00bullitt Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 (edited) Ok....now please don't give me the answer to send my mags to Howard or Bolens or anyone else to tune my mags. I know they do a wonderful job and have several mags that Howard has tuned,but I prefer to do it myself am looking here for help and guidance. Why are the SPS mags so much different than the SV and STI mags? Is it in the neck area? The 9mm rounds seem to ride up in the tube completely differently than the SV. The SV tubes are smooth as ice when they feed. The SPS starts out on the correct angle and then nose dives. They seem to still be staggered to where the SV tubes are stacked. I've done everything imaginable to the lips and I'm convinced the problem is below that. It seems that the rounds do not stack properly. Will anyone share their knowledge? Please? Edited October 22, 2008 by 00bullitt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chendersby Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Sell the tube to someone who shoots supercomp and buy an SV. Sorry, but that was the only way I could get a bigstick that would work with 9mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Shaping the lips will not help. Reshape the body into a trapezoid shape, or press ribs into the sides of the tube at the front. 9's are tapered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Todd, Call Beven and ask if he'll do it. Otherwise, contact probably Jojo Vidanes at JV Dynamics. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00bullitt Posted October 22, 2008 Author Share Posted October 22, 2008 Sell the tube to someone who shoots supercomp and buy an SV. Sorry, but that was the only way I could get a bigstick that would work with 9mm. I ended up with the SPS tube because the SV 170's are non existent. But yes.....that is the ultimate plan. Shaping the lips will not help.Reshape the body into a trapezoid shape, or press ribs into the sides of the tube at the front. 9's are tapered. That is somewhat along the idea of what I thought needed to happen. Thanks! Any and all info is helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 The problem is in the double to single transition on most of them, it is too wide in the front. Compare that area closely to a mag that works. 9mm in an SPS is a tuned mag only situation and if you want one that will hold up get one from Derek at Millenium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireant Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 The problem is in the double to single transition on most of them, it is too wide in the front. Compare that area closely to a mag that works. 9mm in an SPS is a tuned mag only situation and if you want one that will hold up get one from Derek at Millenium. But Derek won't sell you one if he knows you are going to use it for 9mm. I talked to him several times and it boiled down to it was not 100% and he did not want to sell me something that would be trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boz1911 Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 I'm sure many a SPS owner would like some concrete answers on this subject. Mine ran fine in practice for a few weeks, then it heard a start buzzer and had a coronary.......The stroke has left it's permanent mark. It appears the problem with mine is it nosedives the second round and actually goes under the feed ramp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeamGE Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Ok....now please don't give me the answer to send my mags to Howard or Bolens or anyone else to tune my mags. I know they do a wonderful job and have several mags that Howard has tuned,but I prefer to do it myself am looking here for help and guidance. Why are the SPS mags so much different than the SV and STI mags? Is it in the neck area? The 9mm rounds seem to ride up in the tube completely differently than the SV. The SV tubes are smooth as ice when they feed. The SPS starts out on the correct angle and then nose dives. They seem to still be staggered to where the SV tubes are stacked. I've done everything imaginable to the lips and I'm convinced the problem is below that. It seems that the rounds do not stack properly.Will anyone share their knowledge? Please? Hello 00bullitt, If you want it fixed, call me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00bullitt Posted October 22, 2008 Author Share Posted October 22, 2008 Hello 00bullitt,If you want it fixed, call me. I wanted to try it myself but it looks like it will be headed your way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00bullitt Posted October 23, 2008 Author Share Posted October 23, 2008 A 20 ton hydraulic press and a machined insert and steel wedge and I think I got this thing whipped. Workin like a champ right now. It only holds 29 but it works. Now......how can I heat treat this thing in my oven? Self clean at 650 degrees? Then what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Todd...please tell me you're kidding. Beven just told you he'd fix it. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00bullitt Posted October 23, 2008 Author Share Posted October 23, 2008 I just couldn't leave well enough alone. I just had to try and figure it out. I'm a hands on kinda guy. Now I'm satisfied. Just need to learn how to heat treat and I'm golden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Tell us what you did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00bullitt Posted October 23, 2008 Author Share Posted October 23, 2008 I made a steel insert to support the inside of the mag body while deepening the ribs on the side of the mag where the stack transitions up. I used a formed piece of 1/4" x1.25" steel with a rounded chisel type point. I placed the supported mag in the hydraulic press and set the formed piece of steel I used as a sort of wedge to form the rib and pressed the rib in deeper to the point where it would stabilize the second round in the mag. I then rechecked and repaired exterior dimensions and adjusted and recontoured the feedlips. I also shortened the feed lips. I adjusted the front half of the feedlips out near where the bullet nose is to help guide the round up. I am also running the JL Hardy SS spacer. Follower is a Grams on a Bolens 13 coil spring with 7mm Bolens pad. Capacity is a tight 29. Hope that makes some sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Atta boy!! Sometimes learning isn't cheap or easy but if you are the kind of guy that needs to know how and why I say go for it. If you can figure out how to make it run you can find the room for two more rounds, they will hold 31 rounds and run, for a little while..... 650 isn't anywhere near hot enough, and unless you can do an inert gas heat treat it will be extremely ugly and scaly when done. Lots of info on heat treating out there if you are serious about doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Hope that makes some sense. It does. Thanks for the info. The altered big stick I've seen gets 27 with SPS follower/spring/basepad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00bullitt Posted October 23, 2008 Author Share Posted October 23, 2008 If you can figure out how to make it run you can find the room for two more rounds, they will hold 31 rounds and run, for a little while..... I was able to get 30 reloadable and 31 really tight in it but they did not stack and feed up reliably.After changing the inner dimensions and the neck area it was reduced to 29. C'mon.....share a secret. PM is fine. You say run for a while with 31? What did you mean? They don't hold very long? Too soft? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Sent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Share? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristotle Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 it's cold out here. "knock, knock" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLM Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Glad you got it all sorted out. You did basically what I'd like to do. I want to make / have made a set of dies for reforming / truing tubes. I used to have pretty much unlimited access to a full machine shop when my uncle owned his own business. When he retired... there went my shop. I made a couple quick calls one day about having a set made but the price was, well, pricey and there were concerns over patent infringements. Can't say I blame them. I've been lucky in that all of my SPS's run 28 and all but one runs 29 without fail, knock wood. When I want to get gutsy on a 30 round stage I pull one of my special unobtanium mags out... They're worth every penny I paid for them!!!!!!!! Oh, and give Derrik at Millennium a call on heat treat. I talked to him about having a couple of mine done if I could have had the dies made and the price was quite reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwit Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I think most of us feel the way 00bullitt does. My hat is off to the great gunsmiths and others like HSMITH who do good work and take care of us. But YOU have to understand how your gun works and be able to fix what comes up as it does come up. What choice do you have, send it out to someone everytime something isn't right? You would not be shooting when you want it and it would cost you a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwit Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I think most of us feel the way 00bullitt does. My hat is off to the great gunsmiths and others like HSMITH who do good work and take care of us. But YOU have to understand how your gun works and be able to fix what comes up as it does come up. What choice do you have, send it out to someone everytime something isn't right? You would not be shooting when you want it and it would cost you a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwit Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Any other input on the 9mm mag subject? I for sure need to learn all I can. 00bullitt can you share some of what HSMITH pm'd? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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