bigstick0000 Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 I have started shooting a brazos race gun (awesome gun) and have been using SR4756-8.3 gr with zero bullets. I am usingWSR primers and am experiencing failure to ignite of about 1 out of 20 primers. It appears that the firing pin is striking the primers fairly decent. I fire them a second time and they always ignite. Anyone help me with a possible solution? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JThompson Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 I have started shooting a brazos race gun (awesome gun) and have been using SR4756-8.3 gr with zero bullets. I am usingWSR primers and am experiencing failure to ignite of about 1 out of 20 primers. It appears that the firing pin is striking the primers fairly decent. I fire them a second time and they always ignite. Anyone help me with a possible solution? thanks Are the primers fully seated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 Seat them a little firmer, if they always go on the second hit it sounds like the primers aren't seated fully. If it was something in the gun it would probably be more frequent, and you would have some that didn't go on the second hit eventually. You really don't "need" rifle primers, regular pistol primers are a little more forgiving in this regard. Unless you load a bunch of small rifle stuff and want to standardize primers I would use pistol primers. That said, at least 80% of my competitive shooting in 9mm, Super, and 40 has been done with rifle primers and aside from a high primer two or three times in the last 3 years or debugging a new gun I have had zero issues running rifle primers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 +3 Primers likely aren't getting fully seated...which often means below flush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 +4 - likely high primers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Moore Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 are you using an extended firing pin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbs007 Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 High primers Happens to me with brand new Starline brass when loading a couple of hours before a match Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigstick0000 Posted November 5, 2008 Author Share Posted November 5, 2008 (edited) Would using pistol primers eliminate the problem? Im using new starline brass also Edited November 5, 2008 by bigstick0000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JThompson Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 Would using pistol primers eliminate the problem? Im using new starline brass also They still need to be seated properly, but you would be less likely to get a ftf. Also pistol seat a bit easier... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 They still need to be seated properly, but you would be less likely to get a ftf. Also pistol seat a bit easier... Actually, just the opposite - the softer cup is more likely to deform without seating the primer deep enough for the anvil to do its job. The answer is - load the right primer properly. New Starline brass seats easier for me that once or twice fired. Then the primer pockets ease up a hair, and its easier again.... And then, later, after 10 or so firings... it gets real easy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markwilliston Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 Could one of you guys that has both the rifle and pistol primers measure them for depth? I was told that rifle primers are longer in depth, and therefore harder to get seated below flush. Just curious My .40 std gun never hiccuped until I tried rifle primers, then I was getting a fail to fire every couple hundred rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JThompson Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 They still need to be seated properly, but you would be less likely to get a ftf. Also pistol seat a bit easier... Actually, just the opposite - the softer cup is more likely to deform without seating the primer deep enough for the anvil to do its job. The answer is - load the right primer properly. New Starline brass seats easier for me that once or twice fired. Then the primer pockets ease up a hair, and its easier again.... And then, later, after 10 or so firings... it gets real easy... I dunno... pistol seat easier for me... maybe I'm just smashing them. lol As to my comment about lighting them off... if he is getting a light strike the pistols will help that because they are softer... that's what I was getting at. ;/) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Neill Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 Large rifle primers are taller than large pistol primers, but small rifle and small pistol are the same dimension. Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigstick0000 Posted November 6, 2008 Author Share Posted November 6, 2008 are you using an extended firing pin? i don't know how to tell, which one should I be using? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbs007 Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 Even with extended firing pin you'll still get an FTF with high primers. I'm using a Limcat XL firing pin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimini Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 I have started shooting a brazos race gun (awesome gun) and have been using SR4756-8.3 gr with zero bullets. I am usingWSR primers and am experiencing failure to ignite of about 1 out of 20 primers. It appears that the firing pin is striking the primers fairly decent. I fire them a second time and they always ignite. Anyone help me with a possible solution? thanks You have high primers. More pressue on the handle when you set the primer. If you can scrape your nail across the bottom and "feel" the primer, it's too high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimini Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 I have started shooting a brazos race gun (awesome gun) and have been using SR4756-8.3 gr with zero bullets. I am usingWSR primers and am experiencing failure to ignite of about 1 out of 20 primers. It appears that the firing pin is striking the primers fairly decent. I fire them a second time and they always ignite. Anyone help me with a possible solution? thanks My question is how do you make major with that load? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcornl Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 I am having the same problem as above and I have meticulously checked the primer seating. Just loaded a 100 tonight making sure everyone is seated properly as well as measuring how far the primer sits in the pocket. I am also using new starline 38SC, WSR primers. My small rifle primers will actually seat about 3 to 5 thousands below the rim. Even with checking every single round, I still get FTF, in about the same frequency. I recently changed all of the internal parts to SVI sear, hammer, trigger, disconnector, and EGW titanium hammer strut and mainspring cap. With the previous steel hammer strut, cap, etc I never had this problem with a 17lb mainspring. I even upped the mainspring to a 19.5 lb mainspring and new firing pin spring making sure the channel is clean and clear and no change. I am ordering an extended firing pin just to be sure. The fact that I did not have this problem before the new trigger group leads me to believe the hammer is not hitting the pin hard enough. When it FTF, I check the round and it is a light hit on the primer. A second hit on the same spot will send it on its way. If I rechamber and the pin does not hit the same spot, it will take another try to make it go. Any help with whether or not the extended firing pin will help, or any other suggestions welcome. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 I am having the same problem as above and I have meticulously checked the primer seating. Just loaded a 100 tonight making sure everyone is seated properly as well as measuring how far the primer sits in the pocket. I am also using new starline 38SC, WSR primers. My small rifle primers will actually seat about 3 to 5 thousands below the rim. Even with checking every single round, I still get FTF, in about the same frequency. I recently changed all of the internal parts to SVI sear, hammer, trigger, disconnector, and EGW titanium hammer strut and mainspring cap. With the previous steel hammer strut, cap, etc I never had this problem with a 17lb mainspring. I even upped the mainspring to a 19.5 lb mainspring and new firing pin spring making sure the channel is clean and clear and no change. I am ordering an extended firing pin just to be sure. The fact that I did not have this problem before the new trigger group leads me to believe the hammer is not hitting the pin hard enough. When it FTF, I check the round and it is a light hit on the primer. A second hit on the same spot will send it on its way. If I rechamber and the pin does not hit the same spot, it will take another try to make it go. Any help with whether or not the extended firing pin will help, or any other suggestions welcome. Thanks Is the new hammer considerably lighter than the old hammer? How has it worked with the 19.5lb mainspring? Something to check, but not terribly common, is to make sure that that mainspring or the cap isn't dragging in the MS housing. I had a problem like this crop up when I replaced the fire control parts on a 2011 and added a new metal mainspring housing. Turns out it wasn't very smooth on the inside and the friction between the cap the MS housing was enough to slow down the hammer. Polished it out and all has been good since. R, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcornl Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 Yes the hammer is lighter than the original. I checked for drag on the mainspring cap as well, and it seems smooth. The pencil test down the barrel send the pencil about 3 feet up. I also adjusted the post travel back a little more and will see if that was the problem. I did have it kind of tight. The 19.5 mainspring made no difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Neill Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 Does it give the problem with factory ammunition? If so, you need to suspect the gun. If not, it has to be the ammo. Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcornl Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 I have not tried it with factory 38 supers but thanks for reminding me. I will try that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 when i do the pincel test it goes a lot more than three feet it hits the ceiling, but to the wsr primers i and a few others have had the same problum and we found that at lease one in 50 will do this i think it is because the primer goes in to hard and the anvil seperates from the basket i load on a 650 and if i seat slow and firm i do not have the problum if yours are going on the second hit than slow and firm should fix your problum (if round rocks when seated on a flat surface the primer is high if not you are ok) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyT Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Primers fuly seated? If so then you probably need to increase the mainspring weight. I have started shooting a brazos race gun (awesome gun) and have been using SR4756-8.3 gr with zero bullets. I am usingWSR primers and am experiencing failure to ignite of about 1 out of 20 primers. It appears that the firing pin is striking the primers fairly decent. I fire them a second time and they always ignite. Anyone help me with a possible solution? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcornl Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 (edited) Yes primers are fully seated even 3 to 5 thousands into the primer cup. I also stated incorrectly, I am using federal rifle primers. Just got done shooting, factory box of remington 130s, not one light hit, actually primer flow with the factory ammo. 38sc FSR and 19.5 lb mainspring, some no matter how many time I hit it, I had to take it out and have it seat on the breach face at a different position to go off. Just got a dawson extended firing pin and installed it. It sends the pencil to the ceiling. I will try tomorrow and hopefully fix the problem. Either I have an extra duty strong primers or the old pin was just not hitting hard enough. WSP primers ran fine in it before, so I just think the light hammer and such is not enough for the rifle cups. I'll let you all know. I also just want to make sure, with the extended firing pin, with the hammer cocked, it is flush, with the hammer down, it will stick out a little. I see that this is fine and should cause no problem unless I try to chamber a round and then let the hammer down slowly by hand, it might set it off. I have no reason to do this, but definitely worth noting, or is this pin too long? Edited February 2, 2009 by alcornl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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