1911 CC Pointers ?

[PatriotMac]

Considering a different Concealed carry option. I'm big enough that I can comfortably carry and conceal a Beretta 92FS in the winter and I carry a GLOCK G26 in an IWB holster in the summer when I'm wearing shorts and light T shirt. The wife is letting me buy another gun and I have always been intruiged by the 1911 platform although I must admit I don't have much experience with it. Here are a few questions I have.

1. Is it a good option for concealed carry option and what are any drawbacks or advantages?

2. What are some opinions on locked and cocked carry?

(I have to admit I'm still trying to wrap my mind around locked and cocked carry as I frequently find that I have unintentionally bumped the safety off safe several times with my 92FS and did not realize it until the end of the day)

3. Would a Commander style/compact 1911 be a better option?

(I would like to use the gun primarily for concealed carry but may want to use it for IDPA as well so I dont know if the Compact 1911 would be a huge drawback for that)

4. My top end to spend right now would be around 800.00 so would I be able to get a reliable 1911 Commander in that price range?

Thanks in advance for any input....especially concerning the Locked & Cocked carry concerns....

[chirpy]

I'm a big guy and I carry a lightly modified Colt LW Officers ACP. Not that difficult to control with SD loads either. I use it for IDPA occasionally just as I do other carry guns. Never had the ts disengage but that doesn't mean it can't happen. Many CCW holders choose a 1911 and others prefer _______ (you fill in the blank). Many companies make Commander length 1911's...take your pick, can't go wrong as far as I am concerned.

JMHOFWIW

Richard

[polizei1]

I would highly suggest heading over to 1911 Addicts, the link is in my sig.

Finding a commander or CCO for $800 will be next to impossible. I would look into STI (specifically the Guardian), but most "good quality" commander/CCO 1911's will be ~$1,500+.

Edited November 27, 2013 by polizei1

[EkuJustice]

Check out the officer and commander sized sti Spartans. Nice gun especially for the price. It's a utilitarian finish but the price is right and it's a well made gun

[2MoreChains]

The Beretta has an ambi-safety, right? So when it gets bumped off, is it the right side hitting something or is the side of your body flipping it off?

For competition I like ambi-safeties on my 1911/2011's but for carry I stick with a single sided safety (assuming you are right handed). A good holster that has a sweat shield with the thumb safety molded into the leather (or kydex) will also prevent the safety from coming off while in the holster.

My preference for carry 1911's is the Officer frame size with 4" slide, but I have also carried a 5" 1911 on occasion. The holster makes a big difference.

[PatriotMac]

The Beretta has an ambi-safety, right? So when it gets bumped off, is it the right side hitting something or is the side of your body flipping it off?

For competition I like ambi-safeties on my 1911/2011's but for carry I stick with a single sided safety (assuming you are right handed). A good holster that has a sweat shield with the thumb safety molded into the leather (or kydex) will also prevent the safety from coming off while in the holster.

My preference for carry 1911's is the Officer frame size with 4" slide, but I have also carried a 5" 1911 on occasion. The holster makes a big difference.

That's a good point. With the holster I use the inside safety is fully covered so I assume I'm bumping the outside ambi safety. I like it that way because I have popped it off safe a few times when I had a feeling a situation was heading south....Thankfully it stayed holstered. You do make a good point that I am less likely to "bump" a 1911 with the safety on one the inside only. That would give me more confidence in Cocked and locked carry.

[Frank34]

I've carried a lightweight commander, or a variant of one, in a Milt Sparks executive IWB holster for over 20 years. The 1911 is a great carry gun because it is so thin. I always carry a spare magazine in a IWB pouch and the thinness of the magazine keeps things comfortable. I've never had a problem with the ambi thumb safety coming off while carrying but on a carry gun you want to keep them on the small side. For around $800 try a used Kimber Pro CDP. Or the STI Spartan which is a hell of a value. Don't really worry about absolutely having to get an aluminum framed gun, the 1911 guns carry so well the extra weight is not that big of an issue. One of the guys I work with never leaves home without his Springfield Operator.

[jmbaccolyte]

The Beretta has an ambi-safety, right? So when it gets bumped off, is it the right side hitting something or is the side of your body flipping it off?

For competition I like ambi-safeties on my 1911/2011's but for carry I stick with a single sided safety (assuming you are right handed). A good holster that has a sweat shield with the thumb safety molded into the leather (or kydex) will also prevent the safety from coming off while in the holster.

My preference for carry 1911's is the Officer frame size with 4" slide, but I have also carried a 5" 1911 on occasion. The holster makes a big difference.

That's a good point. With the holster I use the inside safety is fully covered so I assume I'm bumping the outside ambi safety. I like it that way because I have popped it off safe a few times when I had a feeling a situation was heading south....Thankfully it stayed holstered. You do make a good point that I am less likely to "bump" a 1911 with the safety on one the inside only. That would give me more confidence in Cocked and locked carry.

With some practice, switching the thumb safety into the off position can wait until the pistol is pointed toward the target without slowing you down. I'm old and slow, but part of our qualification requires three shots in two seconds (including your reaction time after the buzzer and draw from the holster as well as firing three times and recovering from recoil twice). Popping the safety into the off position is not a limiting factor, its just part of the draw with practice. And practicing the draw is important, I'm acquainted with two guys who shot themselves in the leg during qualification because they pulled the trigger while their guns were still coming out of the holsters (they never practiced). Don't take that wrong, drawing a handgun is perfectly safe if you're willing to practice with an unloaded pistol until the movements are ingrained. Both those guys were using "striker fired" pistols, so it wasn't "cocked and locked" that caused the problem. Just leave the thumb safety alone until just before you slide your forefinger into the trigger guard. I've held bad guys at gun point (high search- the gun is held just low enough so that you can clearly see the bad guy over the sights) several times with the thumb safety engaged and my finger out of the triggerguard. If you have to shoot, raising the gun a little while you're thumbing off the safety and putting your finger on the trigger just takes a small part of a second- practice that too.

I agree with 2MoreChains about the single sided thumb safeties versus ambi safeties for carry and assuming you're right handed- as he pointed out.

A 5 inch barreled 1911 will carry at least as well as your 92FS, except that possibly the increased weight could bother you. I'd go with Springfield Armory's Lightweight Operator, its an aluminum frame, 5 inch barrel, but costs more than you'd like to spend. I'd put off buying it until the extra 300-400 dollars is available. A good firearm will last a lifetime or longer with decent care, so save a little longer and get what you want is my advice.

I hope the above didn't sound too pedantic, but even if the OP knew 99% percent of it, hopefully someone will benefit.

Edited November 30, 2013 by jmbaccolyte

[redbulladdikt]

I recently added a Rock Island 1911 in 10mm Auto to my carry rotation...my primary is usually a Springfield XD Sub Compact .40...

The difference between a double-stack and a single-stack are remarkable in some regards and minor in others...I am a smallish guy (6'0"/ 200lbs) and I find carrying the 1911 allows me more flexibility for carry when cover garments are sketchy--its thinner profile seems to blend better when in the 3 or 4 o'clock position...

Carrying in condition 1 is never a worry when its a 1911;The design is based upon the concept with redundant safeties (provided they are functional and unmodified)...as pointed out above, a good holster is a big part of that equation...in the case of my Rock Island, the ambi safety stays locked by all of my holsters (DeSantis Leather, Custom Cowboy-style rig, and a Kydex one-off) Being picky in the holster department is nothing to scoff at!

It goes without saying that carrying a pistol that isn't Condition 1 is not something I would advise...if the occasion arises where immediate action is needed, an unloaded chamber is next to useless...if you are okay with the Beretta,you should be fine with a 1911...maybe even a bit more comfortable!!

**People like to spend others' money for them (the "save more $ for Y because X are junk..."crowd) I can say from experience, there are distinct differences between high-end builders and budget guns--no refuting it...but starting out with a $2000 Ed Brown for a carry gun is just impractical and downright idiotic in some cases...don't shy away from a budget-friendly brand as a starting point to make sure the platform is for you...Rock Island, Remington and Ruger are making some fine examples that won't break the bank and won't make you weep like a child if the finish wears, or god forbid, you have to turn it over as evidence after using it to defend yourself...just my $0.02 YMMV...best of luck to ya and please let us know what you settle on!

Happy Holidays to you...Red

[peacemaker25]

...I am a smallish guy (6'0"/ 200lbs)...

That's some strange new definition of "smallish," that I haven't previously encountered. I'm about that size, and the only place I feel smallish is hanging around pro athletes.

Anyhow, I've used 1911s as carry guns for about ten years. I've never had a problem resulting from carrying cocked and locked.

If a Government Model has a flaw, it's quite heavy. I carried them for years, and with a good holster and a good belt it can certainly be done. However, they were really designed to ride on a big, heavy duty belt, and a trouser belt, even when considerably reinforced, is still kind of marginal.

Thus, since I switched to a Lightweight Commander earlier this year, I've been much happier. The Govt Model isn't exactly hard to carry, but the LA Commander is downright easy.

Whatever you choose, make sure to give it a thorough shakedown period before you stake anything important on it. In addition to the fact that all auto loaders are systems which depend for function on ammunition and magazines, modern manufacturing methods can create parts with a high infant mortality rate. You want enough rounds down the pipe that anything they was going to break does so on the range, instead of the street.

I can't claim my experience as representative, since the sample size is too small, but I had teething troubles, (small breakages and such,) out of two Taurus pistols, and one Springfield, while two Rock Islands, two Colts, a Kimber and an STI have worked from the start.

[redbulladdikt]

in farm country where I reside...I am smallish

[BBQDawg]

I carry a Colt LW Commander in a Milt Sparks Summer Special with some modifications by Alchemy Custom Weaponry. Great gun that is more controllable than I thought with self defense Federal HST's. It cost me around $1,000 with another few hundred to Alchemy.

[ambluemax]

My "primary" choice is a Dan Wesson CBOB. Been carrying it for years.

The only real draw back is the weight and sharp edges...and those really depend upon the specific model you choose. The latteris especially true with the budget guns, the less you spend the rougher they will be.

Cocked and locked is the only way to seriously carry a 1911. If you can't make peace with it, then its not for you. Realistically though I think its safer that striker fired systems but ymmv. It takes an equal amount of practice to master the 1911 as it does to master a striker fired trigger system because of the learning curve to take up and reset a striker fired trigger.

For your situation I would look at something commander sized. You wont leave much shootability on the table but you will shave some weight and length. Since you already have a g26, I'd stay away from the really small ones because they are harder to shoot and tend to run finicky.

1911s are truely a gun of craftsmanship, and you definitely get what you pay for. Try to find something in the Smith and Wesson, STI, Springfield, Kimber, or colt arena. Stay away from Taurus and Remington.

[jmbaccolyte]

Bull- hopefully you weren't talking to me, when you wrote "People like to spend others' money for them (the 'save more $ for Y because X are junk'?" I certainly didn't mean to imply that the other pistols mentioned above were below par, just that the SA LWOP is much lighter than the all steel versions and doesn't have the frame scuffing problems that will happen if you're shooting many, many thousands of wide-mouthed hollow points through a Colt Commander.

Edited December 25, 2013 by jmbaccolyte

[a.roberts]

1) Yes, good option. Drawbacks: weight, limited capacity Advantage: thinness, big holes.

2) Cocked and locked? Only way to carry a 1911.

3) I don't think you'd give up anything going to a 4.25" gun, throw in a little bit of weight savings to boot.

4) Probably. Might have to look for it, but I think it's doable.

I normally AIWB carry a Glock 23, sometimes a LCR, and rarely a Glock 27 (depends on what shirt I'm wearing.)

I picked up a S&W E Series alloy-framed Commander-length bobtail yesterday and ran it through it's paces today.

For reference, I'm 6'0" and about 150lbs.

It's easily concealed under a medium t-shirt (which is what I normally wear) and it's more comfortable than a Glock is. It's noticeably heavier than a 23, but not uncomfortably so. I think the thinness increases the comfort factor.

The S&W may become my preferred carry option.

Both Kimber and Sig make a couple of CCO-style guns.

Another option is buy a stainless (save on refinishing) commander and bobtail it. Someone around you might have a mill, and might even know how to use it. I think the full-length grip frame would be better suited to IDPA and I don't think you'd give much up in concealment.

[twodownzero]

You do realize that the Beretta is not designed to be carried with the safety engaged, right? That's why it has a double action trigger.

[BBQDawg]

I first tried the Ed Brown Special Forces Carry with the bob tail, but found it to be too heavy after carrying it a couple times. That's why I went with the Colt LW Commander XSE with the Alchemy Hand of Doom carry package. Much more comfortable for me to carry; has been very reliable; and is more than accurate enough. Don't feel like I'm walking around leaned to one side now. Others say you can't tell the difference with the right holster, but I had all the so called right holsters from Milt Sparks, etc., and I felt the difference. Maybe they don't, and that's fine, but I did.

[redbulladdikt]

the holster is only 33% of the carry equation--properly sized pants, a good leather belt and a well made holster is the trifecta...like a good tripod, if one leg is weak the whole structure is destined to fail