To shoot or to run

[mcoliver]

You're using an SS 1911 and in a stage where you see 2 options:

1. Dash from first position to the next then engage targets with a mag change.

2. Engage targets while moving to position 2, mag change then engage remaining targets.

Since most of you guys have been competing for so long I was wondering what your factors are in deciding what options to take.  How do you decide the most efficient route/action?

Lastly, for SS shooters, would you rather shoot farther targets (~15-20yrds) that you see now or would you rather wait until your closer at the expense of a mag change before shooting it?  What if the target is a popper?

Thanks a lot.

[Jake Di Vita]

What I would do is depending on the distance to the targets. If the targets are set up at 15 or 20 yards or if there is hardcover or no shoots, I would probably use option #1, while if the targets were anywhere from 7 yards or less I'd probably end up using option #2.

Personally, I'd rather shoot the farther targets now rather than waiting until I'm closer and having to make a mag change. Chances are the longer time between splits at 20 yards will barely be noticeable than if I was shooting at 10 or 15 yards. I'd much rather take a shot that I know I won't have a problem making than having to use time with a mag change and movement. Same deal with a popper.

(Edited by TheItlianStalion at 10:04 pm on Oct. 29, 2002)

[Bill Schwab]

mcoliver,

I compete exclusively with a SS 45 so I'll add my take on this...I always choose option 2, I avoid standing reloads like the plague and always try to combine movement with mag changes, but I know how to engage targets pretty good while I'm moving.

I find it takes me awhile longer to effectively plan a stage compared to those who who use high caps primarily because I am so darn picky about where I do the reload.  It's pretty rare to find a stage, at least around VA & MD, that requires a SS shooter to do a standing reload when the Limited shooters won't be doing one.  So just examine the stage, planning every shot, and every reload.

And I would shoot the far targets first (even if it's a popper) if it enabled me to not do a standing reload, but accuracy is also one of my strengths.

Bill

[Duane Thomas]

Move while shooting, if at all possible, always.

[Ron Ankeny]

What Bill said.

[Mo Zee]

With regards to shooting on the move. At what distance would you not shoot and move. On sunday we had a shoot where we had 3 targets say about 20-25 meters away and the rest of the COF further on but that is not of concern right now. From the start position I drew my gun and while slowly moving forward shot all three targets on the move. Would it be better to stand and shoot all three with better splits and tracks or simply do as I did and shoot on the move while sacrificing some time.

Thanx

(Edited by Mo Zee at 10:53 pm on Oct. 30, 2002)

[JFD]

I'll do anything I have to do to avoid a standing reload.  Luckily I don't run into those stages very often at all.

When the targets are 25+ yards away from the starting box, I'll draw and shoot them while standing still, then haul butt to the next position.  I'm new at this, and so far the vast majority of these longer range shots have been at the start of a stage, usually with the gun on a table, and a vision barrier preventing taking more than a shot or two on the move (I'm very thankful to the stage designer for this).  If it's long range in the middle of a stage, then I keep on moving.

[sincityshooter]

I noticed at the race gun Nationals that almost all the big boys elected not to shoot on the move if possible.  You have to figure out the distance that you will cover while moving.  Then you have to factor in the cadence you can shoot the same array standing including the draw.  If you can move aggressively while shooting (cover over  3 yards while shooting at a good pace) then moving would be the way to go.  However, if you are only getting 4-5 feet farther by moving and shooting, I don't think it's worth it.  You will be able to shoot faster and more accurately standing.  With this said, you still have to have your legs "loaded" and ready to launch after the last confirmed hit.  

[ErikW]

I used to try to shoot everything on the move but lately I've been shooting planted a lot more. Anything 7-10 yards deserves serious consideration. Outside that, planted. Closer than that, moving. Inside that range, depends on the targets, partials, no-shoots, etc.

And I find myself wanting to be planted with my foo-foo gun more, I guess because I don't like how the dot moves around so much when moving.

[mcoliver]

Really appreciate your replies guys.  I realized I still tend to get confused using a SS 45 and navigating long courses esp. when I need to make recovery shots.  However, I must admit it sure feels good when you can flawlessly execute your plan and end up kickin' half of them high-cap butts.

[bmz]

There is a basic rule in mag changes. They are done "only on the move."

Targets are all the same, they all must be hit.  The degree of difficulty will probably be determined by its location, distance,  proximity to a no shoot, etc.  All these tackled by finer adjustment in sight picture and trigger control.

Shooting while moving is very hard to master and even then, you can only move so fast and accuracy is sure to suffer, as most the run and gun might even  be better.

If you're just starting, read any of the books written by Plaxco and Enos.  You have to understand first the rudiments of shooting and then get on the mental side of it while executing all that stuff.  Might even save you a lot on ammo.

[Duane Thomas]

"If you're just starting, read any of the books written by Plaxco and Enos."

That would be one apiece.

[twix]

Sunday I (C class, confidant of my accuracy at 20 yards) shot a stage with a choice of running closer or shooting at a distance. It took alot longer to aim all the precise shots than it did to run up closer and blast from close range. I got to shoot it twice it took me 15 seconds longer to shoot it from a distance.  I'm not sure I addressed the exact subject here, but it was a big learner for me.

[BSeevers]

It depends on skill levels. At Infinity Open I shot from back of box, standard choice stage, 30 yards. Most of my squad including 2 M ran up to 10 yards and took the 18 shots. I was 7th on stage so I think I chose wisely. I am real quick on my feet so I would love to run that stage the other way. If you know your abilities and splits and transistions, then you can better judge how to shoot a stage.

[spook]

This is why some people have a stopwatch with them at matches. If you know your average split times at certain distances and use the stopwatch in the walk through, you can calculate what is fastest.

Shooting on the move is always "faster" if you can confidently make the shot. Eric Grauffel almost never stops to shoot. He is constantly on the move. This saves major time.

Another advantage of shooting on the move, is that you're already moving before you run to your next position. I noticed that starting to run from a complete stand still costs much time.

[rkgsmith]

One of the most effective ways to determine the "move or stand still " question is to set something up and put it on a timer.  I used to think shooting on the move was the way to go, however after seeing some pros do things that defy all logic, like running side to side on courses of fire and hosing targets at 2 yards instead of moving up the center  and shooting on the move.  Sometimes if time permits it  I will run through the stage on the spotwatch to get a feel for the times and which way may be better.

[mcoliver]

Ahh, the stop watch is now my best friend even in IDPA courses.  I pity the people with surprised, snickering look in their faces everytime I bring it out.  But it seems people get smarter once their butts are kciked