combat effective Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 I was wondering if a shooter using a standard K frame with speedloaders can actually be competative in IPDA? Are the matches dominated by those shooting the big N frames with moon clips. I know that the rules are supposedly intended to keep the matches from becoming equipment races, but it doesn't seem fair that I can't modify my gun to handle moon clips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 Welcome to the fray!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Perez Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 I say they can be. there was a thread a while back om the same topic. http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...t=ST&f=7&t=1176 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 I was wondering if a shooter using a standard K frame with speedloaders can actually be competative in IPDA? Are the matches dominated by those shooting the big N frames with moon clips. I know that the rules are supposedly intended to keep the matches from becoming equipment races, but it doesn't seem fair that I can't modify my gun to handle moon clips. If you're interested in being competitive, the first thing to engrain in your pysche is that skills, talent, and physical abilities will always be far more important than the subtle differences between two type of equipment. If you want to be competitive, you're going to have to practice, practice, practice as well as condition your mind. After that, whether or not you use a speed loader or moon clips is mostly academic. Given that, it's obvious that moon clips offer a slight advantage in speed over speed loaders. That advantage won't make any difference if you don't practice with either system, though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redmist10 Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...t=ST&f=7&t=1176 The second post in that thread is from "Bill" and he is an awesome shooter. He routinely smokes some of the best shooters in the Ohio valley with a wheelgun (and they're using anything and everything else). I don't think he did too bad at the 2002 Nationals with those same speedloaders. Rhino nailed it also. There is a saying...."it's not the gun." I agree that the cylinder's should be allowed to be milled to accept moon clips to make things even in SSR . A former BOD of IDPA once told me "we screwed the pooch on SSR" and then proceeded to tell me how they should have never allowed the 625 w/ moon clips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck D Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 I'm absolutely convinced that you CAN be competitive with a "K" frame and speedloaders. I made Expert w/my carry gun, a Model 19-3 with a 2-1/2 inch barrel with Safariland speedloaders. I'm close to Master class times. I'll get there eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C Sims Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Might be off the topic, but I've seen Redmist10 really smoke with his 625. It is a neat to see someone work the wheel gun magic like he does! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redmist10 Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Might be off the topic, but I've seen Redmist10 really smoke with his 625. It is a neat to see someone work the wheel gun magic like he does! The only smoking I do is from the ears after a blown stage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 Yes, you can be competitive with speedloaders. For me, it is the gun and grip size that matters. I have a medium to small hand. I have a round butt 4" S&W 25-2 in 45 ACP with moon clips. I mostly shoot a 3 inch S&W model 10 with a round butt and reload with Safariland Comp III's. I can shoot the same scores with both guns but I feel more in control with the smaller gun. If I thought I could shoot better scores with the moon clip gun I would switch in a minute. It is easier to mess up a reload with speedloaders. The moon clips are more forgiving if you practice less. Use a roundnose bullet and keep those chambers clean. Bill Nesbitt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Moneypenny Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 as i read this topic i see Bill Nesbitt is doing the same. but i doubt hell brag on himself, as he is pretty humble. Using a 3" K-fram Mod. 10 he placed 2nd at IDPA nationals in 2002. Safariland (comp 3 i believe) speed loaders. Personally i think the ultimate gun would be a 9mm K-frame with moon clips. To me the K-frame is more ergonomic than that big ugly thing called a 625 there is no way it is a practical carry gun in MOST settings. However you look into texas and new mexico where there is a lot of open country and some here on the easter side of the country, 44 mags with 6" bbl's are carried daily. and i'm sure someone has carried an ipsc open gun somewhere. pick your gun, and practice until your sick of looking at it and never want to see it again. then practice some more. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 This whole reload thing sure has left me scratching my head. I reload with the revolver in my left hand and I go for the clip or speedloader with my right hand. Yeah, I know the trend is to load by feeding the gun with your left hand. Anyhow, I can reload my 610 with a moon clip about half a second faster than I can reload a K-frame with Comp III loaders. I don't think it means diddly squat in an IDPA match because the ergonomics of the K-frame far out weigh the reloading issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Moneypenny Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 My question is are the cylinders chamfered on the gun? that can make a big difference as well as what bill said, round nose bullets... add a good crip that doesn't let the brass "snag" moon clips are undoubtedly easier becasue of the "drop and forget" where as a speed loader you have to push it in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Love Posted July 6, 2003 Share Posted July 6, 2003 smoney: I'm with you about a k-frame 9mm with moon clips being a good gun, esp. for IDPA. I don't even know if any such guns exist as production models and are thus 'legal' for IDPA, but if they were, I'd sure like to give it a go. One thing about it, you don't have to worry about the same types of malfunctions as autos. Seems like moonclips would be a good setup in smaller-frame carry revos, & the short length of 9mm cases might load pretty quickly. Didn't S&W make a j-frame centennial with a 9mm moonclip some years back? Maybe it's better to have .357's in a j-frame for carry purposes, but for games a k-frame 9mm sounds slick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted July 6, 2003 Share Posted July 6, 2003 Well, just for kicks I decided to shoot my moon clip 45 revolver in the local IDPA match today. Every time I went to reload I threw the moon clip on the ground. I even practiced before I went too. I hope somebody I know buys one of the new S&W 38 super 686's and lets me shoot it. I had a chance a while back to shoot and work with a 2 3/4 inch Ruger Speed Six in 9mm with moon clips. It was an evil beast that bit the hand that shot it. It wasn't fun to shoot. Bill Nesbitt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Moneypenny Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 Anyone have a great idea of how we can convince S&W to make this revolver, i'm up for a little work to get it to happen, this is a gun i would love to see come into existance. Bill can flex his revolver ability and fame at them. Then we can all promise to buy atleast 2! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck D Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 While we're dreaming about a K frame in 9x19, could we ask S&W to ditch the MIM parts and put the firing pin back on the damn hammer? Back to the topic, with a little practice you can get pretty quick with Safariland comp-2 speedloaders. Just for fun (others amusement...not mine) sometimes I shoot an IDPA match using Bianchi speed strips (talk about the STONE age). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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