Online Registration

[JThompson]

Anyone use an online registration into a database that can then be uploaded to Ezwin? I figured someone must have done this already and don't want to reinvent the wheel. We would still do the paper forms too, but it seems like we could save a lot of time this way.

Anyone???

JT

[Codycoyote]

Anyone use an online registration into a database that can then be uploaded to Ezwin? I figured someone must have done this already and don't want to reinvent the wheel. We would still do the paper forms too, but it seems like we could save a lot of time this way.

Anyone???

JT

JT, You guys have a great online registration for your 3 gun, perhaps you could email ezwinscore and see what format you would need to use to import into it.

[ChuckS]

sorry, AD...

Edited February 2, 2010 by ChuckS

[Jim Norman]

Online registration is not a problem. We use an online company that collects the info and I just download it into excel.

I can sort it easily and the shooter gets an automatic confirmation that they are registered.

What I can't do, and so far no one has ventured forth with a quick import function, is get the data into EzWinScore in any method other than just entering it manually. The interface for Ez SUCKS. It is easier if you sort your list and go alphabetically, but the Steel Score Program by World Class Steel is the way to go for data entry. Start typing a name, and it sorts through the database until you get to the name you want and viola, there you are, entered, no click, drag, click, accept, opps, forgot this or that.

It would be great to have a simple import function. Maybe next time Ez gets an major upgrade? So many more of us are using Palm Scoring systems anow and more are likely to in the future.

Jim

[Tim Egan]

We do - but Bruce Gary is the expert.

We register Area 1 competitors using MS access

and use an sql routine to port into ezwinscore.

Get him to chime in here if you can.

[JThompson]

Thanks guys... I think we've just been staying on top of it, so it's not to bad Chris err Alan said he wold send me one for the future though.

JT

[jenlu]

You could also use Shoot'n Score It (SSI) web based match admin.

You just create your match and then you get a link to a web page that

you can paste into your club web, email newsletter, or... and tell shooter

to click there to register. The shooter will then be directed to the SSI web

and can sign up for your match without any further action from you.

SSI also allows you to keep track of payments, waiting lists, squad (both user self-sign up squads and VIP

squads) and distribute the work of managing the match over a team/group of organizers where

those that are assigned as admin can do 'anything' with the match whereas those assigned

as 'staff' only can administer competitors and enter scores.

At any stage you can generat xls or cvs or pdf reports with everything from competitor

lists, squad list, pre-preprinted scorecards with competitor name/squad info etc.

The later you could then use to import into whatever you need if you do not wish

to use SSI for the full match management.

SSI is fully Unicode/UTF-8 compliant from start so no issues with charset from

that side.

/ Jens

[j33716]

Matchsignup.org is now active and the Monster Match is using it for online registration plus payment via credit card. As the registrations come in they are entered into the ezwinscore program and then uploaded into the uspsa online squadding. While using excel or a csv to import the shooters in one batch sounds good the problem is not everyone signs up on the same day. The advantage of collecting via credit card is the fact that you get funds long before the match day and they are automatically deposited and the shooter gets a confirmation immediately. The other big advantage is that the apps are typed and readable.

Take a look as we will be using MatchSignUp.org for more matches in the future

Edited August 26, 2010 by j33716

[MoNsTeR]

Online registration is not a problem. We use an online company that collects the info and I just download it into excel.

I can sort it easily and the shooter gets an automatic confirmation that they are registered.

What I can't do, and so far no one has ventured forth with a quick import function, is get the data into EzWinScore in any method other than just entering it manually. The interface for Ez SUCKS. It is easier if you sort your list and go alphabetically, but the Steel Score Program by World Class Steel is the way to go for data entry. Start typing a name, and it sorts through the database until you get to the name you want and viola, there you are, entered, no click, drag, click, accept, opps, forgot this or that.

It would be great to have a simple import function. Maybe next time Ez gets an major upgrade? So many more of us are using Palm Scoring systems anow and more are likely to in the future.

Jim

I'm at work right now on a project to import into EZWS databases from text files, as part of a larger project to test integrated online registration in the ECO section.

When I have something ready for beta testing, I will of course make it available to the Enosverse.

[j33716]

All the work being done or tried to import mass files just seems not worth it. Nobody signs up in mass, you sign up individually.

If you could import a record or email it may work better than mass import.

We have found using online registration works great. As the entries come in they are sent ot the stats person in email. The emails are then entered into the EZWinScore a few at a time. Everthing is easy this way and no new programs are needed.

We just had a match fill 250 shooters in 5 days (4 months in advance of the match)

Money in the bank and match is well on its way.

Vendors are happy deposits are done.

Budget is done.

Try Matchsignup.org for your next match.

[Jim Norman]

You are partially correct. The competitors all sign up one at a time. We do this by using a third party webbased form.

However, I, ME, the Stats Guy, enters each and every shooter into the match. If I could take the excel report generated by FormSpring and import it directly into EzWin, it would save a lot of scroll click, oh crap, not that one, the one below, and crap I clicked between names and just plain PIA dumb ass work.

I have to enter about 65-80 shooters for each match. the pre-reg allows me to do this the night before so that the Palms are loaded and ready to go. I still need to convert the 'Walk-Ons' to real people and the scroll point and click is still a PIA. With a netbook I can sit at the range with my match ready to go and enter the walk-ons as they show, and make the needed corrections, then take just a few minutes to beam all this info out to the Palms. Beam it back at the end of the match and in about 15 minutes I can have the scores DONE. I just don't understand the resistance to making populating a match easier.

Just my opinion. eeryone else is entitled to theirs no matter how wrong it may be

[Jim Norman]

Double Tap. deleted

Edited November 19, 2010 by Jim Norman

[j33716]

Agreed, It's interesting that the task has not been solved after all this time and all this talk.

A lot has to do with the database chosen in EZWinScore. I like the program and it works well for us but writing an import script for SQLAnywhere is not easy. Especially with all the checking of entries that has to be done before the import will work without crashing EZWinScore.

Even having a way of looking up a shooter would be nice. Just like in the 'Enter Scores' where you can pick a shooter with a number they could make a lookup by number in registration instead of having to scroll thru everyone.

You are partially correct. The competitors all sign up one at a time. We do this by using a third party webbased form.

However, I, ME, the Stats Guy, enters each and every shooter into the match. If I could take the excel report generated by FormSpring and import it directly into EzWin, it would save a lot of scroll click, oh crap, not that one, the one below, and crap I clicked between names and just plain PIA dumb ass work.

I have to enter about 65-80 shooters for each match. the pre-reg allows me to do this the night before so that the Palms are loaded and ready to go. I still need to convert the 'Walk-Ons' to real people and the scroll point and click is still a PIA. With a netbook I can sit at the range with my match ready to go and enter the walk-ons as they show, and make the needed corrections, then take just a few minutes to beam all this info out to the Palms. Beam it back at the end of the match and in about 15 minutes I can have the scores DONE. I just don't understand the resistance to making populating a match easier.

Just my opinion. eeryone else is entitled to theirs no matter how wrong it may be

Edited November 22, 2010 by j33716

[wgnoyes]

Agreed, It's interesting that the task has not been solved after all this time and all this talk.

A lot has to do with the database chosen in EZWinScore. I like the program and it works well for us but writing an import script for SQLAnywhere is not easy. Especially with all the checking of entries that has to be done before the import will work without crashing EZWinScore.

Well, but you'd have the same issue with any other database access method, I should think. USPSA uses a msaccess-based front-end processor to register people for the nationals, and that program includes a macro to populate a ezws match file with the competitor names and details. (It doesn't do it CLEANLY, and there are always problems the stats officers have to clean up at the match, but it's possible.)

To me it would seems like it would just (yeah I know, "JUST") be a .asp or .php (or vb or c# or f# or whatever) loop that reads the next record from the desired input source of data and does a SQL INSERT to the competitornames_db tables within the ezws match file through an ODBC connection. The Adaptive Server Anywhere subsystem has to be up and running, of course, but that's easily managed without having to bring up ezws itself by creating a desktop shortcut that points to a target of C:\USPSA\EzWinScore\rteng9.exe -n infofile, with a startup target of C:\USPSA\EzWinScore. I have that shortcut for this defined on every system I use to score a match in case I have to go in manually through access to fix some internal problem caused by frontend processors like this, as I had to do this year at the back-to-back nationals in Vegas.

So if you're going to write something like this, take the extra time to make sure EVERYTHING that needs to be filled in GETS FILLED IN, and stuff that doesn't, DOESN'T. (I'm always nervous when I score a nationals and see that a whole lot of competitors have been registered in the pistol match for shotgun or rifle!)

[MoNsTeR]

Agreed, It's interesting that the task has not been solved after all this time and all this talk.

A lot has to do with the database chosen in EZWinScore. I like the program and it works well for us but writing an import script for SQLAnywhere is not easy. Especially with all the checking of entries that has to be done before the import will work without crashing EZWinScore.

Well, but you'd have the same issue with any other database access method, I should think. USPSA uses a msaccess-based front-end processor to register people for the nationals, and that program includes a macro to populate a ezws match file with the competitor names and details. (It doesn't do it CLEANLY, and there are always problems the stats officers have to clean up at the match, but it's possible.)

To me it would seems like it would just (yeah I know, "JUST") be a .asp or .php (or vb or c# or f# or whatever) loop that reads the next record from the desired input source of data and does a SQL INSERT to the competitornames_db tables within the ezws match file through an ODBC connection. The Adaptive Server Anywhere subsystem has to be up and running, of course, but that's easily managed without having to bring up ezws itself by creating a desktop shortcut that points to a target of C:\USPSA\EzWinScore\rteng9.exe -n infofile, with a startup target of C:\USPSA\EzWinScore. I have that shortcut for this defined on every system I use to score a match in case I have to go in manually through access to fix some internal problem caused by frontend processors like this, as I had to do this year at the back-to-back nationals in Vegas.

So if you're going to write something like this, take the extra time to make sure EVERYTHING that needs to be filled in GETS FILLED IN, and stuff that doesn't, DOESN'T. (I'm always nervous when I score a nationals and see that a whole lot of competitors have been registered in the pistol match for shotgun or rifle!)

You don't even need to pre-start the server, you can construct an ODBC connect string that does it for you as long as the driver is installed. I have a proof-of-concept written in Java that does this. After that I agree the right way to get the data in is via SQL.

Work on this project is moving slowly due to my lack of free time, but it will get done!

Edited December 2, 2010 by MoNsTeR

[Tom Freeman]

Try Matchsignup.org for your next match.

I would like to use it for my next match...

I registered on the site as a Match Director. I have tried to add my local matches and play around with it some, but as of now all I can do it look at other matches.

Is there something I am missing here?

I am just wanting to use it (or something like it) for local matches and the Regional Steel Challenge match I am running in late May. I dont even mind paying for the service of the site/software. Is there anything else out there that I dont know about?

[Graham Smith]

USPSA now has an online squadding registration which can be downloaded to (Not-So-)EzWinScore. Has anyone tried using this?

I'm wondering if it would be possible to just set up a single squad just to be able to get people to register on-line, the sort out the squadding on the day of the match.

Never mind - I can see now that this is not what it's there for.

Edited July 5, 2011 by Graham Smith

[Graham Smith]

What I can't do, and so far no one has ventured forth with a quick import function, is get the data into EzWinScore in any method other than just entering it manually.

I now know enough about EzWinScore to be able to venture an opinion - it can be done but it's not straight forward.

The system used in EzWin uses the registration page to do multiple things. It not only enters shooters into the Match, but it also updates the Master Database at the same time. In addition, it pulls a lot of the information that does get entered from the Master Database.

I think that I now have a good enough grasp of about 85% of this to attempt to create something, but as far as I can tell, it cannot be done without the use of some additional software beyond the EzWin software itself. Right now, I am using a database management tool which is attached to the underlying EzWin database via ODBC. This is allowing me to pull data out and manipulate it separately for things like producing a Winners list with payout information, and doing custom mailing lists and labels. The problem is, even while I may be able to get something working, it may not be practical for others to be able to use this.

[MoNsTeR]

What I can't do, and so far no one has ventured forth with a quick import function, is get the data into EzWinScore in any method other than just entering it manually.

I now know enough about EzWinScore to be able to venture an opinion - it can be done but it's not straight forward.

The system used in EzWin uses the registration page to do multiple things. It not only enters shooters into the Match, but it also updates the Master Database at the same time. In addition, it pulls a lot of the information that does get entered from the Master Database.

I think that I now have a good enough grasp of about 85% of this to attempt to create something, but as far as I can tell, it cannot be done without the use of some additional software beyond the EzWin software itself. Right now, I am using a database management tool which is attached to the underlying EzWin database via ODBC. This is allowing me to pull data out and manipulate it separately for things like producing a Winners list with payout information, and doing custom mailing lists and labels. The problem is, even while I may be able to get something working, it may not be practical for others to be able to use this.

You are definitely correct that additional software is required. At the very least, a tool like SQuirreL can be used to access a match database or masternames database directly. If you had a list of registrations in say, a spreadsheet, and didn't mind constructing the SQL statements and running them manually, then that would be all you need. Obviously though for most users this is far too complicated.

I'm near completion on a simple, easy-to-use tool that takes a comma-separated text file containing a particular subset of fields, and imports that into an EZWS match database file as competitor registrations. I chose the list of fields based on what seemed strictly necessary, but it could be expanded to include e.g. multigun support. When it is ready for testing I will publish it here and elsewhere.

[Graham Smith]

I'm near completion on a simple, easy-to-use tool that takes a comma-separated text file containing a particular subset of fields, and imports that into an EZWS match database file as competitor registrations.

I've already worked out a number of things regarding this - enough that I can know where some of the hangups are. If you want to compare notes, PM me.

[Graham Smith]

Well, we had 80+ people show up on Saturday. A few left because it was just too crowded for them. We did manage to finish in a reasonable time but that's almost the breaking point for us. And it seems to be happening with most clubs in the area.

I had asked people to email me if they were coming so I could get some idea of what to expect but only got 46 responses. Of those, 7 were no shows, so less than half the people who were there actually let me know in advance. This makes me wonder if pre-registration has a prayer of working. Never the less, here is what I am thinking of doing:

Send out the match notice and ask people to pre-register. Print out score sheets for those who pre-register and have them at the match. Here's where it gets messy and where I need help. Lets say that we've set the limit at 80 shooters and have 65 pre-registrations and only 60 of them have shown up. There are 25 people have shown up who were not pre-registered.

--At what point do you say that the pre-registrations who have not shown up yet get pulled to make room for others?

--How do you handle those who show up who were not pre-registered? Put them on a waiting list and take them on a first come basis?

--How do you avoid offending regular shooters who are used to just showing up at the last minute and shooting?

[Jim Norman]

Graham,

We use an online form to get the information, (Formspring.com) and we usually have about 15% no show and about the same number of walk-on as No-Show. Currently running 90+ shooters! (at least at the last two matches)

We too have been wondering how to cap a match.

1) Must register in advance, no walk-ons. This has an unintended consequence of registration by "I might want to shoot, but I am not sure I can make it, but I'd better register just in case"

2) Close sign up at a given number, first come-first served, Pre-registered included, OK you sent in your form, but you still have to be here by 0900 to register. How do we control that? we can't see you all at the same instant in time and we can't get you all squared away in under 45 minutes.

3) Simply stop taking registration when a certain number is reached, Those that registered online in line one, they get signed up first then the rest get to sign in until the match is full. Close the pre-reg line at 0930, and anyone not in the line at that time has to go to the walk-on window.

How many people you can put through a match depends on the time it takes one average shooter to shoot your longest stage times the number of shooters you have in the match. Are your shooters willing to stay until 6pm to tear it all down? Do you have regular groups that shoot half a match and scoot? Track the names of the No-Shows, early departures. Issue them an ultimatum. Register and don't show up 2x in a row, you become a walk-on, leave early 2x in a row and you also become a walk-on, no pre-reg for you. There has to be a way to get off the walk-on only list, maybe three matches in a row where you show, work and stay?

It is a difficult question. We want new shooters, we in fact need them, but how do we handle them? We certainly don't want all our long term regulars to get ticked and leave, who would run the match? build the match, teach/mentor the new guys? How would any of us ever get to go to a different match where we were not already a regular?

[Graham Smith]

How many people you can put through a match depends on the time it takes one average shooter to shoot your longest stage times the number of shooters you have in the match. Are your shooters willing to stay until 6pm to tear it all down? Do you have regular groups that shoot half a match and scoot? Track the names of the No-Shows, early departures. Issue them an ultimatum. Register and don't show up 2x in a row, you become a walk-on, leave early 2x in a row and you also become a walk-on, no pre-reg for you. There has to be a way to get off the walk-on only list, maybe three matches in a row where you show, work and stay?

To quote an old saw, "If it were easy, everybody could do it." I've been thinking about this for two days now and there's simply no solution I can see that works for everyone, and many solutions become a housekeeping nightmare really quickly.

We cannot fire a shot before 10am (range rules) and have to leave one range (100yd) open for rifle shooters and pretty much need to be torn down by around 4pm. That gives us 6 hours to hold a new shooter check, do the briefing, shoot all the stages, and tear down. That's tight. My calculations on this are that we can run 6 squads of 12 shooters and be able to finish on time. If we have more than that we are into 'overtime'.

One thing is certain, I need to start keeping a running tally of who attended what matches, who pre-registered and came, and who pre-registered and didn't come. EzWinScore doesn't have that ability because each match is a separate database, so it's going to be up to me to build such a list separately. I guess I know what I'm going to be doing this weekend.

I know that each club is a separate entity with it's own rules and practices, but it would be nice to come to some kind of consensus among ourselves as to how we are going to handle the growing number of shooters. If it gets out of hand, we are going to start loosing the regulars.

[Jim Norman]

Graham,

With the form we use to register online, I have a list available of who registered for the match in Excel. I can easily copy it, add a column named No-Show and sort, then do this each month for a while. It will start to build up a list of people that A Shoot and B register and don't shoot.

I am not a wiz at Excel, but I am betting I can do this although probably in a mangled manner, but if I can do it, some computer savvy person can certainly do it.

As for throu-put at at match. 6 stages, 45 minutes per is 4-1/2 hours. If you are ready to go at 1000, you should be done at 230, this leaves 90 minutes to put it all away. Make sure that you have solid stages, at least three real ROs per squad, and tell everyone that they need to stay around and help tear down the match. If you can't have a couple regulars on each squad, get at least one to each stage somehow to direct traffic at teardown.

45 minutes per stage means you get 1 minute to shoot, 2 minutes to score and reset, 12 shooters is 36 minutes, you have 5 minutes to read the WSB and walk the stage and 4 minutes to get to the next stage. Make sure you have your designers keep this in mind. One move per stage, no tricks unless they are really really solid!

[Graham Smith]

If you are ready to go at 1000

We actually don't start the match till 11am to allow for new shooter orientation and a few late arrivals. As to stages, our stages tend to go fairly fast - even the field courses. Of course there are some people who take a minute or more on a field course, but there's others that are done in 20 sec so it averages out.

I'm still hung up on when to stop waiting for pre-registrations and start squadding walk-ons. My gut says 10:30 should give us enough time. I know that this is going to tick off some people but it'll tick off more if we don't get this under control.

Edited July 18, 2011 by Graham Smith