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I Need Advice...147 Gr & Titegroup


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crimp to 2x the case wall thickness + bullet diameter

i was using berry's 147gr. plated bullets

and winchester cases

cases are .12x2 = 24

24 + .355 =.379

my crimp was ending up .377 - .378

oal is 1.150

titegroup 3.5gr

ES: 14.25 SD:

6.24

2in groups at 15 yds

PF 137

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I'm loading range 9mm brass with 147 gr X-Treme bullets and I'm pretty happy with the grouping (I haven't measured though). They are through a G34 with a 13 lb ISMI spring.

I'm loading:

3.3 gr Titegroup

Win SP Primers

OAL: 1.160

.378 after flare removed

My chrono results:

976

958

957

953

956

Avg: 960

ES: 23

SD: 9

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Shooting the same loadings as Shotdown witht the exception of 3.2 grs and coated 147's.

Chrono results basically the same (135 PF)

I would seat a little longer 1.160 and see if that helps out

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I shot a test load a few weeks back with 3.2 gr of TG with the .356 diameter 147gr xtremes at 15 yards and got .75in grouping with 10 bullets. The OAL was 1.150 and mixed brass with CCI primers.

These were shot out of a Glock 34 Gen 4 with 13lb ISMI spring.

Edited by FireNHole
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I ordered a pro chrono digital. In not going to shoot any more ammo until I get it.

I'm loading some rounds at 1.170 because they passed a plunk test in my gun.

Will they fit and feed from your mags?

1.170" is over SAAMI max for 9mm of 1.169"

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Do you get similarly poor accuracy with other powders and the same bullet/OAL?

The only other thing I can think to check on might be some of Xtreme's .357 diameter rather than the .356, if that's what you're using.

The only powder I've tried is Titegroup. I have 8 lbs of it. Factory ammo seems to group okay.

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A different powder would probably help you narrow down whether it's the bullet or the powder, since factory ammo (unless you bought it from Freedom, which uses Xtreme plated bullets in a bunch of their stuff) will likely not use the exact same profile of bullet even if it's the same weight. Whether you'd notice a difference between the Xtreme 147 and factory 147s, I'm not sure, since there are many factors that can contribute to poor accuracy. Do you have any factory 147 available or was it just the 115s and 124s you mentioned earlier?

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A different powder would probably help you narrow down whether it's the bullet or the powder, since factory ammo (unless you bought it from Freedom, which uses Xtreme plated bullets in a bunch of their stuff) will likely not use the exact same profile of bullet even if it's the same weight. Whether you'd notice a difference between the Xtreme 147 and factory 147s, I'm not sure, since there are many factors that can contribute to poor accuracy. Do you have any factory 147 available or was it just the 115s and 124s you mentioned earlier?

I don't have any factory 147 gr bullets to try. I haven't seen them in any local stores for a very long time. I could order some online, but it seems pointless to buy 1 box online for testing purposes.

My chrono will be in later this week. I will do some testing over the chrono to see what I'm getting. I'm also going to tighten up the diameter at the mouth of the case .002" & see it that helps at all.

Edited by AdvocatusDiaboli
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One way to get rid of that is to JB weld the hole of the seating stem on the Dillon Die. You'll have to use a bullet so that epoxy forms to the bullet.

I saw a post on this, but the guy who did it stated that it was a permanent thing (you couldn't flip the seating stem anymore). Got any advice on how to do this while still being able to flip the stem?

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i noticed this thread yesterday and immediately thought about you.

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=196144&hl=%2Bxtreme+%2Bbullets#entry2174855

Thank you! Unfortunately, I'm sitting on 3600 of these.

I'm not new to reloading... just new to reloading 9mm. I've never had so much trouble getting accuracy before. Usually, with my rifles, I can have a sub moa load in less than 150 rounds. I'm already double that with my 9mm and still no clear direction to go.

On a side note, I was at the range last weekend and saw another shooter using blue bullets. No smoke whatsoever. He said the accuracy has been great and he prefers them over the bbi.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I may be on to something here.

3.2 grains Titegroup

1.170 OAL

.379 diameter.

All shots 15 yards, 10 shot groups.

1st group (from L to R) chrono results

High 974

Low 925

Average 948

2nd group chrono results

High 976

Low 929

Avg 953

I did notice that all test loads seemed to tighten up significantly when I changed the diameter from .381 to .379.

post-52843-0-66503700-1402081482_thumb.j

post-52843-0-66348200-1402081493_thumb.j

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measure some factory rounds and you will find that they use an even tighter crimp. many measure .375- .377. i would tighten up the crimp a little and see what happens. Also, have you tried loading a full mag with the 1.17 ammo. many times long ammo will work the first few rounds, but get stuck in the mag the further they go down

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I loaded the mags with 10 rounds for the test groups. There were no issues. These are plated bullets. Are factory rounds with a diameter of .375 using plated bullets or jacketed?

My bullet diameter is .355. The brass thickness is .012 x 2 = .024. Thus total diameter should be .379. Any tighter and I will be scuffing the bullet plating. Do you recommend that?

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Not sure if this helps, but here's my load data for Titegroup with X-treme 147gr RN CP .356" diameter, WSP, 1.150-1.155" OAL. M&P Pro. All data points are 10-round averages.

Charge / FPS / PF

2.6 / 794.9 / 116.9

2.8 / 816.8 / 120.1

3.0 / 871.5 / 128.1

3.2 / 911.8 / 134.0

3.4 / 927.6 / 136.4

3.6 / 984.4 / 144.7

Best fit line

FPS = 188.6 * Grains + 299.84

Grains = (FPS - 299.84) / 188.6

So I use 3.1gr to get 885 FPS / 130 PF.

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One way to get rid of that is to JB weld the hole of the seating stem on the Dillon Die. You'll have to use a bullet so that epoxy forms to the bullet.

I saw a post on this, but the guy who did it stated that it was a permanent thing (you couldn't flip the seating stem anymore). Got any advice on how to do this while still being able to flip the stem?

It is permanent but I'm able to flip my stem. Maybe that person over did it with the JB weld and now can't flip it. It only needs a little bit of JB weld in the hole, then lightly oil the tip of the bullet and then put the stem on top of the bullet as straight as possible. the JB weld will conform to the shape of the tip of the bullet. I use both Berry's and X-Treme and have no issues. I did not seal the opposite side of the stem since I don't use it.

F8408798-AE54-4E58-A346-35566DBECD0E_zps

BA3223ED-537C-44E1-A661-2ECDF45B3267_zps

Hard to see but the left bullet had a ring on the tip before I used the JB weld. The one on the right is after the JB Weld.

8E0951D7-5344-4BCB-A25D-1C305047D8B3_zps

Edited by shotdown
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