Svi Imm Tribrid Bullets Hitting Comp(keyholing)

[DougCarden]

Rich, yes it sounds like it is simple reloading issues. No offense to Bobbyblaze, but one of my smiths told me years ago that he had to start giving his customers load data and loaded rounds to show them what and how to load. He told me of over a half dozen guns that he sent out 110% that wouldnt run for the customers, and he worked with them over the phone, asking them if they were loading the ammo to his specs, of course it was "yah, I know how load ammo"

Once he started telling them to send some ammo in that made his life better. The pure and simple fact is that these guns are high performance machines that have to be fed with ammo loaded correctly. An open gun is one of the worst offenders in this area. We take a lot of stuff for granted in reloading for our toys, but it is always a learning curve for everyone, I know I didnt think I had reloading issues until a high primer cost me $$$$ at Second Chance. I then became a student of Reloading, and continue to learn to this day.

It might be as simple as giving them loaded or dummy rounds to show OAL, crimp, and your load data you worked up, which I am sure you did. Good luck! DougC

[10mmdave]

Ya, what DougC says....

Another thought, do you have anyone close by who reloads for their open gun and loads

a load that you trust ?? Try that in the gun, maybe your just that good of a reloader

or load up some rnds to what the buyer was using ? do it your way with their powder

charge and see what happens.

And kudo's for taking the gun back, I'll remember your handle while looking thru the

classifieds.

DaveP

[XRe]

It baffles me how one could load in such a way as to cause impact on the comp, bullets to tumble, and such?? Maybe the use of plated bullets in the AET barrel? Or some otherwise bad batch of bullets? Seems like you'd *really* have to purposefully f... something up to cause that wide a variance...

Rich, did you see any evidence of bullets striking the comp when you got the gun back?

[TMC]

No offense to Bobby, but it could also be an issue with the way he is shooting the gun. There is so much pressure coming out of the hybrid ports before the bullet leaves the barrel it may be his grip consistency.

[XRe]

No offense to Bobby, but it could also be an issue with the way he is shooting the gun. There is so much pressure coming out of the hybrid ports before the bullet leaves the barrel it may be his grip consistency.

I certainly won't discount shooter skill as a reason why there aren't holes in paper!!!

He *did* claim he could see marks on the comp, though, so I was giving him the benefit of the doubt

[titandriver]

Thanks for the replies guys. I especially liked Chucks (Lawman) ! Think I'll just beat it into a plowshare Chuck!

I kinda glanced at the comp when I got it back and didn't see anything unusual so I loaded up ten rounds & shot 'em; fully expecting them to either tumble or hit the comp & disappear without hitting the target. Absolutely no signs of tumbling or hitting the comp. I load up twenty more and repeat, same result. I loaded up another fifty and repeat the test, no problems. So I load up forty more & have my wife video my shooting the last forty rounds, paying particular attention to the target. No tumbling, etc. So I think WTF? How is it possible?

I sent ten loaded rounds with the gun along with load data. After he reported problems I sent a thousand Zero 125 JHP's out of the same batch I had loaded for him to try. That's why I wondered about reload error. He did say he tried other peoples loads & loaded ammo with the same poor results so I am at a total loss here!

Keep those answers coming, one of 'em's gotta be right!

[10mmdave]

I forgot all about my dealing's with my Tribrid, I have one of the older 32 inch twist non-

AET versions in a full length 6 in slide, no added comp with the Optima cut on the back.

I bought mine for steel loads, lemme tell ya, didn't work for me, AND I shot a ton of plated

bullets thru it at 120 pf but 30 foot accuracy was like 3-4 inches. Switch to a jacketed and

that shrunk to half that but at 60 feet (sight in for steel challenge distance) I was still getting

4 inch groups. I probably have 2K of test loads tru this thing.

Anyways, not until I made up a load for IPSC major did I finally get a great, and I mean

quarter or half dollar size group at 25 yards

And 88 grn Rem JHP @ 1350-1400 is GREAT 9 pin load little loud but flat shooting !

Anyways, good luck on your search for an answer.

Maybe list what the buyer was loading to/with and you might get some answers, or more

questions

[XRe]

I kinda glanced at the comp when I got it back and didn't see anything unusual so I loaded up ten rounds & shot 'em;

...

I sent ten loaded rounds with the gun along with load data. After he reported problems I sent a thousand Zero 125 JHP's out of the same batch I had loaded for him to try. That's why I wondered about reload error. He did say he tried other peoples loads & loaded ammo with the same poor results so I am at a total loss here!

Wasn't clear that you'd forward ammo and bullets, too... Hmmm...

If it *is* a 1:32" twist barrel, and the loads aren't hot enough that bobbyblaze was loading, 10mmdave's thoughts may be spot on - the bullet may not be spun up enough to be stabilized. I hadn't considered that. A 1:24" AET barrel shouldn't be quite as sensitive to that, but.... I agree with Dave, what load specs were being used for the ammo that showed tumbling?? We should have asked that earlier in this thread, but....

Other than something like that, if there's no mechanical issues in play, there's one other variable... and that's the guy behind the gun. How he'd cause bullets to tumble, I have no clue... but missing the paper and all that, yeah...

[Harmon]

I have a SV with the 32 inch twist hybrid that tumbles bullets now and then.

clean the barrel and it will shoot straight for 4-500 rds

once it gets fouled, it goes back to tumbling..the prob with my gun is its probably close to worn out.

god knows how many 180 power factor Accurate arms # 7 loads from the past three owners and then the use I have put on it myself.

Once i get my new gun back from TRIPP, ill have a inexpensive( as cheap as i can get and still be OK) upper built and use it as a backup gun.

Something like a STI slide, KKM barrel and EGW cnc 3 port comp..I dont think ill ever go with a schuemann barrel again...some folks have good luck with em, i havent.

[TMC]

I had a 5" Tribrid that had a burr in one of the hybrid port that couldn't beed seen with the naked eye. It gave me fits with shotgun pattern accuracy, key holeing and the like. I finally sent it back to Wil who found the burr. Just a little reaming and it was cured.

[Shoepop]

Bobby, I don't shoot open much and just ran across your post. My post will not help you with your stike problem but FYI. I have an SV IMM with barrel/comp EXACTLY like yours. Folks have been asking why .356 bullets. Well just to share something with forum members. I was having trouble making PF (US165) using 3N38 and ANY jacketed .355 bullet. I phoned Shuemann (about a year ago) and got to speak to Mr. Shuemann. He advised me to use a .357 bullet! May things were explained to me in detail about the barrel/comp combination @ the time but I'm old and memory is short. I had a bulk box of .357 Hornady 125gr HP/XTP's so I loaded a few and made PF no problem (I do know why) no pressure, bullet strike problems and accuracy was excellent. Anyway, after I had used that lot of 3N38 and about 1500 of the .357's I purchased a new lot of 3N38 and decided to try the .355 again since I had a boat load, made PF no problem with .355's and 10.8 3N38. Accuracy was just as good. I'm still using .355's. Subsequent lots of 3N38 have been + or - a tenth to get me around 169PF. Yes, I did reduce powder charge with the .357's.

[bgary]

Yes on the reloading, no on the altitude and atmosphere. What you have there is a cursed gun. Ideally you should just unload it as soon as possible before the curse gets onto your other guns and stankifies them.

I don't know what the process is for consideration as a "post of the month", but... man, someone has to submit this one. It is priceless (well, not technically true, he did offer $1)

Bruce

[titandriver]

Dadnabit BGary, how can it be priceless if'n I gotta send 'im a buck PLUS shipping? Kind of a moot point since I tried to beat it into a plowshare and ended up with a pruning hook! De-stankify that one Kansas Lawdog!

[jjanglin]

Well Guys:

I seriouly doubt that a load problem would cause a gun to shoot that much off

3-4 inch groups maybe.

The end of the barrel (crown) could have had carbon& lead in the first port being

pushed up just a nano hair each time it was fired.and cause this problem.

I purposely loaded ammo messed up over the years just to see what these guns

will do so I can help shooters out.

The first thing Id do is take the comp of and make sure its got a proper crown

and is smooth, a rough crown can cause what I said above.

And a hotter load may clean it out some to shoot ok.

I say may) . It should be looked at by a smith who knows how to trouble

shoot a firearm.

All this load stuff is confusing and a waste of time to the average shooter=dont

get me wrong guys but some shooters just have a time with some stuff.

Since this has caused such a fuss and a lot of posts Ill look the gun over for just

the cost of shipping and report my findings to you all.

Merry Christmas!

Jim/Pa

Sailors custom

[XRe]

Jim - that's a very generous offer, and that was the solution many of us recommended a while back - send it to a competent smith. But... sounds like the gun groups fine for Rich?? Your statements back up my thinking... awful long stretch for an ammo problem...

Sure is a wierd problem - would be easier if we could get the gun, Bobby, and Rich all in the same room with us, and hash it out

[titandriver]

JJ --- a very generous offer indeed, thank you. I have absolutely no accuracy, tumbling, or bullets hitting the comp problems with the gun. I can send a copy of the video to anyone who wants it so you can see for yourself. It is taped from beginning to end without interuption so there is no "doctoring" of the tape possible. Next best thing to my being in the room!

Since the comp is sweated on I'm thinking it would not be easily removed and then put back on. I only added to this topic about reloads because it is the only thing I can think of that is different between my results and Bobby's.

Thanks again!

[10mmdave]

I only added to this topic about reloads because it is the only thing I can think of that is different between my results and Bobby's.

Thanks again!

And as someone stated earlier, the only real difference between the groups was the

driver.

Jim/Pa mentions crowns and such but to go from one shooter getting bad groups to

another shooter getting good groups there's only 2 things that have changed.....

The shooters and the loads being shot !

Good luck TitanDriver, you've got a mystery on your hands.

[Flexmoney]

Over-crimp...cutting into the jacket/plating???

[eric nielsen]

Overcrimp is one of the things I mentioned to Rich in a pm. Also this:

Not belling new brass enough will frequently result in shaving the last few hundreds of an inch of jacket off - the excess can roll up just forward of the case mouth. That sort of thing happening to a bullet, one that's gonna be fired past 9 consecutive barrel ports - that could be bad.

I had looked at buying that IMM from Rich a while back, so this is an interesting thread.

I took a long look at the barrel crown of the Springfield/STI that I did buy. The comp was leaded pretty heavy as can be expected from a well-used gun. Thought about removing the comp [but didn't] just to get at it. Cleaning the crown of my Glock barrels had often helped shrink the group the size of those guns. With the Springfield, I just picked at it until the crown looked pretty good [with a flashlight] and that shrank the groups from 3.5" to 2" and then switching bullets [to a Zero 115 JHP] got the groups to 1.25" & that's fine.

[jjanglin]

Hey All:

Just thought Id help out+Maybe I would have learned something=allways

willing to do that. Over crimping and using exposed base bullets will

certainly cause a problem,I have seen crimping to much pull the jackets

apart which can screw up the crown.Also if ya get a piece stuck in the

comp really screws things up.

Only crimp enough to make a slight impression on the bullet=do two

or three before you start loading to see if ya are still where you need to be.

Anytime Fellas

Jim/PA

Sailors