2010 role book glossary missing definition for decocked

[West Texas Granny]

So is there an official definition?

Oh. What happens when you cannot complete the COF? My back went out halfway through the match and I couldn't complete the last 2 stages.

Edited December 11, 2011 by West Texas Granny

[waktasz]

Decocked means not cocked. Is there an issue that arose where you need more than that. I'm thinking 8.1.2.2 might be the answer to the question I think you're asking.

Can't complete the match and you get zeros for the stages you didn't shoot.

[Sarge]

Hook, line and sinker.

[West Texas Granny]

Decocked means not cocked. Is there an issue that arose where you need more than that. I'm thinking 8.1.2.2 might be the answer to the question I think you're asking.

Can't complete the match and you get zeros for the stages you didn't shoot.

I shot my HK today instead of my revolver. The HK has a decocker and out of the blue a thought hit me. What do people whose semi-auto weapons do not have a decocker do when they step into the start box.

[Skydiver]

Decocked means not cocked. Is there an issue that arose where you need more than that. I'm thinking 8.1.2.2 might be the answer to the question I think you're asking.

Can't complete the match and you get zeros for the stages you didn't shoot.

I shot my HK today instead of my revolver. The HK has a decocker and out of the blue a thought hit me. What do people whose semi-auto weapons do not have a decocker do when they step into the start box.

Those without decockers are allowed to put their finger in the trigger guard while loading without getting DQ'd as allowed by this rule:

10.5.9 Failure to keep the finger outside the trigger guard during loading, reloading, or unloading. Exception: while complying with the "Make Ready" command to lower the hammer of a gun without a decocking lever, or while initially loading a revolver with a spurless hammer.

Additionally, NROI clarified what a decocked state is for those with decockers:

Q: Does the CZ decocker or others similar, lower the hammer sufficiently to comply with Production division, and if not, how would they comply with the wording in 10.5.9 without being DQ'd?

A: Manufacturers have installed decockers to take the hammer safely to a position that is deemed safe, therefore; the term fully decocked is the position that the hammer rest at once the decocker has been used. Altering a factory installed decocker to bring the hammer to rest at less than a half cocked position is not allowed.

So for people with decockers, half cocked is okay if that's where the decocker leaves the hammer at. For people without decockers, it should be hammer fully down.

Edited December 11, 2011 by Skydiver

[West Texas Granny]

Decocked means not cocked. Is there an issue that arose where you need more than that. I'm thinking 8.1.2.2 might be the answer to the question I think you're asking.

Can't complete the match and you get zeros for the stages you didn't shoot.

I shot my HK today instead of my revolver. The HK has a decocker and out of the blue a thought hit me. What do people whose semi-auto weapons do not have a decocker do when they step into the start box.

Those without decockers are allowed to put their finger in the trigger guard while loading without getting DQ'd as allowed by this rule:

10.5.9 Failure to keep the finger outside the trigger guard during loading, reloading, or unloading. Exception: while complying with the "Make Ready" command to lower the hammer of a gun without a decocking lever, or while initially loading a revolver with a spurless hammer.

Additionally, NROI clarified what a decocked state is for those with decockers:

Q: Does the CZ decocker or others similar, lower the hammer sufficiently to comply with Production division, and if not, how would they comply with the wording in 10.5.9 without being DQ'd?

A: Manufacturers have installed decockers to take the hammer safely to a position that is deemed safe, therefore; the term fully decocked is the position that the hammer rest at once the decocker has been used. Altering a factory installed decocker to bring the hammer to rest at less than a half cocked position is not allowed.

So for people with decockers, half cocked is okay if that's where the decocker leaves the hammer at. For people without decockers, it should be hammer fully down.

So if I have a semi without a decocker please explain how do I lower the hammer on a loaded gun.

[beltjones]

^^^He just did.

[West Texas Granny]

Decocked means not cocked. Is there an issue that arose where you need more than that. I'm thinking 8.1.2.2 might be the answer to the question I think you're asking.

Can't complete the match and you get zeros for the stages you didn't shoot.

I shot my HK today instead of my revolver. The HK has a decocker and out of the blue a thought hit me. What do people whose semi-auto weapons do not have a decocker do when they step into the start box.

Those without decockers are allowed to put their finger in the trigger guard while loading without getting DQ'd as allowed by this rule:

10.5.9 Failure to keep the finger outside the trigger guard during loading, reloading, or unloading. Exception: while complying with the "Make Ready" command to lower the hammer of a gun without a decocking lever, or while initially loading a revolver with a spurless hammer.

Additionally, NROI clarified what a decocked state is for those with decockers:

Q: Does the CZ decocker or others similar, lower the hammer sufficiently to comply with Production division, and if not, how would they comply with the wording in 10.5.9 without being DQ'd?

A: Manufacturers have installed decockers to take the hammer safely to a position that is deemed safe, therefore; the term fully decocked is the position that the hammer rest at once the decocker has been used. Altering a factory installed decocker to bring the hammer to rest at less than a half cocked position is not allowed.

So for people with decockers, half cocked is okay if that's where the decocker leaves the hammer at. For people without decockers, it should be hammer fully down.

So if I have a semi without a decocker please explain how do I lower the hammer on a loaded gun.

[JKSNIPER]

Are you serious?

If you truly do not know how to lower the hammer on a loaded pistol safely then you probably need to attend a basic level pistol course of instruction.

[BritinUSA]

So if I have a semi without a decocker please explain how do I lower the hammer on a loaded gun.

1.Grasp the hammer firmly with the weak-hand.

2. Press the trigger (this is the point where you find out if you did step 1 correctly)

3. Slowly lower the hammer down.

Not the sort of thing I am comfortable doing...

[Skydiver]

The procedure is:

1) Hold back the hammer.

2) Pull trigger and hold down trigger.

3) Lower hammer.

4) Release the trigger.

This can be done one or two handed as seen in this dark video:

[Skydiver]

BritinUSA, posted faster than I could...

I know it makes some of the RO's nervous when I decock my CZ-75b two handed. I wonder how much more nervous they get when they RO my friend who does it one handed.

[JKSNIPER]

Gunsite....Ladies 150 Pistol...April 25-27 2012

[Skydiver]

Oh yeah, the other method that's not in the video, but was noted in the comments for the video:

1) Put weak side thumb between hammer and slide.

2) Pull trigger and hold down the trigger.

3) Ease the thumb out to let the hammer lower into place.

4) Release the trigger.

Supposedly this is the safest way to lower the hammer since it dramatically lowers the chances of the hammer slipping with enough momentum to set off the primer.

[Jim Norman]

WTG, just to clarify, you only need to decock if you are shooting in Production, if you are shooting in Limited or L10, you can put the gun on safe. If of course it has one. If it does not then you would need to decock. And if you don't know how, I strongly suggest that you NOT shoot that gun in a match until you are proficient with its functions.

[West Texas Granny]

WTG, just to clarify, you only need to decock if you are shooting in Production, if you are shooting in Limited or L10, you can put the gun on safe. If of course it has one. If it does not then you would need to decock. And if you don't know how, I strongly suggest that you NOT shoot that gun in a match until you are proficient with its functions.

Normally I shoot a revolver but this time I thought I would use my HK for a change of pace. As I stepped into the box, followed commands and got ready to put my HK to work that thought mentioned earlier popped into my head. Now you folks are telling me its alright to have the the finger in the trigger well and pull the trigger with one hand while at the same time lower the hammer. Are you kidding me. This action doesn't scream unsafe handling and accident waiting to happen to you folks as it does to me. Whatever happened to keeping the finger out of the trigger well at all times except when engaging the target. Are you folks saying this is a safe way to handle a loaded weapon?

[West Texas Granny]

WTG, just to clarify, you only need to decock if you are shooting in Production, if you are shooting in Limited or L10, you can put the gun on safe. If of course it has one. If it does not then you would need to decock. And if you don't know how, I strongly suggest that you NOT shoot that gun in a match until you are proficient with its functions.

Normally I shoot a revolver but this time I thought I would use my HK for a change of pace. As I stepped into the box, followed commands and got ready to put my HK to work that thought mentioned earlier popped into my head. Now you folks are telling me its alright to have the the finger in the trigger well and pull the trigger with one hand while at the same time lower the hammer. Are you kidding me. This action doesn't scream unsafe handling and accident waiting to happen to you folks as it does to me. Whatever happened to keeping the finger out of the trigger well at all times except when engaging the target. Are you folks saying this is a safe way to handle a loaded weapon?

[Chuck Anderson]

WTG, just to clarify, you only need to decock if you are shooting in Production, if you are shooting in Limited or L10, you can put the gun on safe. If of course it has one. If it does not then you would need to decock. And if you don't know how, I strongly suggest that you NOT shoot that gun in a match until you are proficient with its functions.

Normally I shoot a revolver but this time I thought I would use my HK for a change of pace. As I stepped into the box, followed commands and got ready to put my HK to work that thought mentioned earlier popped into my head. Now you folks are telling me its alright to have the the finger in the trigger well and pull the trigger with one hand while at the same time lower the hammer. Are you kidding me. This action doesn't scream unsafe handling and accident waiting to happen to you folks as it does to me. Whatever happened to keeping the finger out of the trigger well at all times except when engaging the target. Are you folks saying this is a safe way to handle a loaded weapon?

Clearly the sport of USPSA frightens you. Please go find something else. This is an established method of lowering the hammer on DA guns and has been used for close to a 100 years. (how do you think people load a Walther PPK?). It's clearly defined in the rulebook and clearly defined by NROI rulings. If you truly find USPSA a bad as it seems you do by the posts there are lots of other sports, like Bullseye that might fit your definition of a safe sport. This one fits mine just fine. And in answer to your question, no it doesn't scream unsafe gun handling to me. It screams, it's the only way to load the gun and put it in a ready condition. Whether you're in competition or for carry. How do you prepare your HK at home? Do you carry with the chamber empty and just run the slide when a bad situation occurs, then walk around with a cocked and off safe gun? Or do you lower the hammer like everyone has described and you just want to troll for responses.

[Singlestack]

No antagonistic tones will be tolerated.

Please post respectfully or don't post at all.

If your post was removed, you know why.

[remoandiris]

+1 on what Chuck said.

[West Texas Granny]

WTG, just to clarify, you only need to decock if you are shooting in Production, if you are shooting in Limited or L10, you can put the gun on safe. If of course it has one. If it does not then you would need to decock. And if you don't know how, I strongly suggest that you NOT shoot that gun in a match until you are proficient with its functions.

Normally I shoot a revolver but this time I thought I would use my HK for a change of pace. As I stepped into the box, followed commands and got ready to put my HK to work that thought mentioned earlier popped into my head. Now you folks are telling me its alright to have the the finger in the trigger well and pull the trigger with one hand while at the same time lower the hammer. Are you kidding me. This action doesn't scream unsafe handling and accident waiting to happen to you folks as it does to me. Whatever happened to keeping the finger out of the trigger well at all times except when engaging the target. Are you folks saying this is a safe way to handle a loaded weapon?

Clearly the sport of USPSA frightens you. Please go find something else. This is an established method of lowering the hammer on DA guns and has been used for close to a 100 years. (how do you think people load a Walther PPK?). It's clearly defined in the rulebook and clearly defined by NROI rulings. If you truly find USPSA a bad as it seems you do by the posts there are lots of other sports, like Bullseye that might fit your definition of a safe sport. This one fits mine just fine. And in answer to your question, no it doesn't scream unsafe gun handling to me. It screams, it's the only way to load the gun and put it in a ready condition. Whether you're in competition or for carry. How do you prepare your HK at home? Do you carry with the chamber empty and just run the slide when a bad situation occurs, then walk around with a cocked and off safe gun? Or do you lower the hammer like everyone has described and you just want to troll for responses.

The question is how do I prepare my HK at home. Simple. When I leave the range my weapon either has the slide locked back, the slide removed or a chamber flag is placed into the chamber and slide is forward. My preference is to remove the slide at the range before leaving for the house. Really it all depends on how dusty it is. If the wind is blowing I use the chamber flag with slide forward to try and keep out the dust. The weapon is then placed into it's own lockable metal case for transport home. Ammo and mags are kept in a separate lockable metal case. Yea it seems like a lot of work but it's my routine. A lockable metal case for the gun, lockable case for the ammo and mags. My semi autos at home are stored in the safe with the chamber flags and slide forward. At home the ammo is stored on metal shelves with overhead fire extinguishers that will go off if there is a fire. Mags are stored empty in the safe.

Thank you for your concern for my safety at home. There is no need for a gun except for the extreme case anyway I have my blades,ax and hammer which I'm quit proficient in their use for protection. There is also the dog. A Dogo Argentino. So I feel quite safe.

As far as a Walther PPK I cannot speak on it as I don't own one.

Now to your final question. I don't know how to respond. I ask a question, seek clarification,seek understanding as to why something is the way it is, offer a suggestion and I get attacked over and over again. I get told to go elsewhere. Not good for anybody. Answers of that's the way it is don't float. An explanation as why it is the way it is is the proper response. That leads to understanding.

[JKSNIPER]

Get some quality instruction WTG.

How to "decock" a pistol and lower the hammer on it is BASIC first time ever handling a pistol level stuff.

If you truly have not had this taught to you in prior classes IMHO the instruction you got to this point is deficient.

Go to a reputable org such as Gunsite or Thunder Ranch and get proper instruction.

Until you do so I agree with prior poster who said you should stay away from competition until you successfully complete a basic pistol course from one of those orgs.

JK

[GrumpyOne]

WTG, when you are shooting your revolver, do you ever shoot it single action? By that, I mean thumb the hammer all the way back to lighten the trigger pull, such as you would do on a long shot? What happens if you decide not to take that long shot? Do you fire the round anyway? No, you grasp the hammer tightly in your fingers, gently pull the trigger, and lower the hammer. It is the same for semi auto's...No different. Try it at home with an unloaded gun, please.

[smokshwn]

I ask a question, seek clarification,seek understanding as to why something is the way it is, offer a suggestion and I get attacked over and over again. I get told to go elsewhere. Not good for anybody. Answers of that's the way it is don't float. An explanation as why it is the way it is is the proper response. That leads to understanding.

No you don't simply ask question, and seek understanding and clarification.

Instead you ask a question and then refuse to consider the responses that are offered. You further antagonize those respondents by inferring the response you received is ill founded. Do you honestly believe that after years of emperical practical experience, months of rules deliberation, review by 100's of years of individual cumulative experience, that USPSA arrived at a process that "screams unsafe gun handling" ? Or is it a possibility that YOU are simply uninformed, ignorant of the collective experience, or simply wrong?

You receive responses with rulebook citations and clarification. You choose to ignore those responses due to any of the following reasons

1) The response does not further your purpose of trolling and causing confrontation

2) The response does not explicitly agree with your uninformed opinion

3) The response contains an element of truth and logic which seem to be beyond your grasp

4) Or the response cites facts, figures, or objective concepts that explicity show you to be in error.

This pattern is repeated in many of your posts. I am open to the possibility that through written communication, oftentimes there are subtleties that may be lost/mistaken/misinterpreted. However, there is a distinct pattern to your posts that lead me to believe this is not the case. On other forums with less stringent moderation this would not continue to be a problem. On Benos the rules are different and even ridiculous questions are generally responded to with a definite shade of helpfulness rather than ridicule. If you feel that you are receiving ridicule and ill temperament in the responses you have received, please consider that YOU may be conducting yourself in a fashion that elicits such responses and make changes to your posting style accordingly.

Edited December 11, 2011 by smokshwn

[Singlestack]

We are done here.