650 Newbie Questions

[Steve Anderson]

Got the 650 setup finished yesterday and cranked out 500 rds with a few issues...

1. Why am I bending decapping pins? I bent two in the one 500 rd session?

2. The brass sometimes does not get fully inserted into the shellplate. Is there an adjustment for this? Every 50 or so one will jump the ramp of the inserter and go flying...

(It does seem to be connected to handle movement, as I was experimenting with how fast I could load.)

3. It hangs a little every 20 or so rds on the decapping station...I can wiggle it through the tight spot and then it works normally. Maybe all 3 of these are related?

4. Are there any tuning adjustments that need to be done to a new 650 for smooth operation? I read all the threads I could find and followed the manual.

Thanks,

[ChuckS]

Steve,

I never bent a decap pin on a 650 so I can't help you there. It does seem that there is probably a relationship in all 3. Did you have cases in each position as you tightened the die locknuts? All I can figure is that things are slightly out of alignment and the pin gets bent slightly each op until it really bends.

As for the case feeder I think there was some discussion on cleaning and lubing the track for the feed thing. Do some more forum searching. Keep track of what shell plate slot it happens on. It may be a burr on the shellplate. I had occasional failure of the fishished round to eject into the bin. I finally noticed that it was always in the same slot. The burr combined with an slight extractor scar on used brass was the combo that caused the jamb. I hit the edges lightly with a file and all is well.

Have fun,

Chuck

[GuildSF4]

What caliber are you reloading?

On 45 I have no issues with feeding into station 1, on .40 I have to tap one in about every 40 or so rounds (if I don't... bye bye decapping pin), 38 super is worse than .40 for me.

The way I address these is I check the brass feed on the down stroke, and tap the case in if needed. (My reloader is set up for standing, so I can see the powder level at station 3 and then check the brass feed.)

Also there is a note somewhere about alignment of the platform which may require a gig from Dillion.

(Chuck S makes a good point also.)

[Steve Anderson]

it

is

not

going

well.

[BigDave]

Are you certain you are using the correct shell plate?

You have to be certain that you are pressing the handle all the way forward (at the top of the stroke) to push the brass all the way into the shell plate.

Is the hang up you are experiencing during decapping (handle down) or when you are seating the primer (handle up)?

As far as overall smooth operation, I lube the bottom of the shell plate and ram generously with slide glide, especially the detent ball. I've heard of people clipping half of a coil off of the detent ball spring, but I've never done it myself.

[Nik Habicht]

Ask Flex to come over for dinner ---- and to fix the press/teach you how to reload. Without more info, it's difficult to diagnose what might be mechanically wrong. What does concern me is the experimentation with speed ---- my experience with Dillon autoindexing presses has been that how smoothly you move the handle has a great affect on the quality of the ammo and on how annoying your reloading sessions get.....

Smooth first, let the speed come naturally. You'll be cranking out 600-800/hour before you know it......

[Gun Geek]

Steve:

It sounds like the Insert Slide needs some adjustment. This is the thing that pushes the case into the shell plate.

It is very easy to adjust the press so that this does not push far enough in. Bending decapping pins is a sure sign that the case is not correctly positioned.

There is some instruction on page 39 of the manual. Page 52 and 53 have exploded dagrams of the stuff you need to mess with.

Here's a quick overview:

1) Put live primers into the feed system.

2) Put a shell in to the plate at station 1, raise the ram, decap and size that case.

3) Cycle the press so that the case moves over to station 2 (don't seat the primer yet)

4) Put another case into station 1, make sure it is fully inserted

5) Now push the handle forward so that the primer is seated into the case at station 2 - hold the handle forward.

6) Adjust the camming pin so that the slide just touches the case in station 1. To do this, back the pin out so that the slide rests completey against the case (not the pin). There will be a slight gap between the pin and the cam.

7) Run the pin down so that it just pushes the slide away from the case. Ideally you want the slide just touching the case, but you don't want it pushing too hard because the case will be cocked a little and can hang on the mouth of the sizing die (usually a crushed case).

The problem is that people (uhh me) adjust the slide with out primers in the system. The handle can go forward (and the ram move) slightly farther. The primer stops this movement a little short and so the cases don't go all the way into the plate.

Hope this helps

Geek

[Gulf690]

I have no doubt you'll get some excellent advice from this forum, but a call to Dillon on their free number might be a quicker way to resolve your problems.

gulf

[Flexmoney]

Steve,

Before you throw it away...I'll give you $100 for it.

[Flexmoney]

BTW...and, this has nothing to do with the problems, really...speed on the 650 is just ike everything else. Smooth is fast...trying is slow.

[9x23]

It could be operator inexperience. I'm writing a book to help with reloading.

You grab the handle on the press and stroke it smoothly (no cases, bullets or

powder), just go through the motions of reloading. Set an imaginary bullet and

stroke the handle.... We call it dry-loading. The book will be called " Not

so refined, but very repetitious. The Monotony of Reloading"

500 strokes of the handle per hour is a good starting point.

Sorry SA, I just couldn't resist.

p.s. Don't forget to dry feed the primer tubes. No machines, hand feed only.

[Steve Anderson]

Nice.

I switched it over to 38 supercomp and it's going much, much better.

maybe the mixed 9mm brass I was using before was contributing to inconsistency? It's all starline all the time and working nicely.

I still get some that don't get inserted but that may be operator related. I'm learning the value of a good smooth stroke.

btw, I didn't suffer in silence. I yelled. A lot.

Akro bins shatter when stomped.

SA

[herky]

Flex, go help him. I would do it, but my Dillon is like me, an older generation. Purchased long before those fancy 650s. Maybe he should get the video.

Have fun,

[Flexmoney]

Mike,

I don't know if I can help him or not. My 650 doesn't digest 9mm well either. (I use the Lee 4 die set as opposed to Steve's Dillong dies.)

I have issues with 9mm brass in Station 1 not going into the sizing die with proper alignment (meaning, they don't want to go in at all sometimes).

That is just with 9mm, with 40 (and the Lee 4 die set) I spit ammo out of the 650 like Dillon MiniGun. (I do go twice at fast with 40 as I do with 9mm...at least.)

What has helped my 9mm loading is the NOT tighten the set screw for the bolt that holds the shell plate. And, removing at least on of the pins that hold the tool head in position...giving it a little bit of play.

[.40AET]

(I use the Lee 4 die set as opposed to Steve's Dillong dies.)

I'm using the same Lee setup for 9mm & .40. I was having problems in station 1 also when I changed to 9mm. I set everything up as the directions and advice said to. Same problems continued.

I changed the case insert slide to push a case all of the way in without touching the adjustment post at all. I also have tension on the station 2 loacator tab. Both of these things seem to cut down on jams. I use mixed cases and the only problems I have are with crimped in primers. When I use cases that have all been through my gun the press works as fast as it does for .40.

Good luck.

[Rico567]

I discovered that those things in the XL650 manual are there for a reason:

1) Loading standing up is best.

2) Go for a speed no faster than two seconds for a complete cycle of the press. ("A-thousand-one" for the downstroke, "A-thousand-two" for the upstroke)

3) Always (and this applies to any press) be certain to do a complete stroke, in both directions.

When I practiced these until they became habitual, everything runs smooth as silk.

...& I agree with what "Gun Geek" said above about the case slide adjustment and its relation to your problems. If the XL650 has a weakness -and it's easily cured by just loading long runs- it's that the setup when one changes calibers is involved, and some adjustments are crucial.

[dansy]

Humm same here with the 9mm it's not working as well as the 40SW.....what I did was to reshape the opening on the shellplate slightly with my dremel....it did help a lot, now it's sort of smooth.....I guess will never be as smooth as with 40SW!

When I get told to slow down....well it depend on how much time you have to reload....and how manyround you shoot per week....if I had time and didn't shoot a lot...I wouldn't have a 650 I'm actually looking toward the 1050......

[PistolJim]

Steve,

What happened to the 1050? I remember you used to use one.

Jim

[old shooter]

I know this is not a cure all, but if I have my 650 set up per the instructions, I also have problems with the 9mm cases going smoothly into the sizing die. I now have my shell place slightly loose, and instead of just setting the bullet on the case (in stn 4), I push down with the bullet and in effect slightly tilt the shell plate and this makes sizing the 9mm's much easier (on my reloader anywhay).

Mike

[9x23]

Are you guys using the .223 shellplate for the 9mm?

If you use the .38 Super shellplate it will cause that problem.

Sorry I don't remember the shellplate #'s.

[dansy]

9x23 My listing show the same shellplate number for both the 38super and 9mm / 9x21, now I'm not aware of a different one for 9mm.....my shellplate was with a 9mm conversion kit.

[9x23]

I'm sorry dansy, I let this thread slip by me.

Try using shellplate #3 for 9mm, 9x21, 9x23, 38sc and 38tj instead of #5.

If you're running #3 it won't allow a standard 38super into the shellplate.

Locator pins are still #3.

Sorry for the delayed response.

9x

[dansy]

9X23, Thank for the tips I will try it....since I just got a #3 shellplate(.223) for my 38 TJ for my new gun's due in April the #5 is the one coming with caliber change (9mm, 38 SA) I'm also running the Lee dies for the 9mm instead of the Dillon's that I run for both the 40 and 38TJ

[9x23]

Same setup I'm running, Lee's and #3 shellplate.

It's been working flawlessly for several years.

It helps sort out the Super's from the rimless, if

I miss a couple with the hand sorting.

Good luck with the new irons and the press.

[Dream]

Mine had a breakin at around 8000 rounds,

after then everything works fine.