Nik Habicht Posted October 2, 2003 Share Posted October 2, 2003 Ron, I don't know if this would work, but when Todd Jarrett was schooling us about gunsmithing during his class he suggested a chain saw sharpening stone or wheel in a dremel to change the contour of the disconnector notch in a 1911. I don't know if that would be the proper tool for this, but figured I'd throw the info out there for you "handy types" to evaluate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted October 3, 2003 Author Share Posted October 3, 2003 Thanks Nik and Esa1195. I think the flat nose 122 bullet from Laser Cast might be the ticket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted October 4, 2003 Author Share Posted October 4, 2003 Yahoo...I am stoked. The problem is fixed and it was oh so simple. Don't know how I missed it. I actually feel a bit stupid, blush. I was wiping the pistol down after shooting and the cleaning rag snagged on the very front edge of the rail on the bottom of the slide right where the breech face starts (not sure of the terminology but I think I am close). There was a nasty burr on each side of the rail and machine marks on the very bottom of the breech face. I don't know how I missed these when I polished the rail. Following reassembly I cycled a few rounds by hand and guess what? After the round pops out of the mag and into the chamber, the area with the burrs was in contact with the next round in the magazine. I disassembled the pistol and removed the burrs with a hard Arkansas stone, then I made a little radius on each side of the rail where the breech face begins. A little polishing with a 4,000 grit tape and bingo, problem solved. Now when I shoot the gun, the top round only moves forward about 1/16 to 3/32 of an inch, probably from recoil. I am as happy as a pig in slop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted October 4, 2003 Share Posted October 4, 2003 Ah HA! Now it makes more sense. When we were messing with your gun last Saturday, I noticed some scratches on the top round in the magazine each time we ejected it. My gun has never made those scratches. With those burrs, your slide was dragging the next round forward after it had stripped the one on top. I'm still going to go look at my seven-five, because I just like stripping and groping it. (al la Ahhnold) Call CZ and give 'em the news. For the record, mine has over 6,000 rounds through it and it hasn't puked yet. I'm likin' this lil gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted October 5, 2003 Share Posted October 5, 2003 What did they do years ago when everybody was shooting 9x21 major P-9's in open? Aren't they the same as CZ's? Bill Nesbitt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted October 5, 2003 Share Posted October 5, 2003 I dunno, Bill. I've thought about that question plenty. I was mostly searching for a better trigger mechanism than the stock unit. But, it seems like the S_Is came on the market and the whole TZ, P9 genre just disappeared. I still find myself wondering exactly when the gun is going to fire some times. It only bugs me on targets where a lot of accuracy is required. It's wierd, I can shoot different 1911s all day long and not have the probem. But, switch to the CZ and I can't hit anything past 20 yards with out placing all my concentration on trigger control. I'm thinking it must me the massive amount of over-travel that exists in the CZ platform. I'm probably going to shoot it in IDPA exclusively. It's a good gun for me if I don't try to rock and roll with it. I'm thinking of an overtravel adjustment for the trigger, which feels like a trampoline to me right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted October 5, 2003 Author Share Posted October 5, 2003 Sam: The trigger is just full of take up, creep, and over travel. That combined with the long reset make it substantially different than any decent 1911 trigger. My understanding is the old P9 guns had a SA trigger akin to the one in the CZ Champion of today, but I could be wrong. I think folks who shoot the CZ SA only Champion triggers don't have near the take up and over travel, and I hear they are more crisp. If I hadn't spent 20+ years shooting a revolver, I would probably not even shoot the CZ. The benefit that I get from the great ergonomics will hopefully out weigh the learning curve that I am facing with the unique CZ trigger. I too really have to watch my fire control on anything over about 8-10 yards or tight shots. In fact, as you witnessed, my fire control needs improvement at 3 yards, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted October 5, 2003 Share Posted October 5, 2003 The trigger is just full of take up, creep, and over travel. LOL! Yeah, it's as good as trigger full of take up, creep, and over travel can be. Way better than a Ruger P-85 or some crappy trigger like that. If I go ahead and do the trigger work, it's just going to be an "IDPA only" ESP gun. That's OK, It still pretty sweet. I'll get a safety I can hit too, while I'm at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear1142 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 Ron, Congratulations, I hope it works for you. If you are able, can you post a picture. I'd like to see exactly where you polished. Thanks, Erik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted October 6, 2003 Author Share Posted October 6, 2003 Sam: Gee Sam, I just made a resolution to devote myself 100% to USPSA Production. I even took the C'More off of my Open blaster and I sent it in for refurbishing. I am "between" revolvers and my Baer is in hibernation. It's Production all the way until spring or Production Master, which ever comes first. Between the two of us, we ought to get these CZ pistols pretty well figured out. Why are you going ESP instead of SSP? Just gotta tinker don't you? I hear CZ makes an little longer magazine release. Might be a worth while change? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted October 7, 2003 Share Posted October 7, 2003 You guys are right, the old open-division P9's and TZ's have a single-action trigger which is about as good as it gets on any pistol. 18-oz break with a 16-oz return spring means FAST. One of the reason why E. Grauffel likes his gun the way it is. Years ago I won a Springfield P9 in 40 and I hated the double-action trigger. Traded for a G20 in 10mm. BTW the TZ slide speed is MUCH faster in Open and they feed very nicely. dvc - eric - a28026. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted October 8, 2003 Share Posted October 8, 2003 Thanks Eric, it's nice to hear that a CZ can have a good trigger. I wonder how I can tweak mine to get it more managable? Ron, as you know, my logic is sometimes convoluted. (By the time I get done answering this you my be sorry you asked.) I equate SSP with Production Division because of the requirement for a double action first shot. If I go tweaking on the trigger, I can't shoot the gun in Production Division anymore. So, if I don't have to practice a double action first shot because I'm not shooting Production, then I may as well put a larger safety on it, which I also can't do in Production Division, and start cocked and locked in ESP with the same pistol that I've been shooting. The larger safety isn't a luxury if I start cocked. My thumb hits the frame about a half-inch in front of the stock safety. I've been shooting this blaster for well over a year and I doubt if I've actually engaged the safety 50 times. Right now, I am quite a bit quicker with a DA than SA first shot because I don't have to go hunting for the safety. I know it sounds weird. Such is my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omen Posted November 22, 2003 Share Posted November 22, 2003 Ohhh, and I thought I was going nuts when I started getting the same problem! It first started with the CZ-75BD, and continues with the CZ-85Combat (which I'm now using for Production). Aarrggg... When the gun works fine, I end up with a Master score. When it screws up... I don't. Thanks, guys - I'm passing this thread to my gunsmith, since this is a little over my head (no gunsmithing knowledge or experience here). Hopefully he'll understand what ya'all talking about, and will be able to replicate the solution on my guns... Thanks again! Damian P.s. how big is Production in the US? (I'm in Canada) I'm thinking about starting to drive down to some US matches starting next year (after I get all that stupid BATF paperwork), but I don't want to drive down, and find myself put into Std, with no other production shooters there... (or is this a wrong thread to post this question in? Sorry, don't mean to hijack it ;-) ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dv8 Posted April 13, 2004 Share Posted April 13, 2004 Ron, I had the same problem until a couple of hours ago, when I followed the procedure you described and the gun seems to work much better now, at least while cycling the slide manualy. I'll have a chance to check it out at a match tomorrow night. Interestingly, when I looked at the breech face and the railway, I did not see any burrs or machine marks, but I decided to give it a try anyway because I really like my 85 Combat and the idea of giving it up did not feel right. So I just smoothed the spot between breech face and railway and polished it. I did not expect it would make much difference because it was so easy, but it did! Now I too feel kinda stupid because I lost so many points while shooting this gun and having to adjust my plans to stick to some weird number of rounds I'd have to load in my mags. Then if anything woulg go wrong while shooting a stage and would throw my plan off, I was really screwed being out of synch with the number of rounds I planned for every magazine... Well, hopefully it's all in the past, and I don't have to buy a Glock. Well, may be I do, but... heck, you know what I'm talking about! Thanks a lot for the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcmios Posted May 12, 2004 Share Posted May 12, 2004 A good CZ smith is in Iowa, Miossi Gun Works, they do real nice work on CZ actions. Also if you buy a Promag for the cz75 in 40 caliber they work great with 9mm and hold 13or 14 rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viper 7 Posted February 1, 2005 Share Posted February 1, 2005 Nice slide show of a DIY trigger job on a DA CZ: http://home.kc.rr.com/bsmith1952/img/Guns/...ail/detail.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blsexton Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Great thread, thanks all fo the info. One thing I too have to do, as many of you noted, is load my CZ75b ammo WAY short, like 1.060" OAL with 115gr PRecisions due to the lack of freebore. I called CZ and if you send them your bbl they will deepen the chamber for free if you ask! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Great thread, thanks all fo the info.One thing I too have to do, as many of you noted, is load my CZ75b ammo WAY short, like 1.060" OAL with 115gr PRecisions due to the lack of freebore. I called CZ and if you send them your bbl they will deepen the chamber for free if you ask! Ah- another oldie but goody that just won't die Geez 9x19 - talk about resurecting the dead! Halloween was yesterday. So - you shooting hubby's 85 combat now, or did you buy your own CZ? Regards, d. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 The CZ and Tanfogio can be great SSP and ESP guns. My Tangfolio Elite Match Witness is perfect for ESP and the triggers can be very excellent. They do need a working over, sharp edges mag specs and that stuff, but for the price the are sweet. I won the HOA at the Oregon State IDPA Championships with my Tanfoglio after only shooting it for a week, I can't say any higher dollar 1911/2011 9mm shoots any better (and I have shot lots of them.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 I think I am gonna cry... I just got off of the phone with Mike at CZ. Apparantly this is a known issue with some pistols (not all) and there is no fix. The guys at the shop have tried different magazines, heavier springs, polishing parts, yadda, yadda yadda, to no avail. There is absolutely no fix and the pistol is freaking worthless for IPSC competition. I'd like to shove it up someone's.... To make matters worse, even if I want to sell it and take a hose job, how do I peddle it in good concious knowing the thing is worthless?I called CZ again. They tell me the problem I described is not considered a malfunction. If it's any consolation, CZ's also have the dreade RSJ (random stovepipe jam) that no human on earth has ever understood to this day........ I'll shoot hundreds of rounds no problem out of my CZ-85 and then get five stovepipes in 50 rounds one time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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