Here is my version of a "speed shoot"

[Chills1994]

Hi all,

here it is:

SpeedShootPDF.pdf

[Graham Smith]

"Shooter must do a mandatory reload after firing their 8th shot."

I shoot limited, so I have 20 rounds. I hose all the targets then do a reload. Can't fault me because it was done after the 8th round.

[bluenite]

I hose all the targets then do a reload. Can't fault me because it was done after the 8th round.

Timer would not pick up the reload "sweet for you"

Leonard

[spanky]

If it were me, i would do:

Upon signal draw and from Box A engage only T1, T2, T5 and T6, then perform a mandatory reload, then engage only T3, T4 and USP1-4.

OR

Upon signal draw and from Box A engage only T2-T5, then perform a mandatory reload, then engage only T1, T6 and USP1-4.

Edited June 16, 2011 by spanky

[Graham Smith]

"Shooter must perform a mandatory reload when transitioning between paper and steel". That lets them shoot things in any order they prefer.

[DyNo!]

I shoot limited, so I have 20 rounds. I hose all the targets then do a reload. Can't fault me because it was done after the 8th round.

This.

[bluenite]

There is 12 shots in paper

[Chills1994]

Hmmn....Okay, I guess I will have to go back and read the speed shoot rule, but I thought you could have a stage where you fired 16 rounds all from one position with a mandatory reload after the 8th shot (but before the 9th shot).

thanks for all the input so far.

[MarkCO]

Same array...

Upon start signal engage T1-T6 with one round each and USP1-2, perform a mandatory reload and re-engage all paper and remaining steel. That should take out the "miss" disaster factor and not make it defacto Vickers. I think it would be legal and do what you want as well.

[Paul Santiago]

"Shooter must do a mandatory reload after firing their 8th shot."

I shoot limited, so I have 20 rounds. I hose all the targets then do a reload. Can't fault me because it was done after the 8th round.

That's how I'd shoot it.

[bluenite]

I think this is enough to make it work

mandatory reload before the 9th shot.

It also works good for Rev and SS

Leonard

[Graham Smith]

with a mandatory reload after the 8th shot (but before the 9th shot).

This is being discussed in the other thread and the rule, as written, is subject to interpretation. It says, "Mo more than 8 rounds may be required without a mandatory reload."

My interpretation is that if you have a 12 round stage, you have to require a reload. It doesn't mean that you have to require one after 8 shots. It's tricky.

We've really got the same general discussion going now in two places.

Edited June 16, 2011 by Graham Smith

[MarkCO]

We've really got the same general discussion going now in two places.

No biggie, that happens in my head all the time.

[NickJ]

Mandatory reload after the first shot and before the last shot fired. I ran one similar to this last month, 4 paper with 4 poppers in front. The idea was can you go fast enough to beat the procedural for not reloading. No one tried.

[Poppa Bear]

Hmmn....Okay, I guess I will have to go back and read the speed shoot rule, but I thought you could have a stage where you fired 16 rounds all from one position with a mandatory reload after the 8th shot (but before the 9th shot).

thanks for all the input so far.

Must execute a reload after the first shot and before the last shot .

Edited to add red text

Edited June 17, 2011 by Poppa Bear

[Poppa Bear]

I think this is enough to make it work

mandatory reload before the 9th shot.

It also works good for Rev and SS

Leonard

After reading this my first thought was execute the reload while drawing the gun and hose everything with the second mag.

[bluenite]

Yea I see your point, I reload with both hands so did not occur to me.

Could be as much as ½ second advantage but

I think I would want to be well practiced before I tried that at a match.

“with a fresh mag in one hand, if you hit the button just a bit to soon and the muzzle did not come up enough to make downrange when the mag droped, It is a free trip to dairy queen”.

But yes there are better ways to word it.

[Poppa Bear]

There in lies the problem. The intent of our words does not always make it into the WSB. For a Speed Shoot we also need to stipulate what the course is and why they the shooters need to comply with the rules for that stage.

I know the first time I set up a 10 to 16 round speed shoot someone will say "That's not legal. You can't have more than 4 targets available from just one position" "And you cannot specify a reload because this is not a classifier"

[LT45]

There are ways of wording the WSB to get the intended procedures to be followed without having someone drive a truck through your stage.

Check this stage out. The use of the word "then" is a key factor in this WSB.

Also,this is a Comstock stage, which allows more than 8 rounds, but does not "require" more than 8 rounds before the reload.

[Skydiver]

"Shooter must perform a mandatory reload when transitioning between paper and steel". That lets them shoot things in any order they prefer.

This will make it illegal for a speed shoot because now you are requiring more than one mandatory reload... Consider the shooter shoots steel, but leave one standing, reloads, and then shoots paper. For him to go back to knock down the steel, your WSB now requires him to reload again, but the rule says:

1.2.2.3 "Speed Shoot"-Courses of fire consisting of one continuous string of fire not exceeding 16 rounds shot on one or more arrays of multiple targets from a single location or view. No more than 8 rounds may be required without a mandatory reload and no more than one mandatory reload may be required in the course of fire. Stage may be scored either Comstock or Virginia Count. See Rule 9.2.3.2.

[Graham Smith]

For him to go back to knock down the steel, your WSB now requires him to reload again

Then I would think that the same thing would apply to Larry's stage above which requires you to shoot paper, then steel, or vice-versa.

[bluenite]

I have shot plenty of stages like this and hope to shoot plenty more.

But for me when a reload is mandated say between rounds 8 and 9,

I get to do this “draw fire 6, reload, fire 2, reload, fire 6, reload, fire 2”.

I always think to my self that with a few words different it would be a lot better stage for me.

As for above “having to do a reload because of a miss” is not a required reload so the stage is legal, you are allowed to do as many reloads as you like/need, only 1 is required.

6 shot guns and their shooters “like me” deal with this a lot.

[bluenite]

When I was taking the RO test I had an issue with the wording on a question, so I emailed the instructor for clarification on it.

The clarification helped me, I got the answer correct.

My email:

25. Which courses of fire may require reloads?

It dose not say mandatory. And the word "may" is in bold.

So I see the answer as all but can't find a rule to support it.

A magazine could malfunction after one shot requiring a reload or more to complete the COF.

And there are Division requirements that require reloads to complete the COF depending on the round count for the COF.

I got rule 8.1.4 but it only lists courses with mandatory reloads and divisions requirements.

This is what I want to put but it is about "mandatory" and the words "may require" implies division or shooter preference.

His reply:

Require and mandatory mean the same thing.

Leonard

[GForceLizard]

If we're voting I like; a mandatory reload any time after engaging the first target but before the last target is engaged.

[LT45]

For him to go back to knock down the steel, your WSB now requires him to reload again

Then I would think that the same thing would apply to Larry's stage above which requires you to shoot paper, then steel, or vice-versa.

We had this very discussion the day we shot this stage. There is only one mandatory reload required in the WSB.. so if you perform the required reload, then realize you left a piece of steel standing, you would be okay to make up the steel without penalty because you had already satisfied the requirements of the WSB. You are not required to make the additional reload according to the WSB.