What the heck's the deal?

[aztecdriver]

Also - I would like to point out that as an RO, I point out every "ding" to the competitor and give them an opportunity to disagree with me, even at local matches. I don't want to call something and have a squad member paste the target quickly leaving them no way to see for themselves that they earned the score I recorded. Remember, the RO is there to help the competitor and I believe that giving shooters the opportunity to see what you are scoring is key. Always walk with the RO as they are calling the targets and score them yourself and make sure they match what you are seeing, and feel free to ask questions as to why something was scored in a way you don't understand.

I've found that when you get into standards stages, virginia count, fixed time and overlapping targets and noshoots even moderately experienced shooters may have issues understanding what happens with border hits, overtime shots, etc. A good explanation of every score may help you understand the rules and your score better.

[vluc]

Second, and more important for every shooter, is that the scorekeeper can't make up stuff. You said that you had all your hits, and I assume you saw that on your score sheet, along with the time(s) for the stage. The point is, the scorer might have marked only Alpha on one of your targets, and left the second hit blank. The scorekeeper would have to [or should have] marked this as a Mike, without having evidence on the score sheet that it was a Charlie.

Stan, then how do you make a Mike when nothing is marked? You just made something up. Without having evidence it was a Charlie - or a Mike - you can't make the assumption it was something else.

Edited April 20, 2010 by vluc

[eric4069]

When you look at your scores posted on USPSA you can see what the penalties are. Look at the overall results and your USPSA number should be a "Link". Click on your USPSA number and it will show the scoring breakdown of all your stages. Within that it will show your hits, penalties and what kind, time, HF, etc. Check that out to see where the "Penalty" came from. If its not accurate then contact the score keeper to up date it.

But as others have said. its really up to you to validate that your score is accurate after shooting the stage and before you sign the score sheet. This only takes a few seconds to do before signing the score sheet. Get in the habit of doing it.

I didn't know the USPSA site had the scoring breakdown like that. Thanks!

Eric

[Team Amish 1]

I don't know about your matches (of course not ) but around here, people are usually not asked to sign scoresheets for local matches.

Most match staff probably point out if there was a procedural or let the competitor look at the target that is deemed to have a miss.

But, if you really want to be sure nothing slips you, just follow the scorekeeper around after your stage and ask him if there were any misses or procedurals.

They'll probably be just fine letting you glance at the sheet. Should you notice a discrepancy between what you saw on the scoresheet and the posted (probably internet) scores, just shoot the match director or scoremeister an e-mail. They won't have any gain from buggering up anyone's score and are (usually) ok with making the correction. As to the score you're talking about, I'd let it go, most likely no one will remember.

I do like your idea, though, to assess a penalty for 9 Minor.

edited because "assess" is spelled with two "s" at the end...

Edited April 22, 2010 by Team Amish 1

[GrumpyOne]

What the heck is the deal here? I am shooting production, and am a newer shooter, but I went to a match and shot a great stage, time was about a 17, no question there, BUT, I hit all my targets (no misses), did not hit any "no shoots" and I still had a penalty when the scores were posted on the website. I can't figure out why? Now, I am not an old vet to this game, just old, but for the life of me, it seems like this will happen everytime I shoot.

So my question is, what am I not seeing or doing or is it just shooting the 9mm they penalize you 10 right off the git-go, or what? I know it is just a local match, but do you guys take a picture of your score sheet after each stage or something so you can see how this stuff plugs into the scoring program or what?

Thanks,

Gene

Gene, I've read every post in this topic, and they (all the posters) seem to have it all summed up. What bothers me is the sense I get that you feel that this has happened or will happen everytime you shoot a match. Mistakes happen, no one is picking on you, it was probably just a typo. Has this happened before? I mean, is there a pattern? If not, then do as the guys suggest, walk with the RO when he (she) scores your targets, take notes, go over your scorecard before you sign it, and check it on the website.

And, if you started shooting a 40 instead of the 9, maybe they'd stop handicapping you!

Edited April 22, 2010 by GrumpyOne

[Spray_N_Prey]

The Stats officer is supposed to keep the records for two years? where is that in the book?

[Skydiver]

The Stats officer is supposed to keep the records for two years? where is that in the book?

I do the stats for my club. I don't hold on to the scoresheets, but I do know that our treasurer holds on to the classifier scoresheets for a year or two. I'm guessing it's in the fine print for a club affiliation with USPSA.

[Spray_N_Prey]

I hold onto the scoresheets for around 60 days and then they get tossed. Nobody has ever told me different, in fact, they use to get tossed within a few days after the match. Can someone that knows for sure chime in here.

[Wild Gene]

What the heck is the deal here? I am shooting production, and am a newer shooter, but I went to a match and shot a great stage, time was about a 17, no question there, BUT, I hit all my targets (no misses), did not hit any "no shoots" and I still had a penalty when the scores were posted on the website. I can't figure out why? Now, I am not an old vet to this game, just old, but for the life of me, it seems like this will happen everytime I shoot.

So my question is, what am I not seeing or doing or is it just shooting the 9mm they penalize you 10 right off the git-go, or what? I know it is just a local match, but do you guys take a picture of your score sheet after each stage or something so you can see how this stuff plugs into the scoring program or what?

Thanks,

Gene

Gene, I've read every post in this topic, and they (all the posters) seem to have it all summed up. What bothers me is the sense I get that you feel that this has happened or will happen everytime you shoot a match. Mistakes happen, no one is picking on you, it was probably just a typo. Has this happened before? I mean, is there a pattern? If not, then do as the guys suggest, walk with the RO when he (she) scores your targets, take notes, go over your scorecard before you sign it, and check it on the website.

And, if you started shooting a 40 instead of the 9, maybe they'd stop handicapping you!

Grumpy,

I have a plan when I go to the line. The buzzer goes off, and pretty soon I am standing at the end of the stage. I am not 100% sure what has just happened if all went well. If I had problems, I may recall them, but I really don't think about what is going on when I shoot, I just shoot. The only thing that really sticks in my mind is how the stage went/felt. If it went well, or was a disaster, or something in between. I may have thought a stage went pretty well, but then I go home, and check my scores and when something pops up then I wonder what or why. I am new to this game, and have only shot a few matches. There is so much going into my brain (rules, scoring, stages, different equipment), that I need a way or system to help me keep it all straight. Once I get the hang of things, I am sure it will not be such an issue. It is like a new job, I know how to work, but the boss may want it done a certain way, so I need to learn his way. What I want to know is what other people do special to keep track of their matches and progress, if they do anything at all. I am going to start a match and practice journal and just make a note in it after practice and stages of any interesting observations, scores, times, that sort of thing. I am not insinuating(sp) that anyone is doing this to me or there is a conspiracy toward me (just my 9mm).

I must admit, I may have worded the initial post poorly, but it did make for a very informative and helpful, for me, discussion.

Like I have said many times, I am shooting at some great clubs, with a lot of great people. I would add guys like you that care to the list of people I would like to be able to shoot with someday (but have to admit, I would dump all of you in a heartbeat to get to shoot with the Abbate's ).

As far as the 9mm goes, I should have a .40 arrive anyday now. I figure I can have a no hit with a .40 as well as a 9mm, plus all the guys I have been shooting with all shoot .40's Limited, so that's what I am going to do. That and I am tired of getting a 10 point penalty just for shooting the 9mm.

Now, PLEASE, could you send me a postcard with your's, Doc's, Sleepy's, Dopey's, Happy's, Bashful's and Sneezie's autograph? Plus a signed picture of Snow White? She's a babe!

Your Pal,

WG

[Nik Habicht]

I hold onto the scoresheets for around 60 days and then they get tossed. Nobody has ever told me different, in fact, they use to get tossed within a few days after the match. Can someone that knows for sure chime in here.

I can't think of an official requirement. Depending on how your club does things, it may be prudent to hang on to them. I hung onto scoresheets for the current and prior year for a couple of reasons: To hang onto liability waivers that were part of our scoresheets and in case I needed to account for match receipts to the club (i.e. to survive a Board audit).....

[GrumpyOne]

Like I have said many times, I am shooting at some great clubs, with a lot of great people. I would add guys like you that care to the list of people I would like to be able to shoot with someday (but have to admit, I would dump all of you in a heartbeat to get to shoot with the Abbate's ).

As far as the 9mm goes, I should have a .40 arrive anyday now. I figure I can have a no hit with a .40 as well as a 9mm, plus all the guys I have been shooting with all shoot .40's Limited, so that's what I am going to do. That and I am tired of getting a 10 point penalty just for shooting the 9mm.

Now, PLEASE, could you send me a postcard with your's, Doc's, Sleepy's, Dopey's, Happy's, Bashful's and Sneezie's autograph? Plus a signed picture of Snow White? She's a babe!

Your Pal,

WG

Shoot with me? You wouldn't be able to from laughing....About every third round, my long, grey beard gets caught in the slide!

[Poppa Bear]

As the one who runs EzWin for our club a possible problem could be operator error. The program moves the cursor by default to the next box if the total round count is 10 or greater for that box. Ie. the Alpha box has 11 hits and EzWin moves the cursor to the B box without the operator having to hit the enter button. IF the operator hits the enter button the cursor moves to the C box. IF the operator did not intend to move the cursor to the C box yet, it is possible for scores to now be off by one box. IF the program is off by one box and the operator does not catch it then it is possible to turn a D hit into a Miss. The program verifies the total number of shots scored, it does not verify the number of shots in each scoring area. That is the responsibility of the stats officer.

We initial all score sheets even at a level 1 match so that no one can complain if the score sheet comes to me with no time listed or the wrong data entered into the scoring area, they initialed it as being correct.