USPSA Area 8: CZ-SP01 Produciton Gun Bumped to Open

[vixty]

I don't think it was ever said what sight is installed on this gun

[alma]

I don't think it was ever said what sight is installed on this gun

No, but I have heard of others having troubles with the HAJO since it's so tall.

http://czcustom.com/czshadowcomprearhajo.aspx

[GrumpyOne]

As a point of clarification, the MD did not respond as it is not his job.

I responded as RM and observed the process. The gun with magazine did not fit.

The box was an EGW manufactured box which is the authorized manufacturer for USPSA. EGW makes quality products and has done so for decades.

It is interesting that CZ knows the box was wrong when they were not present.

As far as the "tough nuggies" comment it was not made. I always try to treat the shooter with respect regardless. I would not want someone to make a snide comment to me in such a situation and I don't do it to others.

Those that know Gary know what he says is true.

[Youngeyes]

Gary Stevens treats all shooters, that I have witnessed, with respect. In some cases, he seems more upset with informing a shooter about a violation than the shooter does. He examines all evidence and rules before he makes a call. He would be the first source that I would use to ask a rule question. YMMV, but I doubt it.

[LilBunniFuFu]

Hell I weight my PROD, SS guns on two different scales before I plan on taking them. And don't even get me started on chronoing.

Please, start!

I try to chrono on 3 different machines, if I don't I bump my charge by .1 grains for that match ammo usually. Hell I didn't have time to do this for GA state this past weekend so my .45 loads came in at 180.4 PF. Not going to spend that much time and effort to mess something up. The six P's come in handy.

But with regards to this topic. I have RO'ed for Gary before. He is an honest RM and will go out of his way to vouch for the shooter and always treats them with respect, even when the shooter gets a little hot headed. Trust me on that.

Edited September 2, 2015 by LilBunniFuFu

[Beastly]

Are you using an 'extra' tall front sight and having to adjust the rear sight higher than usual, making the rear sight to base pad distance too long?

[teros135]

Could the OP measure the gun (preferably with a caliper) and give us the dimension from the top of the rear sight to the bottom of the grip? Those who have the SP01 can then compare that to the same dimension on guns that have the stock (fixed) sight and the adjustable sight (which is milled deeper into the slide than the stock fixed rear sight). I'll bet the dimension on the gun in question is significantly larger, and when combined with the stock 18-rd mag's base pad puts it over the limit.

The USPSA Production gun list has the various CZs, including the SP01, SP01 Shadow, and Accu-Shadow listed, but it doesn't mention "SP01 with HAJO rear sight", just the gun itself. It's sounding like the HAJO sight is a problem.

[teros135]

Hell I weight my PROD, SS guns on two different scales before I plan on taking them. And don't even get me started on chronoing.

Please, start!

I try to chrono on 3 different machines, if I don't I bump my charge by .1 grains for that match ammo usually. Hell I didn't have time to do this for GA state this past weekend so my .45 loads came in at 180.4 PF. Not going to spend that much time and effort to mess something up. The six P's come in handy.

Good idea to use several chronos. Although matches often use the CED Millennium II, some of those are good, some bad, and the manufacturer seems to want to blame the bad ones on "excessive muzzle blast" - even with a minor-PF handgun (or a pellet gun) and even with a blast screen. Mine pooped out just before Area 8 and I was fortunate to have a friend loan me his PACT (15+ yrs old, did great).

[BeerBaron]

This is one area where I believe IPSC rules have it right over USPSA.

for IPSC production your gun does not have to fit the box.

they have a list of guns that are approved for production division.

they have a (small) list of modifications that are approved for production

you may use aftermarket or OEM mags but not heavy bases (capacity is limited to 15 so there's no arms race in mags anyway).

you may use any non-electronic sights you like but you may not mill the slide to fit them

so basically providing gun is on the list and you don't do any 'non compliant' mods you are fine. it saves issues like this happening. in this case the guy is not really gaining any advantage. he's in a 10 round division so length of his mags is really only an ease of reload thing. sights are free so who cares really which sight he has. so given basically only sights and mags/mag bases can effect his gun fitting the box it really should be a non-issue.

i totally agree it sounds like the rules were applied correctly but I can certainly sympathise with the shooter who has an otherwise PD compliant gun, drove a long way to a match and is now shooting an SP01 in open.....

perhaps USPSA needs to look at whether or not the box is needed for PD? you can keep out the crazy long guns etc with 'the list' anyway so box is really counter productive in PD.