Internet Shopping

[geezer-lock]

What I really like about the Internet is the buying opportunities and I use them frequently. I have a large budget for equipment purchases at work and I spend some serious bucks for my shooting hobby. Most of those expenditures are transacted with Internet vendors. Occasionally I have had some minor problems with products or services and the vendors have mostly resolved the issue to my satisfaction. Only rarely have I had to involve third parties to get things squared away. I would like to share some of my findings with the Benoverse.

Lets start with ways that you can protect yourself when shopping on-line. This is a minimum list:

Always use a credit card.

Bank online.

Know the terms of liability of your bank and credit card

Use the online features available for your bank and credit card to keep tabs on your accounts.

Use a “virtual credit card” if the service is offered by your card company.

Use your search engine. A simple search such as “problems with US BULL Company” can often lead to forum or consumer sites.

Use the Better Business Bureau. The BBB is a local resource and you often need to know the county where the business resides. I have had some experience with the BBB in Ohio and there are BBB offices for all of the major cities and each serves several counties. If you knew that the US BULL COMPANY was in Lake county your search would find the BBB for Cleveland.

Or you can use the link below to expedite your search:

http://lookup.bbb.org/

The BBB produces a report based on complaints and it covers both members and non-members. A search for US BULL might find a report similar to this:

“Based on BBB files, this company has an unsatisfactory record with the Bureau. The company has resolved some complaints presented by the Bureau; however, the Bureau did not receive a response to other complaints.

This company also has an unsatisfactory record with the Bureau due to a pattern of complaints and because the company has failed to correct the underlying reason for the complaints. A large volume of consumers have indicated they placed orders with the expectation of delivery within two or three weeks. However, after several months and after several requests by consumers, the company has not provided the product or a refund.

Complaints against this business concern Advertising Issues, Customer Service Issues, Delivery Issues and Refund or Exchange Issues.

When evaluating complaint information, please consider the company's size and volume of business. The number of complaints filed against the company may not be as important as the type of complaints and how the company handled them.

The Bureau processed a total of 40 complaints about this company in the last 36 months, our standard reporting period. Of the total 40 complaints in the last 36 months, 38 of those were closed in the last 12 months. “

Given the negative review from the BBB you might want to check with the State Attorney General. Again using Ohio as an excellent example, visit:

https://agcares.ag.state.oh.us/public/landing.aspx

then click the ”Consumer Complaint” section and do a “Supplier Name Search”. As with all search inquiries it is useful to use simple vs. complex terms. If, for instance, the full legal name of the company is UNITED STATES BULL COMPANY, INC. a search for US BULL is more likely to get results such as this:

Search Results for US BULL

Please note that all public requests made to the Attorney General’s Office are subject to Ohio’s open records law. These public records have a charge of $0.05 per printed page plus postage.

Complaints found: 33.

Complaint # Company Product/Service Problem Area Filed Date Status

310250 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Failure to Deliver Product or Service 5/31/2006 Closed

313907 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Refund 7/25/2006 Closed

315286 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Failure to Deliver Product or Service 8/13/2006 Closed

315787 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 8/21/2006 Closed

317090 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Failure to Deliver Product or Service 9/8/2006 Closed

317147 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 9/9/2006 Closed

318064 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Refund 9/22/2006 Closed

318203 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Refund 9/25/2006 Closed

319027 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 10/5/2006 Closed

320431 US BULL On-Line Shopping Failure to Deliver Product or Service 10/27/2006 Closed

321324 US BULL On-Line Shopping Failure to Deliver Product or Service 11/11/2006 Closed

321374 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 11/13/2006 Closed

321484 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 11/14/2006 Closed

321570 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Refund 11/15/2006 Closed

322109 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Failure to Deliver Product or Service 11/23/2006 Closed

322473 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Advertisements 11/29/2006 Closed

323116 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 12/12/2006 Closed

323387 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 12/15/2006 Closed

323406 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 12/15/2006 Open

323690 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 12/22/2006 Closed

323834 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 12/28/2006 Closed

323909 US BULL Financial Failure to Deliver Product or Service 12/28/2006 Closed

324289 US BULL Toys, Hobbies, Collectibles Failure to Deliver Product or Service 1/5/2007 Closed

324530 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Refund 1/10/2007 Closed

325169 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 1/25/2007 Closed

325257 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 1/25/2007 Closed

326201 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 2/7/2007 Closed

326215 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Refund 2/7/2007 Open

326621 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 2/14/2007 Open

326900 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 2/20/2007 Open

327925 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 3/6/2007 Open

328857 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 3/19/2007 Open

329568 US BULL Sports Equipment and Products Failure to Deliver Product or Service 3/28/2007

Armed with this sort of information you can make better choices about where to spend your money. If, however, you have been defrauded by a vendor, these same resources can be used after the fact to complain and (perhaps) recover your hard earned cash.

David C

[ihatepickles]

I think that's pretty good advice. I'd like to be extra clear on the credit card part, your debit card is not a credit card. Do not use debit cards on the Internet.

Debit cards do not have the same kinds of consumer protection as credit cards. I really hate credit cards and what they represent but they have their purpose.

Caveat Emptor, let the buyer beware.

[Bullzeye]

Thanks Geezer for all the tips. I buy tons of stuff on the internet. It saves alot of time and usually is cheaper.

Paul

[kimel]

Some debit cards do have the same protections. It varies by bank. Check with your bank if you feel you want to use a debit card online.

I have gone to using the rechargable Visa cards you can get at the supermarket. These are darn safe as all you could possibly lose off them is what you have put on them.

I also have a credit card that is ONLY used on the internet. Don't even carry it with me. I watch that one online like a hawk.

Also remember that if you have a problem most banks will do NOTHING for you if you have not filed a police report.

[jhgtyre]

Some debit cards do have the same protections. It varies by bank. Check with your bank if you feel you want to use a debit card online.

+1 To that. I haven't had many problems but my bank came through when I needed them. In one particularly nasty event involving a hotel we got shanked for $700 against our debit card when my wife arrived at the match hotel with my daughter and another young shooter and declared that there was no way in hell she was staying in that neighborhood. She attempted to explain the situation to the hotel owner who would hear none of it and told them that they were paying whether they stayed or not. My father, who came down to watch Carly shoot, manages some apartments in an extremely rough part of Nashville and he didn't like being around this hotel either. My wife stayed at another hotel in the same chain and ended up paying full price for both. When she got back to town she went down to the bank, described the problem and filled out a form. The money was back in our account that day. I love my credit union.

-ld

[ima45dv8]

Some debit cards do have the same protections. It varies by bank. Check with your bank if you feel you want to use a debit card online.

True.

My bank replaced ~$450 a few years ago when someone used my card to run up charges at a mall during the Christmas buying rush. I discovered the fraud when checking my account on-line the next day. The funds were back in my account within 24 hours of reporting the bogus charges to my bank.

I've made many on-line purchases with my debit card, but wouldn't consider doing so if I didn't know I'm protected by my bank.

Be safe, be careful, and check with your financial instutition for details on their protection level/policy.

[Singlestack]

I've made many on-line purchases with my debit card, but wouldn't consider doing so if I didn't know I'm protected by my bank.

Be safe, be careful, and check with your financial instutition for details on their protection level/policy.

+1

[Front Man]

Once or twice a year empty your wallet and photo copy everything; don't forget to flip everything over and copy the back side.

FM

[raz-0]

For computer gear and electronics, there is http://www.resellerratings.com/

very good website, wish it covered any online store.

[Cactustactical]

Credits (refunds) are handled differently for credit cards vs debit cards.

If we issue a credit to someone who used a credit card, he / she will see the credit on their account after that nights batch processing by the credit card processor. A debit card can take up to 2 weeks for the amount to get back to the funding debit card. There is a wide variance in how long it takes and it really depends upon the bank that issued the card and their policies. We had a person a few years back that keyed in $2220 instead of $22.20 for a purchase he made on a free form screen we used to use. We got the full amount in our account the next day and it cleaned his account out. All done automatically, just user error by the customer. He called us, we credited the person the extra $21xx that he overpaid the day he called. It took 14 days for him to get his money back. He was not happy.

A lot of people use debit cards in the place of credit cards and they really don't have the same inherent protections and procedures. If someone who is dirty and smart gets your debit card number and knows the system, they can empty your account in minutes.

We can't tell in most cases what kind of card it is because the banks issue them with the same 16 digit number ranges as the credit cards. I would prefer to block debit cards because of the things that can happen, but can't. I would recommend not using debit cards for other than gas, grocery store, local type stuff. If its a purchase that might need to adjusted at some point, you are safer using a credit card.