the 3 weeks instead of intolerable pain. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bberkley Posted March 25, 2006 Author Share Posted March 25, 2006 Thanks for all the support guys. It really means a lot! I'm showing some improvement, still have lots of pain in the left foot and calf while standing/walking. Get these frequent pins/needles spasms across the bottom of my foot throughout the day which are sharp enough to get my undividided attention. I've been to a good chiropractor twice this week and have felt better each time, and last night I had my first deep-tissue massage with another scheduled for Monday before I see the chiropractor again. I saw a Spine doc yesterday afternoon, and came away with the distinct impression that he'll want to cut on me pending results of a MRI. I have some kind of disc injury at L5, its clearly about a third the size of my other discs on x-ray, but I don't have any historical x-ray pics to determine how big it should be in the first place, so I'm not sold on that just yet. PT hasn't been much but e-stim and moist heat, and generally doesn't help. Massage and chiropractic and the Prednisone have given me the most relief. I have stopped taking the pain meds and muscle relaxers. They didn't do much for my pain and I think the Percocet was causing me to not be "regular". I've continued to lose weight the past 2 weeks since I stopped working out when this flared up, which surprised me. I had lost 15 pounds in the 7 weeks since I started a workout program. I'm going to keep after the massage and chiropractic care for the time being. If the spine doc says: "Surgery" I'll go get a second opinion and my masseuse says she has a colleague that I would learn to love to hate and keep me off the operating table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 I saw a Spine doc yesterday afternoon, and came away with the distinct impression that he'll want to cut on me pending results of a MRI. Yep, their brain's are programmed: cut, cut, sew, sew, think, think. If you look at the long term studies, the surgery nearly always results in near-term reduction of pain, but long term worsening (and usually more sugeries). The surgery reduces the spine's flexibility in the vicinity of the "repaired" disc, which puts strain on the other discs above and below it. For the majority of cases, better long-term outcomes are obtained with non-surgical therapies. But, they require the patient to get religion and do the therapy. One situation which typically requires surgery is when nerve involvement reduces usefulness of the legs and muscles deteriorate. Other case is if the pain is unbearable and does not respond to coventional therapy. Good luck, do internet research, and IMHO: do every single thing otherwise possible before getting surgery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bberkley Posted March 29, 2006 Author Share Posted March 29, 2006 The results of my MRI are: Findings: The lumbar spine alignment and curavture are normal. No infiltrative marrow lesion or vertebral compression deformity is seen. The distal spinal cord is normal. There is degenerative disc disease isolated to the L5-S1 level with moderate disc space narrowing. There is a broad based left posterolateral disc protrusion with a superimposted moderate disc extrusion on the left side at this level with disc material descending along the posterior left aspect of the S1 vertebrae. Overall, there is only mild spinal canal compromise, however there is prominent effacement of the left lateral recess anhd left neural foramina at this level. No other sites of degenerative change are evident. Conclusion: Degenerative disc disease isolated to the L5-S1 level where there is both a broad based left posterolateral disc protrusion as well as a superimposed focal left disc extrusion of the left lateral recess at this level. The left lateral recess and left neural foramina are prominently compromised as a result. Any med types that can translate this for me? I have experienced significant strength loss in my left foot, ankle and calf over the past 2+ weeks, and the white-hot poker sensations in my foot are about to drive me crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dunn Posted March 30, 2006 Share Posted March 30, 2006 Yeah, you have a herniated disk that is putting pressure on the exiting nerve root. Sounds like it's time for surgery if the conservative stuff isn't working. Ask your doctor to show you the relevant MRI images and explain them, it helps to have an anatomical model handy so you can get a better idea of what's going on. I don't want to practice over the internet, but surgery has it's time and place. Sometimes it's the VooDoo with the better JuJu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdragon Posted March 30, 2006 Share Posted March 30, 2006 Thats sucks! Surgery! Ivanjava script:emoticon('', 'smid_11') smilie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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