Steve D. Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 Relize I am becoming a "mad scientist" at my reloading bench, cooking this and that, when I could probably just refine the best possible 69 Nosler Custom-Comp bullets with favorite powder load (not Varget) and turn them out on the machine carefully in quantities and just SHOOT! I have to believe that the best load with Benchmark, RL15, XBR-8208 or something will be able to make bug-holes at 100 yds and be very good target ammo out to 400 yds as well. I wonder if even TAC is a contender for best-accuracy in these type loads? This would be through a rifle-length,1x8,18" hand-lapped barrel. The ability to buy those 69 Custom Comps in 1000 qty. is very attractive. Anyone have a "best powder" experience with these pills through a 1x8 AR of 18-20 inches? Loaded VARGET this past weekend under 60 g. VMAX's and was like having un-popped pop-corn in the measure. Too much crunching and jerky-ness to count on drops tighter than 0.3 grains in either direction. Some are dead-on for a few, then drift this way and back, etc. That's no way to make precision ammo... I'm trying to get away from the idividually weighed and funnel-dropped charges... Thanks as always. Will Have some new Chrono numbers for Exterminator and H-55 VMAX Ladder when I get a chance to shoot again. Also put together a VARGET "ladder" with 60 Gr. VMAX on LNL Press. I will need to see Chrono results on this one before I give it any faith in accuracy. Worked from 23 gr. to 25 gr. in 0.5 incriments, but don't like the repeatability (or lack there-of) of this powder from charge to charge through a progressive measure. I must have dropped over 100 test charges getting the various charge points established in making these stupid 50 rnds. of ammo! (10 rnds at each of 5 weights) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullauto_Shooter Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 Try AA2230 - it meters like water through my dillon powder measure and works great with every AR round I've ever loaded (52gr to 69gr). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 Try the 53 grain V-Max for all around use, assuming you aren't trying to knock down Pepper Poppers @ 500 yards or some such endeavor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv Z Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 I switched to TAC exclusively and use it for 69 and 77 gr loads. My understanding is it was designed for heavy long distance loads. Very accurate, although my local range only goes out to 200 yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cotys Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 I load every thing 75 gr like you say and just shoot them. Your RL15 is very accurate, I use 24 gr with the 75ers. I've found TAC identical to RL15 in the .223. I've had good luck with the 69 and 77 gr but settled on 75 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 (edited) TAC is a very good powder for 223. It meters well and performs well too. But since I no longer have money to burn, I can't see shooting 69's for everything unless you only shoot matches then I think it is a good strategy. Edited September 6, 2012 by warpspeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve D. Posted September 14, 2012 Author Share Posted September 14, 2012 Hello STEVE RA, I have experience too with those little 53 VMAX slugs shooting Very Well in my barrel. The thing that I liked about the 69 Nosler C-C idea is that you can buy them at about $150.00 per thousand in bulk which is less than the VMAX's and they would also (?) be expected to perform better out to 400 on the days I can shoot long. I have not shot any heavier bullets yet but I would need to be Sure in my mind that the 69 nos. would perform AT LEAST As Well in the more common 100 yd. shooting and excell at longer distances. Then I could stop screwing around with all this bullet-weight & load-cooking experimentation and just turn-out quantities of Match Quality Ammo to shoot with. I can't do any "blasting" of steel targets, etc at range as it is only a paper bulls and best-behavior kind of club. (Wish we had some wide-open desets & mountains here in FL) As I've said before, I'm just a small-group hound when I shoot so that's what I'm after. You sound like you have a lot of target-time with these gas-guns so I'm running this "standardized-bullet" idea by you for input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted September 14, 2012 Share Posted September 14, 2012 Well, the idea of standardizing on one bullet/load has a lot of merit. I like the 53s but don't shoot a lot of steel @ long ranges. My suggestion would be to pick a bullet based on the most difficult thing you normally do and work up a load for it and stick to it. Practice has a lot to recommend it !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben b. Posted September 14, 2012 Share Posted September 14, 2012 I generally place a priority on value, not cheapness or top-shelf. I decided to standardize on 68 gr Hornady's and quite screwing around lugging an accuracy/distance load and a cheap/hoser load to matches, so I stocked up on the 68 gr Hornady bullets and loaded a bunch. But then some 62 gr Armscor bullets flashed by my face, were cheap and I tried them as a hoser rd. After testing, I found negligible differences at 200 yds and stocked up on those and loaded a bunch. Now I'm well-stocked with an accuracy/distance load and a cheaper accuracy/distance load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latech15 Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Sometimes you can find the hornady 68 grain pills for a few dollars less than the Sierra or nosler 69 grainers. I found the hornady's for 13/100 the other day and loaded up. Some if the clubs that I shoot at are strictly 75 yards and under and for those matches I use the pulled bullets from power factor. They are well under MOA for me and they are priced right. I use 24.5 gr tac loaded to mag length under the 69's and the 68's and they are stupid accurate out of my 18" rifle gas 1x8 rifle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveT-NV Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 One thing to keep in mind about shooting heavier bullets for everything is that in general your felt recoil is going to be higher with the heavier bullets, possibly slowing down follow up shots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latech15 Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 One thing to keep in mind about shooting heavier bullets for everything is that in general your felt recoil is going to be higher with the heavier bullets, possibly slowing down follow up shots. I am just getting into the rifle world, so this isn't meant to start an argument - I promise. I really don't know. With pistols, the heavier bullets produce a lighter, albeit slower and more sluggish, recoil. The major reason is that the speed of the round isn't consistent, but the power factor is. The heavier bullets are slower than the light ones. Would it be true that the recoil, for rifle, would be more with a heavier bullet - even with a consistent power factor? My guess would be that it would be more subjective and based upon the particular barrel, gas system, comp etc. This would be due to the fact that we typically tailor our rifle loads to the most accurate load, not necessarily the best feeling, like (as least I) do with pistol. I may pick a load for a particular bullet at the high end of the powder range since it drops from 1" at 100 to .300" at 100 with that particular load. My other guess would be that the recoil across the entire range of common 223 projectiles would be so close that it really wouldn't make enough difference for me to pick one over another. With a properly tuned gas block of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveT-NV Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 One thing to keep in mind about shooting heavier bullets for everything is that in general your felt recoil is going to be higher with the heavier bullets, possibly slowing down follow up shots. I am just getting into the rifle world, so this isn't meant to start an argument - I promise. I really don't know. With pistols, the heavier bullets produce a lighter, albeit slower and more sluggish, recoil. The major reason is that the speed of the round isn't consistent, but the power factor is. The heavier bullets are slower than the light ones. Would it be true that the recoil, for rifle, would be more with a heavier bullet - even with a consistent power factor? My guess would be that it would be more subjective and based upon the particular barrel, gas system, comp etc. This would be due to the fact that we typically tailor our rifle loads to the most accurate load, not necessarily the best feeling, like (as least I) do with pistol. I may pick a load for a particular bullet at the high end of the powder range since it drops from 1" at 100 to .300" at 100 with that particular load. My other guess would be that the recoil across the entire range of common 223 projectiles would be so close that it really wouldn't make enough difference for me to pick one over another. With a properly tuned gas block of course. Good question, and I'm not sure I know the answer, though I did some quick calculations to calculate Energy for the loads that I have data for. I believe this may be the reason. Used the JBM Calculators MV in ft/sec Energy in foot/lbs Pistol MV taken at 10 feet, Rifle at 15 feet Energy for both at 10 yds Data from a Glock 34 Factory AE 115 g loads MV - 2950, Energy = 363.5 Hand loads 124 MG FMJ 4 g N320 powder - MV - 1060, Energy = 301 Rifle: 18 in JP SCR11 55g VMax, MV - 2950, Energy - 1052 69g SMK, MV - 2770, Energy - 1165 I believe this is the reason why there is more perceived recoil from the heavier rifle bullets, but not necessarily with the pistol. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lebayer Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 Have experimented with the 69g Noslers (just great and typically a good price available. At least my first 1000 was about $140.) using TAC, Benchmark, and Varget. Wish I could say that Varget meters as well as the others but it's not true. However, in my guns, it was the most accurate at 200 yards (by about 1/2"). I wanted to settle on TAC but I had 20lbs of Varget so I take the time to "double tap" the handle on the 650 with each round. That has kept me within .2, based on weighing 20 in a row. I'd like to be tighter than that but can't manage it and as long as I can hit targets of normal (!) size out to 400 yards, I'm very happy with Varget. I use Benchmark exclusively with 55g MG bullets. Like the fellow noted above, I can't afford to use Noslers as my primary load. Besides, I enjoy the reloading! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 250 and 1000 count of Nosler 69s are in stock, and on sale at Midway. http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1758619874/nosler-custom-competition-bullets-22-caliber-224-diameter-69-grain-hollow-point-boat-tail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outerlimits Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 250 and 1000 count of Nosler 69s are in stock, and on sale at Midway. http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1758619874/nosler-custom-competition-bullets-22-caliber-224-diameter-69-grain-hollow-point-boat-tail Might be the only pills left to buy anywhere... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 They actually have a pretty good selection of .22 bulets. These just came in to stock today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dauntedfuture Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 24 of TAC, RL 15 or VAR will shoot well with 69-80g bullets in .223. my 3 gun LR load is 24.2 TAC with 77 Sierra or Nozler in mixed LC cases. They shoot well out of several of my Krieger barreled guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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