Kyle O Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 I've only been at this for a few months, I set my par time for 4 seconds on these video clips. I have beat 3.5 a few times, but no consistancy at that speed. I can do 8 in 8.5sec consistantly, best for 8 is 7.4sec. Any nuggets of info? seems the 3rd one in the tube is giving me the most trouble overall. I really can't tell what I'm doing at speed. BTW, this is also my first attempt at "editing" with my flip cam I got for christmas. I "edited" out the dropsies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlosa Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 I'm sure you have seen this video before.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdY5pBIs_5s&feature=youtube_gdata_player One thing I noticed on your dismount and your grab, is that you shift your feet, and your shoulders pop up.. Eliminating excss movement on your reach for the shells seems like a good place to start eliminating wasted time.. You also seem tense up as your grabing the shells and inserting them in. Tension in your body will always keep you from reaching maximum efficiency As for manipulating the shells.. I took a class with a fellow so cal 3 gunner, and he put allot of enfacies on the grab constancy , and thumb placement, getting your thumb a's low a's posible on the brass of the shells after the grab seems to help in controlling the insertion of the shells.. So those are things you could experiment with maybe. I'm no shotgun expert, someone here will surly give you some better advice But seriously pay attention to the tension in your buddy... Tension makes things feel faster sence we're over working our musscle, but it only makes us sloppy and slower.. Cheers, Los Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlosa Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 By the way.. I posted the video so you could analyze the lack of tension and the minimum amount of upper body movement douring the 6 second reload Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Nice loading Kyle! You are ahead of about 75% of the shooters I would have to guess. You can save time by keeping the gun on your shoulder. Its not really that much harder to hold it up there for 5 seconds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 (edited) All I can say is practice, practice, practice. Before weakhand loading a tube gun, I used to shoot an Open 1100 and I never had to worry about weakhand since I'd just shove a tech-loader into the gun. Since I'm shooting a different division this year though, I had to jump the hurdle that you're fighting right now since my load time used to be terrible. (Not that yours is in any way) After a few hours, you'll find out what does and does not work and there are plenty of instructional videos on Youtube. (NST, AMU, JesseT, GorillaTac) Edited January 5, 2011 by DyNo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle O Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 One thing I noticed on your dismount and your grab, is that you shift your feet, and your shoulders pop up.. Eliminating excss movement on your reach for the shells seems like a good place to start eliminating wasted time.. You also seem tense up as your grabing the shells and inserting them in. Cheers, Los The feet shifting is coming from other practice sessions, I walk to a different position while loading (can't do that and film), but in a match there will be feet movement while loading. I didn't even notice that, or my shoulders jumping up, so thanks! I do think the reason I am doing it is the length of my arms. If I leave my shoulder down I have to really break my wrist over a lot more to grab the shells, and don't get as good of a grip on them, but I will play with that to confirm Nice loading Kyle! You are ahead of about 75% of the shooters I would have to guess. You can save time by keeping the gun on your shoulder. Its not really that much harder to hold it up there for 5 seconds Thanks Jesse! Back when I started doing this, I did keep the shotty basically mounted, and it was some UGLY loading . So, I started the dropping it down, and twisting the bottom of the gun inward, and it improved TONS, so I just kept doing it that way, now that I'm comfortable doing it though, I guess I'll go back, and give that a try. All I can say is practice, practice, practice. Yessir, that is my motto for 2011! Thanks for the help everyone! keep it comin! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMAC Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Did you have any work done to your FN? I cannot stuff shells in mine that easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle O Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 Did you have any work done to your FN? I cannot stuff shells in mine that easily. Yea, I opened up the port some dremel/sanding, and had the lifter welded. Do a search on SLP lifter weld, and you should find a couple of post about it. Also, a nordic +2, but the spring is actually stiffer than the stock one, but I figuered I would be better off if I could load with a stiffer spring. When it get's closer to match season, I might trim a couple of coils off, then the shells would flow like water, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usp45ss Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 One thing I noticed a few times is the buttstock. If you're going dismount from the shoulder, trap the buttstock against your body with your strong arm. More stable so there's less lateral movement of the shotgun while you're trying to stuff shells. It may help a little. This is especially true for me when trying to walk and load. It will be a little harder to cant the gun to the side, but it may help. The FN is a little to heavy for me to reload comfortably from the shoulder. I think you already have that problem solved though.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHolsted Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Yessir, that is my motto for 2011! Thanks for the help everyone! keep it comin! Now the best way to practice is to shoot! Now bring your but to our match this month! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Kyle, You look good, keep up the practice! For what it's worth, the 3rd shell that gives me more trouble too. I can't offer any advice, since all of you are faster than I am! All of you are so young!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaredr Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 hey kyle - video looks great, thanks for posting. can you tell what shell caddies are you using? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle O Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 Made another movie today, I did 8 shell reloads, and I included everything in all it's glory, the good, bad, and the ugly. (put most of the bad ones at the end) I wanted to push myself, so I set the timer for my "old" personal best of 7.4 seconds, just to see if I could consistantly beat it. While I'm thinking about it...... How do you all practice with par times? Do you constantly push yourself, or do you give some cushion? For the last several sessions I set it on 8.5 sec, and can beat it without any fumbles. It's clear that I'm getting faster than that now, so what is the right par time to practice with? It seems to mimic "match stress" to try to beat that second beep, but it feels more like "exercising" when I give myself plenty of time. Shells flow smoother if I'm not rushed, but I'm not sure if that's the best way to practice??? What say you? jaredr, those are manmountain 4 shell caddies, got'em from Chris at CPWSA.com here in the vendor tent section of the forums. I really like them. Patrick, I'm in on that 3gun match, just need to send you guys an email. And, thanks for the compliments guys, I just wish I had videoed the first 10 sessions I ever did, it would have been posted in the humor forum instead Not on film = I tried some reloads with gun mounted, and it was BAAAAAD! I will continue to dismount/remount at least until my salient gets here I did focus on pinning the buttstock to my side with my forearm, and trying to be more "relaxed" Thanks for the feedback. Here's another for your entertainment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aheadofthecurve Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 LOL, I love how you thrown down the gun in disgust in the first video...to each of us that have been there, we can all relate to that. A couple things I've noticed: It seems like you tend to occasionally get the "FN snag" that I am familiar with when loading my gun. This is when the shell doesnt go in the magazine when you are pushing because the lip of the shell is either caught between the rim of the previously loaded shell and the feed ramp, or on that stupid little magazine tube lip on the top of the magazine tube. The way to avoid this is to make sure that each shell is pressed fully flush against the lifter before pushing forward with your thumb. Your hand movements and gun position vary a little from time to time--If you can make those repetitions exactly the same over and over again, it will likely make you more consistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHolsted Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 One thing I noticed a few times is the buttstock. If you're going dismount from the shoulder, trap the buttstock against your body with your strong arm. More stable so there's less lateral movement of the shotgun while you're trying to stuff shells. It may help a little. This is especially true for me when trying to walk and load. It will be a little harder to cant the gun to the side, but it may help. The FN is a little to heavy for me to reload comfortably from the shoulder. I think you already have that problem solved though.... West. What gun are you running? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usp45ss Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 One thing I noticed a few times is the buttstock. If you're going dismount from the shoulder, trap the buttstock against your body with your strong arm. More stable so there's less lateral movement of the shotgun while you're trying to stuff shells. It may help a little. This is especially true for me when trying to walk and load. It will be a little harder to cant the gun to the side, but it may help. The FN is a little to heavy for me to reload comfortably from the shoulder. I think you already have that problem solved though.... West. What gun are you running? Salient Benelli m2. Kyle's should be here in the next few weeks too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Try holding the shells more vertically rather than flat. If you get the crimped end in the loading port it will go home no matter what angle it is at relative tothe tube. Your thumb should stay in contact with the lifter and you roll that next shell over as you pull your thumb rearward. It hard to explain what the hand does but the thumb kind of rolls the next shell over to the port. If you watch my video I don't even use my index finger on the last 2-3 shells. Its pretty much all thumb. The way I do it is not the only way as Rob appears to keep the shells flatter like your doing. Just pointing our what I see you and I doing differently since my last 2 shells are my fastest and they give you trouble. My slowest shell is the second one because it wants to sneak out the front of my hand as I am pushing the first one home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usp45ss Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Kyle, it's definitely looking better. Keep working on getting that consistent grab coming out of the caddies. It is more difficult for me as I go to the more lateral caddies. I've started loading from my far right caddy first. It is past the midline of my body on the right. As I load more, I work back towards the left. Seems to flow a little better. I always try to index my ring finger on the left lip of the caddy. Gives a consistent hand placement for the grab. This reminds me that I need to practice. You've seen some of my reloads on the clock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle O Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 (edited) Thanks guys, I'm gonna make some changes to the way/angle I hold the shells, and go for the always consistant grab. It gets sloppy, when in go fast mode. So, better make it smooth before I "have" to go fast. Now that it's been brought up, I'm pretty sure this is the reason I'm not able to load from the mounted position. Edited January 6, 2011 by Kyle O Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 (edited) I'll try to shoot some more video soon with all of the angles like you did. I'll leave the not so fast ones in there too. That way we can all learn form each others mistakes. I think it took me about 200 loads to make my video of 5 good loads. LOL! Edited January 7, 2011 by jtischauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaredr Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 I'll leave the not so fast ones in there too. That way we can all learn form each others mistakes. I think it took me about 200 loads to make my video of 5 good loads. LOL! was thinking of doing my own practice montage like kyle's, except I'd have not so many of the good, mostly the bad (slowly plodding along, inconsistent hand motions and body posture, every now and then just stopping to just stare at the ejection port), and a large portion of the ugly (looks like you're having a grand mal seizure once the buzzer goes off, 12 ga dummy shells fly across the room and every now and then your pants just fall down for no reason at all). ultimately decided that was video i didn't need to share... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle O Posted January 7, 2011 Author Share Posted January 7, 2011 Ok, just tried the new "technique" I was actually much faster than I thought I would be, after a few slow-mo runs I turned the par to 7.5 sec. I only beat it a couple of times (LUCK), but I see this going somewhere, I haven't edited the vid yet, but it may be more like jaredr's version. OK, I just peeked at it. Something I noticed, when the shells are more vertical, I don't have to cant the gun at all to get a good feel for it. When I held them flat, it was a necessity to cant it over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle O Posted January 7, 2011 Author Share Posted January 7, 2011 Ok, I had to film the first few tries, I guess if for nothing else, it's good comic relief. I just gotta remind myself the first time I picked up 4 shells with my weak hand, It felt like 14, then it felt like one, cause that one was all that was left in my hand. This brought some of those feelings right back. enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biga9999 Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Great vids. Thanks. Looking to get a SLP soon and was wondering how the +2 extension would look. Have some caddies on order so I can start practicing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Kyle, Try putting the butt right in your armpit, and lock it there with your upper arm. I've had much better consistency with keeping the gun as horizontal as possible. Less consistant with the muzzle up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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