DyNo! Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) I'm loading the 100 grain Winchester CTF Frangibles sold on Midway and there's absolutely no load data available for Solo 1000. My match load is 4.6 grains of it behind a normal 115 grain bullet. The amount of accuracy I look for in a load is a group no bigger than a headshot on an IPSC metric target at 25 yards. I recently got the amount of accuracy I needed (5 grains of powder) but I'm still seeing the bullets tumble slightly. Here's a picture of 4.6 grains of powder (not accurate enough to be my final load) - but the bullets still made similar holes at 5 grains with much better accuracy - is this a problem? Edited September 7, 2012 by DyNo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoshidaex Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 How about a different powder? Different powder might help with the accuracy and tumbling. But if that 100 grain bullet is short,I'd take the small tumbling you're getting as acceptable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CocoBolo Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 USPSA rules now state the hole needs to be round to count as a hit, this has gotten me in to trouble lately when little oops like scraping a barrel causes the bullet to tumble into the target. I do shoot with some OCD rule book toating COCO hunting Shooters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youngeyes Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 USPSA rules now state the hole needs to be round to count as a hit, this has gotten me in to trouble lately when little oops like scraping a barrel causes the bullet to tumble into the target. I do shoot with some OCD rule book toating COCO hunting Shooters. Darn. Now I have to get rid of all those square bullets I bought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted September 7, 2012 Author Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) USPSA rules now state the hole needs to be round to count as a hit, this has gotten me in to trouble lately when little oops like scraping a barrel causes the bullet to tumble into the target. I do shoot with some OCD rule book toating COCO hunting Shooters. I'm not a USPSA shooter - Outlaw 3-gun, no power factor, two delta - and I move on. Edited September 7, 2012 by DyNo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted September 7, 2012 Author Share Posted September 7, 2012 How about a different powder? Different powder might help with the accuracy and tumbling. But if that 100 grain bullet is short,I'd take the small tumbling you're getting as acceptable. I have Solo 1000 and HS-6 in abundance. If I had my six inch gun, I'd shoot the HS-6 in minor for shiggles but that could be quite a while... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 USPSA rules now state the hole needs to be round to count as a hit, this has gotten me in to trouble lately when little oops like scraping a barrel causes the bullet to tumble into the target. I do shoot with some OCD rule book toating COCO hunting Shooters. Can anyone point me to this rule, or ruling. Lets just say I'm having a hard time buying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CocoBolo Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 USPSA rules now state the hole needs to be round to count as a hit, this has gotten me in to trouble lately when little oops like scraping a barrel causes the bullet to tumble into the target. I do shoot with some OCD rule book toating COCO hunting Shooters. Can anyone point me to this rule, or ruling. Lets just say I'm having a hard time buying it. 9.5.5 Enlarged holes in paper targets which exceed the competitor’s bullet diameter will not count for score or penalty unless there is visible evidence within the remnants of the hole (e.g. a grease mark or a “crown” etc.), to eliminate a presumption that the hole was caused by a ricochet or splatter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZombieHunter Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Tumbling is the result of not engaging the rifling of the barrel properly or enough. One of a few different solutions exist that I've found in the past, which all work. 1) Use bigger diameter bullets or difference profile that has more bearing surface to engage the rifling 2) If 1 is not an option, occasionally the change to a slower powder for use with the undersized bullet will help reduce the amount of tumbling. I've had WSF and HS-6 both solve some issues with this, but there are a lot of factors to contend with, so you're gun might be different 3) I haven't looked at your charge to compare, but you will also get tumbling with some medium to heavy bullets if you drive them too fast too quickly through the rifling, resulting in poor spin (i.e. too much powder and/or too fast of a powder in combination with high charge). Similarly, if you have a very light bullet, not driving it fast enough could do the same thing. The hard part, is figuring out which one of these it is or likely to be. What type of gun is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted September 7, 2012 Author Share Posted September 7, 2012 STI 2011, really slow twist on the barrel. I'd imagine that the bullets aren't going fast enough. I'll give HS-6 a shot but they group tightly and the oblong holes don't bother me. I could nail a sticky note from 25 yards with the final load so I don't see a problem if there isn't one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 One other thing that can cause that is little or no backing behind the target which allows the target to tear. Might not be your problem, depending on what your target/backer may be, but something to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoshidaex Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 USPSA rules now state the hole needs to be round to count as a hit, this has gotten me in to trouble lately when little oops like scraping a barrel causes the bullet to tumble into the target. I do shoot with some OCD rule book toating COCO hunting Shooters. Can anyone point me to this rule, or ruling. Lets just say I'm having a hard time buying it. 9.5.5 Enlarged holes in paper targets which exceed the competitor’s bullet diameter will not count for score or penalty unless there is visible evidence within the remnants of the hole (e.g. a grease mark or a “crown” etc.), to eliminate a presumption that the hole was caused by a ricochet or splatter. Ron, The OP's hits on paper would be more than adequate to be considered a hole. I have seen a RO use this rule when a competitors bullet was tumbling excessively. The bullet was hitting the target on its side. The hole was larger than the competitors bullet but it did leave a grease mark. You could tell the shooter was using a truncated bullet.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 It may be a problem to me. It's not uncommon here to shoot pistol targets at 50 yards... say a 6" plate for bonus, 10" plates required. If it's not stable at 25 yards it may be a problem at 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gm iprod Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 What is the length of the 100gr CTF projectile in comparison of the length of the normal 115gr JHP? We can't get them down here for me to do a direct comparison. I believe the projectile is not being stabilised due to it's longer bullet in a slow twist barrel. Increasing velocity will not always fix this problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted September 8, 2012 Author Share Posted September 8, 2012 What is the length of the 100gr CTF projectile in comparison of the length of the normal 115gr JHP? We can't get them down here for me to do a direct comparison. I believe the projectile is not being stabilised due to it's longer bullet in a slow twist barrel. Increasing velocity will not always fix this problem. This is probably the answer - my gun won't stabilize 147 grain bullets and they are that length or longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cguy1177 Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 I thought the 100 CTF's were 124jhp length? What's your velocity? I'm getting great results with 4.8gn titegroup OAL 1.12 at around 1350fps with the 90's. ( besides how hot the gun/brass gets ) What is the length of the 100gr CTF projectile in comparison of the length of the normal 115gr JHP? We can't get them down here for me to do a direct comparison. I believe the projectile is not being stabilised due to it's longer bullet in a slow twist barrel. Increasing velocity will not always fix this problem. This is probably the answer - my gun won't stabilize 147 grain bullets and they are that length or longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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