Jake Di Vita

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoAj6frTsSs Here is a good protocol on helping low back tweaks. It is hard to critique yourself under load, it requires well developed proprioception. You can also video yourself and review it. I'd rather try to teach myself to Oly lift than not do it at all.

Gah. This is a great attitude in practice. In matches, this road will lead you to ruin.

I personally look at the following: % points - I want this to be around 95% penalties - I want this to be 0 D hits - I want this to be 0, but I don't usually make them up If you have video, I also want as few extra shots as possible. If I go to a match and achieve those 4 things, I will have scored well.

You'll be better served by removing the "vs" in the title. Every stage requires speed AND accuracy. There are no danger stages, there are no speed stages, there are no accuracy stages, there are just stages. Shoot them all the same. Hit the center of the target at a high rate of speed. That will never be a bad strategy.

I will try to respond simply. Shoot minor instead. Or just use it in practice and act like you are shooting minor. Ultimately the idea with this is using different equipment to up your game. You don't need to place the rules on it that you are. I've said it half a dozen times now, the shooter in your example can easily use minor scoring which wipes out the argument you are making. Or once again, Carry Optics can be an avenue to use the dot under a similar ruleset as Production. What is your argument against that?

Yes....what does that have to do with the conversation we are having at the moment?

Yeah it got my attention like the sun does when I look up. I look away immediately.

How much proficiency with a dot do you think you need to be able to notice things with it you don't notice with irons? As soon as you can modify your index so the dot is where you point (just like your irons), you can use it for drills and learn a lot. It don't take more than one dry fire session for someone with a decent index to adjust it. At least it doesn't for me or any of the decent shooters I know who have done it time and time again. You might be talking about high mag capacity and major, I certainly am not. Shoot Open 10 minor for all I care. I am talking about the dot and it's use as a training tool. Period. Full stop. Yes, shot placement is huge...in both divisions. And thank you for your statement that shooting points is easier with major than minor - that was very enlightening. I'm very well aware of how important points are in shooting, I've both lost and won several 14+ HF stages on points. I don't know why you are talking about Limited minor all of a sudden. Once again, where did I say you had to hose targets to learn anything in Open? Actually I specifically said: "Just because you have a dot doesn't mean you need to shoot sloppy. If you live in a minor scored division, do your cross training with minor scoring as well. Nothing wrong with that." If your primary goal is improving your Prod game, who cares where you finish in Open. You aren't trying to win Open division, you are trying to become a better and more well rounded shooter. How is that going to be a problem in cross training for Production? What is the purpose of this endeavor? Is it to win multiple divisions whenever you want or is it to use other platforms to improve the performance of a specific division? To me, the goal is the latter. That doesn't require you go full bore "I'm an Open shooter now so I hose shit and never reload". For that matter, you don't even need to shoot matches to get the benefit from this. Hell, we have Carry Optics now - go shoot that instead of Open and you'll get the same benefits.

For a GM level shooter, it will not take a month to get comfortable with a dot. Not even close. One dry fire session would probably do it. I'm also not saying to do it in the middle of the season while you are prepping for nats. This is something I would probably do during the off season if I wasn't switching to open for a full season. A month or two to put some serious work in, then back to your home division to work on applying what you've learned. I also don't think there is a huge difference in shot placement required at all. You can't drop points in Prod because minor. You can't drop points in Open because all your competition has the same equipment advantages as you. A slight difference, sure. But certainly that is something that a skilled shooter would know and acknowledge with the division he was shooting. Personally, I don't think that applies to this conversation at all because we are talking about the dot as a training tool, not about how you win matches in different divisions. Just because you have a dot doesn't mean you need to shoot sloppy. If you live in a minor scored division, do your cross training with minor scoring as well. Nothing wrong with that.

I don't know, there are a lot of top level guys that were primarily open shooters at one point that consistently perform well today in iron sighted divisions. JJ, Max, Travis, Shane, Chris, and others. How many rounds have you put through a dot gun in your career out of curiosity? There are clearly some glaring differences in open, but I don't think shooting open will negatively impact your ability to shoot other divisions assuming you are skilled enough to approach shooting each division by its own merits. What I do know is using a dot gives you an amazing amount of feedback about what the gun is doing at all times - I think that is extremely useful information that applies to any division you shoot. It also lets you focus highly on other aspects of the game since the rather large aspect of sight alignment is gone. There certainly may be a small lag time when switching back and forth to get yourself accustomed to using the sights again, but I think its something any sufficiently skilled shooter should be able to do. Back when I was a production shooter, the primary reason I switched to open is because of Tomasie telling me how much more solid it would make the rest of my game. He was completely correct. I personally highly recommend at least some cross training with a dot to any shooter I talk to about it, regardless of their skill level. D to GM.

I'm kind of surprised the RM let it stand if the RO was 10 yards away from you when he called it. Especially if your body was between the RO and the gun, it seems like it would be impossible to be sure of anything except the most gross of violations. If this happened to me, and I was 100% sure of my innocence, I would likely not let this particular RO run me in the future.

I like the majority of what's here, I think that training with a dot is also a vastly under-utilized tool. If you take that as far as competing in Open, the pressure of perfect execution is also at its highest since mistakes are so costly in the division that usually produces the highest hit factor.

You can make pretty much anything work. I wouldn't try to make the gun flatter by changing your load, try paying more attention to the fundamentals of your grip and stance. It is very easy to become lazy behind the gun when you shoot open.

Exactly, and if you're at a major match that's what the sight in / warm up bay is for. Do many matches have a warm up bay ? I've been to several state level matches and have never seen one. Great idea, BTW Every major I've shot in the past two years has had some form of live warm up bay. Maybe it's a southeast thing? It must be, because from my memory I've seen exactly one in the midwest since 2002ish. Trust me, I'd love to be able to warm up with live fire before a match.

Just ordered it. Will post thoughts in the next week or two.

I direct you to post #10 in this thread.

You can feel however you want about it. I've put a significant amount of blood and sweat into this sport, and I take it more seriously than the vast majority of people on the range. A little dry fire helps me towards performing to the best of my ability and it is totally within the rules. I'll try to not get in your way, but I'm doing it whether it annoys you or not.

I definitely try to not get in peoples way. If there's no more room at the safe area and people are waiting, I'll step aside til the need subsides. I love when there are safe areas on every bay.

I like to dryfire for however long it takes for the gun to feel good in my hands. Usually it's at least 15 minutes worth in the safe area before the match.

I yank the gun on a snap cap every single time, I can also shoot very accurately because the movement of the gun doesn't happen until the bullet has left the barrel. The difference between compensation for recoil and flinching can be hundredths of a second. That test by itself doesn't mean very much. I would suggest that OP focuses more on his weak hand practice. I've also found it very helpful to use my weak hand for as many tasks in everyday life as I can. I don't know what division he shoots, but getting his hands on a dot gun to play around with weakhand will also show him exactly what the gun is doing as he is pulling the trigger. Dots are fantastic training tools.

I totally get ensuring the hit. It isn't so much about how long the aiming takes, more about when it starts. My point was that if you are reloading coming into position, you can't possibly be getting on the sights. So that is time that you could be shooting that you aren't. As soon as my leading foot enters the position I will be shooting from, I am aiming (earlier if the situation allows it). My goal is to minimize the time between stopping and shooting. If we look at the bottom video again, it appears that you are getting on the sights right about 2.36 then you shoot at 2.96. I would try to be on the sights by about 1.93 and using the same aiming time shooting by 2.53. Definitely good discussion.

Yeah, absolutely there's tons. Lots of Youtube stuff. I think anything from Mike Burgener is fantastic for the actual lifts. For increasing range of motion and also tons of analysis to the whys and hows of how humans are meant to move, anything from Kelly Starrett.

If you want to increase your short explosive acceleration, I recommend you start oly lifting. Very complex movement, expect to invest a lot of time and energy learning, but well worth the effort. A knowledgeable coach is great, but you can learn it on your own if you really want to...I did.

I tend to agree with what Cha_Lee is saying. One thing I think we should also consider in that video is the amount of time it takes after getting into position before you fire. On the bottom video, assuming you had the gun mounted when you came into position, the earliest point that you can fire (when your trailing foot leaves the ground) is about 2.03. On the top video you are just extending the gun from the reload at 2.50. So you see a .16 difference from reloading to not reloading, but I see a lot of time that can be saved on the non-reload (or reload early) when you come into position by getting on the sights earlier. Granted that this is on a reasonably challenging 15 yard partial, so even with how I try to get on the sights entering a position I probably wouldn't fire on this particular target the instant my trailing foot left the ground but that would still be the goal. I think you'd also see a wider time gap if the target was less challenging.

My reload ends up pretty much the same regardless of which direction I'm moving. Agreed that everyone needs to try it all out for themselves on the timer.