Jeff226

I am pretty sure that CZ doesn't put a decocker on non firing pin safety models for "safety" reasons. In theory if the hammer fails to stop at decock the gun still won't go off. You can buy an SP-01 and cajunize it if you want a decocker gun.

As long as we try to pretend major and minor in the same division adds value, we will continue to have these problems. Probably best answer ^^

I am willing to agree we are saying about the same thing. Then it is good they have a combine all option for you.

I shoot pistols so I don't compete against PCCs and am not concerned about how PCCs have to start as long as it is safe.

I agree level 1 matches should be as friendly to everyone as possible (within reasonable limits) as this is where we theoretically gain/attract/maintain participation. I can also see a SS guy comparing results against production. I just don't think jumping through hoops to give revolver shooters some false notion they are competitive against PROD/SS/L10 is in the top 100 problems USPSA has. SS is the only division left where DVC sort of works. Sometimes you get screwed choosing major. If we could finally toss DVC that problem could be solved also.

I'd rather have less stages than less rounds per stage but I can't see rushing through abbreviated matches to add a second wave doubling revenue. Quite the opposite. In addition to the people put off by low round counts, who is going to want to shoot in an afternoon wave in the summer especially in the south? There is no way I would be entering many matches full of 20 rd stages. Most people I know feel the same way...part of the reason we don't do more IDPA. I am already questioning the value of standing around for 30 minutes to an hour per stage to shoot 28-32 rounds.

Who cares? Everybody in the division is shooting the same stage. You typed out the plan for an 8 round shooter so apparently even that stage caters to them as required by the rules. Most PCC and open shooters can shoot the stage without reloading at all. That doesn't affect people in revolver division. If you "want" to shoot more rounds, then pick a division/gun that allows more rounds. I don't really "want" to shoot at swingers and crawl in tunnels but it is allowed in the rules. Maybe I "want" to shoot that whole stage without reloading in limited...oh well.

Yes, but you know what I meant, more than 8 scoring hits can not be required from a position...which means all divisions are "catered" to in course design that follows the rules. No division requires a capacity below 8. "Pick the division you like and shoot in it". If a match favors limited and you are shooting single stack...so what? All of the other single stacks are shooting the same course. I thought everybody here wanted locap for the challenge/competition anyhow.

That balance doesn't matter. With the 8 round maximum shots from a position, all matches cater to all allowed capacities. The only thing keeping CO at 10 rounds would have accomplished is to make less people want to shoot it and/or more people continuing to push for it to be 140mm. If people overwhelmingly want hicap divisions (which they do) having one HiCap and 7 low cap isn't going to result in 16% hicap and 84% lowcap shooters...not even close.

This is hilarious. page 4 of the thread I linked just before your post: Brooke: ^^^ Needs to be done now!! WHAT???? Were you crawling to your wife for a new gun back then? Having some problems being competitive? Not very good? LOL, the hypocrisy!! Yes, Jeff is not alone apparently. Page 3 - looks like page 4 wasn't an accident: Dewey: Still a good/relevant post!!

Whining? I am just stating my opinion and responding to the haters. Here is one of many threads where Admins, Mods, and most of the people in this thread are stating the same opinion. Most of these opinions are based on information that appears to be factual to some degree. There are other threads where the numbers are looked at in detail. Since so many people share the same opinion and the facts strongly support it, I think it would be beneficial to fix it. Do you disagree with the opinions? I think good divisions matter to everybody.

Since you are reading back you can probably find where I said I own/shoot .40s. You can probably also read again why I am perpetuating it...it shouldn't be confusing. Have you been chirping against rule changes for 2-3 years? Is it working?

I suggest I can focus on the division I choose to focus on. You can take up the crusade for revolver. This thread was started about limited minor. I don't own any 2011s but why should someone that owns one be shafted on scoring because they picked 9mm over .40?

The science says minor wins against minor in prod and pcc but it doesn't win against major in limited. Scoring is based on PF, not diameter. Your theory would not pass peer review.

It's funny how the story always goes that it is a bad idea to shoot minor in Limited, and don't buy a minor pistol for limited, and you'll be handicapping yourself if you shoot minor UNTIL somebody suggests splitting the two and then all of a sudden minor is competitive if this and that and whatever excuse. If it is good for 3 places at nationals and he would have won shooting major then it isn't competitive. If you can only win with minor at area matches then it isn't competitive. 9mm is not favored by the rules at all. It is just cheaper...and only slightly in some cases if reloading. Any 38 caliber revolver would be just as competitive as a 9mm revolver as long as it has 8rd capacity and moon clips/speed loaders. Any pistol caliber carbine can be loaded to minor and used in PCC - there is no limit on capacity or length You can load any gun on the production list in calibers other than 9mm to minor pf. If that isn't true for all guns then we have limited 10 as another option...where 9mm is not favored. You can load 40 to minor and shoot carry optics.

Yeah, why would you go to a major match and shoot minor pf in Limited...it isn't competitive unless you get lucky with the stages. That is the whole point of the thread.

Ask the people at USPSA HQ...you don't even have to take my word for it. Or Shred, page 1

Having a floor is fine, minor pf is pretty close to off the shelf factory ammo, and it is consistent with IDPA and 3 gun. The computer can handle 100 more divisions, adding one and letting the rest die naturally won't break the system.

Show me the overwhelming demand for revolver major...or even participation numbers that indicate it is popular...and I will consider it. .45 acp anything for that matter.

And you are going to base your opposition to what would be the largest division in USPSA on the unduly literal fact that the book lacks one sentence saying they are separate divisions? That is the great instability?

dup

All of the rules for limited minor are already in the book.

That is how you phrased it this time...we have years of other examples. Besides, you aren't the point...I was trying to give the the other guy a good example of what an insult is.

Why else would you insist that minor stays in a division with a scoring problem making it not competitive? What other reason is there? It isn't bait, it isn't an insult...what is the motivation. You have yet to answer.

Limited minor already exists in every way except as its own division. There is a known scoring problem vs major. This topic isn't even related to some noob showing up with the wrong gear.