Malfunctions during shooting from retention (hip shooting)

[Opie]

I had a horrible day at IDPA today. I have been shooting glocks for 10 years and have never had this problem before. I had a failure to feed every single time I shot from the retention position. After the first time (and getting teased by my buddies for "limpwristing") I had the same malfunctin 8 times while shooting from retention. After the first malfunction I locked my wrist and gorilla gripped that gun so I don't think I was limpwristing it. The slide failed to go into battery, and the magazine had to be stripped to get the gun running again. These were failure to feeds, not stovepipes.

I was using Montana Gold 124gr FMJ over 3.4gr of Titegroup. Do you think that the low power factor of this load (just barely over minimum) was causing my problem or is it shooting technique? I also had the malfuction once during support hand shooting, so I am wondering if I need to bump the load up to 3.5-3.6 grains or if it's just my grip. I had no malfuctions using both hands.

Thanks, Brian

Edited March 7, 2010 by Opie

[Steve J]

What happens when you shoot strong hand only and weak hand only?

[dsmw5142]

I seriously doubt that load even makes PF. I loaded something similar a long time ago and it made I think 115 PF or so... You should probably need at least 3.8gr of Titegroup with a 124gr FMJ to make above 125PF consistently... and I run that with a 13lb. spring. I would bump up the load and/or lighten your spring. Also, as far as technique goes... be sure you're not bumping the slide stop lever.

[wurm]

That is a pretty light load. I'd have to look at my notebook to make sure since it has been a while since I've reloaded 124gr with Titegroup but I think I was using 4.0 to 4.1 grains to make minor.

[jasmap]

There are a lot of variables here. Could be the slide stop, could be you hit the slide in retention, could be the ammo, could be a mag issue, etc.. We would need more info to really help you.

Try only one change at a time though. If you change two or three things at once then you will never truly know the root of the problem. Good luck!

[Opie]

There are a lot of variables here. Could be the slide stop, could be you hit the slide in retention, could be the ammo, could be a mag issue, etc.. We would need more info to really help you.

Try only one change at a time though. If you change two or three things at once then you will never truly know the root of the problem. Good luck!

OK, thanks guys. I think I will start with a box of factory 9mm FMJ ammo tomorrow and go from there.

[Flexmoney]

Where did you come up with that load?

[shooterready]

Was the slide hitting your body during retention shots?

Edited March 8, 2010 by shooterready

[Opie]

Sorry guys, the load was 3.6 grains of titegroup. Here is what I wrote down in December when I chronographed it. I made several thousand rounds of this and what I was shooting Saturday was still part of this lot.

The good news is I only have about 100rds of the stuff left and I can bump it up a bit now.

124gr Montana Gold

Speer brass

CCI small pistol primer

3.6 Titegroup

1.13 OAL

1007

998

1002

1011

1024

973

1033

1031

1012

992

1000

1001

1018

1016

High 1033

Low 972

Extreme Spread 61

Average 1008.4 fps

Power factor 125,045

Edited March 8, 2010 by Opie

[G-ManBart]

I'd bump that load up to get it right around 135PF....it'll still be soft, should work the gun fine and won't cost you any time on the clock. R,

[Flexmoney]

I almost always point toward technique over gear and such, but the 800lb gorilla here is those mousefart® loads.

Your issue is probably going to be a lack of energy. With a good two hand grip, all is well. When you get away from that, you are robbing just enough energy from the system for it to take a dump.

I run my minor Glock loads with TG and 124's at 135-140pf. And, I never have problems with the gun cycling, plus it takes down steel just a bit better (steel isn't always set up real well).

And, if running a gun at 135-140pf is an problem...then that is a technique issue that can be improved.

[Graham Smith]

It may also be a combination of factors. Shooting from retention means a less than optimal grip with the gun off-axis on two planes - turn slightly to the side and pointing slightly up. Combine that with a weak load and it may all conspire to keep the gun from ejecting correctly leading to jams.

Are you allowed to reduce the spring weight to compensate for the lighter load in IDPA?

[MemphisMechanic]

First, 130 power factor in a Glock34 is a 3.8gr titegroup charge under a 124gr Precision Delta FMJ. Half my local guys that shoot a Block use that load (at least half a dozen) and it's always in the 129-133 power factor area when I drag the chrono out on 'em.

Second, have you dropped your recoil spring down to a 13pounder yet? IMO, that's what makes the lighter loads so sweet to shoot.

[9mmalpha]

Sorry guys, the load was 3.6 grains of titegroup. Here is what I wrote down in December when I chronographed it. I made several thousand rounds of this and what I was shooting Saturday was still part of this lot.

The good news is I only have about 100rds of the stuff left and I can bump it up a bit now.

124gr Montana Gold

Speer brass

CCI small pistol primer

3.6 Titegroup

1.13 OAL

1007

998

1002

1011

1024

973

1033

1031

1012

992

1000

1001

1018

1016

High 1033

Low 972

Extreme Spread 61

Average 1008.4 fps

Power factor 125,045

I had that similar issue with my reloaded ammo from last year although not the same powder , but I have that same borderline power factor, I notice that during the match and its early morning and still cold I experience jam, I chrono it on cold temp last december and found it to be at least 50 fps slower, I bump my load to 135 power factor since then, and also doing test fit each of my competition ammo to my barrel and also clean them with rag and tiny amount of oil just to lube them ( I learned it from this forum - some guys prefer F1 racing car oil). it doesnt take too long to do but it give me more confidence on my ammo, I would have it bless with holy water too if needed and put cross in the bullet tip to take care of vampire...

[kmitchl]

As others have pointed out a 125 pf load probably won't cycle the gun reliably in all situations. I load minor to 135 to 140 pf to make sure the gun cycles espeially in awkward shooting positions where I can't provide as good a backstop as shooting standing freestyle. Those evil match directors like to put you in those types of situations.