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Dates for 2023

bradhe

By bradhe
in NRA - Bianchi Cup

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Lower40 Looks for Target

Lower40

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Reinholt said:

Question for those in the know, Do we now have two "Action Pistol" (what I would have labeled NRA Action Pistol) governing bodies?  

 

Same question here...but I suspect the NRA has thrown in the towel.  I rec'd a questionaire a couple months ago RE: changes I would like to see in the Bianchi Cup, ie. prizes vs trophies, days of the match, side events etc. now this news comes out.  Just signed up for a CMP membership.

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BaggerJoe Looks for Match

BaggerJoe

Posted
Posted

Registration is open here: https://ct.thecmp.org/app/v1/index.php?do=match&task=edit&match=23993

 

Rules are here: https://thecmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/2023-CMP-Action-Pistol-Rules.pdf

 

Rule "book" is 61 pages long so I haven't had time to go over it completely. Kinda looks like they went word for word with the NRA rules. There is a way to obtain a CMP classification, but they will honor your NRA class. Not anything different than we have been doing that is can see.  

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BaggerJoe Looks for Match

BaggerJoe

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 11/23/2022 at 2:04 PM, JSC said:

Joey, take a look at the Production Optic rules.  Can I shoot a revolver in that division now?

 I do not see anything in these rules specifically probiting a revolver, but Rule 4.2.7 is named Production Optical Pistol. In my world, pistol refers to a semi-auto and a revolver is a different type of handgun HOWEVER the entire 4.2.5 rule is titled Production Pistol and refers to revolvers in a few of the subsections, so I don't know.  It does say in rule 4.2.5c that revolvers are exempt from having to fit in the 'box' and 4.2.5f states that a revolver can have a 6" barrel. I would make damn sure of this before showing up with it though. I am not anywhere close to being the authority on this. These are just my interpretations. In other words, don't expect "But Joey said" to have any standing with the CMP!

 

As far as shooting the Plate match standing, it does state on Table 4 that the Position will be "Standing". In Table 2 (Practical) it states the position from 15, 25, and 50 yards to be "Standing or Prone", while in Table 5 (Moving Target) it shows the Position to be "Standing Only". These terms may need to be standardized and clarifications made. Having to shoot the plates standing the entire event would definately lower a lot of scores. Mine included! 

Edited by BaggerJoe
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Alan550 Finally read the FAQs

Alan550

Posted
Posted (edited)

I've waited for a while to weigh in on this stuff, but here goes.  After over 20 years competing in NRA Action  Pistol matches and running State and Regional matches, I know a bit about how things have been run. There are so many discrepancies in this list of new rules that it's hard to cover them all in a short post , but here's a try at that task.  Let's start with the rules in order of presentation.  New rules are in RED, and my responses are in black after the rules that I question.

 

2.2 Safe Pistol Condition
Pistols must be kept in a Safe Pistol Condition at all times except when they are
in use on a firing line and a Range Officer has instructed the competitor to LOAD
AND MAKE READY. Pistols in the Safe Pistol Condition are unloaded,
holstered, and comply with the following requirements, as appropriate:
a) Single-action revolvers must have the hammer fully down on an empty
chamber, unless equipped with a transfer bar.

Does this mean that single action revolvers are allowed?  There is a later stipulation that the Practical must be fired in double-action mode.

 

4.1.3 Safety Features
All factory standard safety features must be operable, except that M1911-
type pistol grip safeties may be disabled. 

This goes against the most recent NRA rules requiring that the grip safety be functional.  Not a bad rule in my opinion, but different from the current one in effect.

 

4.2.3 Metallic Sight Pistol
The pistol must have a minimum caliber of 9x19 mm. The pistol may be a semi-
automatic pistol with a maximum barrel length of 6.25 inches, and a maximum
sight radius of 8.5 inches or a revolver with a maximum barrel length of 6.25
inches, as measured from the forward edge of the cylinder, and a maximum
sight radius of 9 inches, as measured from the back of the rear sight to the
apex of the front sight.

Metallic Sight revolvers were allowed with the S&W 8 3/8" barrels in the past, so I guess they're outlawed here?


4.2.5 Production Pistol
A production pistol may be either a semi-automatic pistol or revolver that is or
has been a catalog item readily available to the public. Prototype and limited
production pistols are not permitted. Production pistols must comply with these
requirements:

f) Barrel. Barrels on semi-automatic pistols may not exceed 5.35 inches in
length; barrels on revolvers may not exceed 6.0 inches, as measured from
the forward edge of the cylinder.

There are catalog items that don't meet this rule either, especially revolvers.

 

4.3 Holsters
All pistols used in Action Pistol competitions must be carried in holsters that comply
with these rules. Competitors must begin each competition event with their pistol
in the holster in the Safe Pistol Condition and complete each event by returning
their pistol to the holster and a Safe Pistol Condition before they leave the firing
line.

This precludes putting the pistol into a shooting bag to leave the line.

 

4.6.5 Ground Cloth
A competitor may use a ground cloth when firing in the prone position. Any
ground cloth must be made of a single layer of material and not have any
special padding.

This takes away the Dillon shooting mats and others that shooters use differing from this rule that has been used at Bianchi for over 20 years.

 

4.7.2 Falling Plate Target
Each falling plate target shall be a round steel plate, eight (8)
inches in diameter. Plates should be cut from .375-inch (3/8
in.) steel. Plates must be mounted in groups of six (6), with
each plate one (1) foot from the adjacent target (center to
center), four (4) feet from ground level, as measured to the
bottom edge of the plates.

This means a complete reconstruction of plate racks across the country as the ones in use now are one (1) foot apart from edge to edge. The new configuration puts them 4 inches apart instead of 12 inches.

 

6.1.3 Ready (Start) Position
Competitors must start every firing series from the ready position. A
competitor in the ready position is standing upright with both hands held at
shoulder height.

This is later addressed in rule 6.2.2 d)

 

6.2.2 The Barricade Event
a) The Event. 48 shots, with four (4) stages, fired at 10, 15, 25, and 50
yards, with two (2) series of 6 shots in each stage.

50 yard Barricades?  That should be FUN!!

 

c) Barricades..... The barricade may be used for support.

A major change from NRA rules barring use of the barricade for support in Production and Metallic Sight categories.

 

d) Ready (Start) Position. The competitor stands in the firing area facing
the target with pistol holstered. After the command READY, the
competitor must place both hands on the barricade.

   Do fingertips count?  NRA rules say "palms against the barricade".

 

f) Firing Procedure. After shooting 6 shots from one side of the
barricade, the competitor shall reload, holster the pistol, and resume the
ready position. The Range Officer will then give the start signal for the
series to be fired from the other side of the barricade. After that series,
the competitor will reload, holster his pistol, and move back for the next
stage where this procedure will start again.

   Mandatory reload after each 6-shots?  Not necessary for double stack semi-autos, but required here!

 

6.2.3 The Falling Plate Event
e) Firing Procedure. After shooting the first series of 6 shots, the
competitor shall reload, holster the pistol, and resume the ready position
for the second series of 6 shots. The Range Officer will then give the
start signal for that series. After that series, the competitor will reload,
holster his pistol, and move back for the next stage where this
procedure will start again.

   Again, mandatory reloads after 6 shots fired.

 

 TABLE 4 specifies that all firing is done from STANDING on plates.

    No prone shooting allowed on Plates at any distance.

 

6.2.4 Moving Target Event
a) The Event. 48 shots, with four (4) stages at 10, 15, 20, and 25 yards,
with two (2) series of 6 shots in each stage.

   At 20 & 25 yards the shots are in 3 and 3 sequences, with 2 in each direction as it stands now.

 

g) Firing Procedure. After completing the right to left run, the competitor
must reload, holster their pistol, and assume the ready position for the
second left-right run. The Range Officer will release the target when the
competitor assumes the starting position. After that series, the competitor
will reload, holster his pistol, and move back for the next stage where this
procedure will start again.

f) Event Time Limit. The competitor has 7 ½ minutes to complete all four
stages of the event, starting with the LOAD AND MAKE READY
command for the first stage. After completing each stage, the competitor
must reload, holster their pistol, and move back to the next firing point.

  (f and (g are reversed and again there is the mandatory reload after 6 shots fired.

 

8.2 Prohibited Acts
a) Smoking or Vaping. Smoking or vaping is not permitted on event
ranges or firing lines.

   No smoking on the ranges?  You have to be kidding me!

 

Annex A – ACTION PISTOL SAFETY RULES AND PROCEDURES

• Prior to a start signal for a competitor to COMMENCE FIRE, the Range Officer
shall confirm that the competitor is ready by commanding
STANDBY...READY.

   Commands are reversed here, an obvious typographical error!

 

Edited by Alan550
Spacing between sections and grammar.
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Toolguy Beyond it All

Toolguy

Posted
Posted

I don't get why we needed a new rule book to begin with. Everyone was fine with the rules that were in place. If these rules are implemented, I can foresee a lot of unhappy campers. A lot of people may just quit or move to a different shooting sport.

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Alan550 Finally read the FAQs

Alan550

Posted
Posted

There's still much "cleanup" left to be done.  They still list the Bianchi Aggregate as 196 shots among other goofs.  48X4=192 when I went to school back in the dark ages!  LOL. 

 

Start position is still  listed as hands at shoulder height and they still require a reload after each 6-shot sequence. 

 

In any case our facility won't be signing onto CMP's rules any time soon.  Old habits never die and we've been at this game too long to have some Johnny-come-lately try to change the basics for their own naive wants and needs.

 

At least they corrected the dimensions on the plate racks and seem to be hearing from the older crowd on here and possibly other forums, I guess.  Good on them for that!!

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