ebg3 Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 I've seen a lot of 6" guns built using bushing barrels, has anyone tried fluting a bull barrel to reduce weight? It seems to me the bull barrel will be easier to deal with and cleaner looking than a bushing. Just curious and would like some feed back. EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe4d Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 I am running a 6" bull 40 STI Eagle. I ran 5" bushing barrels for years. The barrel is pretty much a non moving part. I allways like the moving parts to be on the light side and the stationary parts to be on the heavy. I think any gain in transitions from a lighter barrel would be lost in recoil management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Cheely Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 (edited) That's the only way I've built them... They work well if you can get enough weight out. Edited September 7, 2008 by Matt Cheely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 You have to take a massive amount of weight out of the barrel to prevent front sight dip, not worth doing when you can balance a busing barrel so well. Time and money spent to get a product that isn't the equal of a well tuned bushing barrel set up IMO. Been there, done that, made it work, and won't do it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasmap Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 That's the only way I've built them... They work well if you can get enough weight out. "+1 to Matt's bull barrel 6" guns. I have one and it is fantastic. It waaaay outruns me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket35 Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 Here is another one from Progressive Arms... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Merricks Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 This one looks pretty sweet. http://www.canyoncreekcustom.com/Custom_Builds_III.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Merricks Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 To our Smiths, Could you turn the barrel down insted of flutting it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsaxdog Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 great thread....i'm just starting a 6" caspian, shuemann sight-tracker project, and maybe you guys can answer a question. first off, i know it's not supposed to be USPSA legal, but blah, blah, blah, blah.....that's what i think of that, so..... i want to use a 5" recoil spring/reverse plug. i see alot of guns with the spring tunnel cut back, like the one Matt shows. i guess there's no problems with support, and the thing moving around, impinging on the barrel during recoil/lock-down? that's my question.....anybody use that briley one with the ears? seems like it would locate everything better, but does it intefere with the barrel? y'all help me out, i'll buy beer sometime......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 To our Smiths, Could you turn the barrel down insted of flutting it? THe one from progressive arms IS turned down AND fluted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Merricks Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 THe one from progressive arms IS turned down AND fluted. Just now able to see the pic. That is what I was thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken hebert Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 (edited) Seems like a lot of extra effort to achieve basically the same thing... How much time would you, as a smith, have to put into turning down and fluting a bull barrel versus installing a bushing barrel and fitting the bushing? And then of course have to pass along this expense to the end user to cover your time. If you are using a bull to enhance the forward weight bias and non reciprocating mass of a handgun, but then removing weight from it... seems like this could be achieved easier by using a longer or wider dustcover and a heavier weight of guide rod. Edited September 8, 2008 by ken hebert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 Ahh, but the barrel DOES reciprocate........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Merricks Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 If you are using a bull to enhance the forward weight bias and non reciprocating mass of a handgun, but then removing weight from it... seems like this could be achieved easier by using a longer or wider dustcover and a heavier weight of guide rod. Nope that is not it at all. It's would be to eliminate the need of a bushing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebg3 Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 Thanks for the responses...I didn't know so many built with a bull barrel. I personally don't like bushings. I have no valid reasons for disliking them, it's just a personal thing. I think a bull barrel is just cleaner looking. I thought about turning down and fluting a bull barrel just for the experience. I can see how the added time and expense may not make it worth while for a customer's project. I'm thinking about starting a 6" project and I'm just exploring my options. Jon, That is a cool looking pistol, I just don't see how the barrel can lock up tight with all that slide missing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebg3 Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 That's the only way I've built them... They work well if you can get enough weight out. That does look good. Thanks, EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Burtchell Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 Just remember, "It is better to track good, than to look good". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebg3 Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 Just remember, "It is better to track good, than to look good". And it's better to be lucky than good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radical Precision Designs Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 This is a thread and subject close to my heart ... My "little" present pet project is a 6" Sight tracker style barrel, as some of you know. Been sidetracked a little bit due to my health (temporary) issues, but coming along just nicely. And there are a few other "big gun guru 'smiths" in this bandwagon ... As the 19/2011 slide and barrel "total mass/weight" starts its LOCKED rear travel, they move as one part with its weight proportion not being that relevant. As the breech unlocks then the slide continues rearward on its own, and by this time the combined mass left behind the barrel in its unlocked and stopped position. Yes the slightly heavier barrel may impart a slightly harder hit on the frame as it stops as it stops its rear travel, but by far the higher amount of muzzle flip (and dip) has been attributed to the actual weight of the slide (on its rearward travel stopping) and recoil spring in use (in its forward travel stop). Yes, the total weight of the bull barrel can be brought down a lot ... even on a Sight Tracker. Many users of the ultra light 6 inchers with a bushing barrels are indeed adding a tungsten guide rod to add some weight to fit their styles. Go figure !! I hate preconceived goal limiting ideas that keep you in the box. To me (and to quite a few others) is important to explore the possibilities and search for the actual design limitations. Sometimes you can go too far in design changes that may not suit a specific shooter's style and training. You can have a 6 inchers "fat" pig or a "slender" gazelle (or even a scrawny mouse), but the bushing or bull barrel won't really be the final determining item. IMHO (of course ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Merricks Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 Eddie, Here is TGO's setup. There is a thread in the gallery with several pic's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasmap Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 This is a thread and subject close to my heart ... My "little" present pet project is a 6" Sight tracker style barrel, as some of you know. Been sidetracked a little bit due to my health (temporary) issues, but coming along just nicely. And there are a few other "big gun guru 'smiths" in this bandwagon ... As the 19/2011 slide and barrel "total mass/weight" starts its LOCKED rear travel, they move as one part with its weight proportion not being that relevant. As the breech unlocks then the slide continues rearward on its own, and by this time the combined mass left behind the barrel in its unlocked and stopped position. Yes the slightly heavier barrel may impart a slightly harder hit on the frame as it stops as it stops its rear travel, but by far the higher amount of muzzle flip (and dip) has been attributed to the actual weight of the slide (on its rearward travel stopping) and recoil spring in use (in its forward travel stop). Yes, the total weight of the bull barrel can be brought down a lot ... even on a Sight Tracker. Many users of the ultra light 6 inchers with a bushing barrels are indeed adding a tungsten guide rod to add some weight to fit their styles. Go figure !! I hate preconceived goal limiting ideas that keep you in the box. To me (and to quite a few others) is important to explore the possibilities and search for the actual design limitations. Sometimes you can go too far in design changes that may not suit a specific shooter's style and training. You can have a 6 inchers "fat" pig or a "slender" gazelle (or even a scrawny mouse), but the bushing or bull barrel won't really be the final determining item. IMHO (of course ) I saw a completed 6" "SightTracker" style gun here at the Nats. Great looking gun BTW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebg3 Posted September 9, 2008 Author Share Posted September 9, 2008 Eddie, Here is TGO's setup. There is a thread in the gallery with several pic's. That won't win any beauty contests but it sure does work...that's the important thing. EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 I saw a completed 6" "SightTracker" style gun here at the Nats. Great looking gun BTW. That might be Mike Calloway of Schuemann Barrels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasmap Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 That might be Mike Calloway of Schuemann Barrels It was Mike's (super nice guy). It's a sweet looking gun. My gun took a crap and Derek (Millenium Custom) offered to let me use a 6" (not Mike's) he had on the table for sale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken hebert Posted September 10, 2008 Share Posted September 10, 2008 If you are using a bull to enhance the forward weight bias and non reciprocating mass of a handgun, but then removing weight from it... seems like this could be achieved easier by using a longer or wider dustcover and a heavier weight of guide rod. Nope that is not it at all. It's would be to eliminate the need of a bushing. Howard, Jon: Okay... Is this a benefit, or a preference? What would a 6" barrel+bushing weigh vs. what a trimmed down bull barrel weigh? What makes this a desired set-up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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