How Much Can You Learn In 30 Days?

[Merlin Orr]

IF you had 30 days.. lets say 30K of loaded ammo and quality equipment, guns and back up stuff. You could totally dedicate yourself to shooting, learning and etc. Lets also say you were close to a quality GM who could spend several hours a week with you and attend a local match or two during this time frame. What/how much could you learn/progress? How much is too much? Would you burn out in this period or would it really benifit you? My perspective is that of a low B shooter. I think I would do this with my Limited gun but might do the Open thing (which I have a total experence of 2K).

[Matt Cheely]

I think I would get burnt out with 30 days of shooting. But I would definetly be shooting better.

[eerw]

Think it would be fun...

it would have to be done right..and in the right order to be useful..

I think if you did two practice sessions a day..spend the morning doing basic drills and skills. working from with different positions, different distances, etc. ..and then the afternoon session to practice against your "GM". Doing the same drills but as a contest..

and then spend some time to sit and go over what you have done, what was done right and where to start the next day..would be great..

[Loves2Shoot]

I think it wouldn't hurt. Figuring out classifiers is easy, figuring out random field courses is much harder, and that seperates a lot of shooters.

I really think that your progress would depend on how solid your fundamentals are and how well you lean, how much stamina you have, how hard you would be willing to work, and the quality of your instruction. I've seen many people improve a full class in a single weekend with 1-2K of rounds.

I also think to make shooting 1K a day for 30 days straight effective, you would need a full time instructor to keep tweaking you in the right direction. 4 sessions of 250 rounds isn't outrageous.

Heck, if I had the dough and could rope A top 10 GM kicking my @ass for a month I would do it in a heart beat.

[Merlin Orr]

I think it wouldn't hurt. Figuring out classifiers is easy, figuring out random field courses is much harder, and that seperates a lot of shooters.

I really think that your progress would depend on how solid your fundamentals are and how well you lean, how much stamina you have, how hard you would be willing to work, and the quality of your instruction. I've seen many people improve a full class in a single weekend with 1-2K of rounds.

I also think to make shooting 1K a day for 30 days straight effective, you would need a full time instructor to keep tweaking you in the right direction. 4 sessions of 250 rounds isn't outrageous.

Heck, if I had the dough and could rope A top 10 GM kicking my @ass for a month I would do it in a heart beat.

Am I wrong to think that IF you could get the (right) GM for a month that all of the things you listed above your last observation would probably happen as a matter of course? I am not stuck on the 1K per day figure - just meaning to say that if you went with that in mind as a possibility.... I wonder what good GMs rent for these days??? (I say kind of seriously)

[Loves2Shoot]

Everything happens as a matter of course

I once shot everyday for months on end, but I didn't have any instruction and that didn't help me as much as I would have hoped. Instuction and proper focus is huge in improvement.

If you have solid fundamentals and the right person with you, how far you could jump would blow your mind. Going in expecting to jump X distance would only hinder your improvement.

It definetly would be a huge challenge, mentally, emotionally and physically. Shooting everyday for months on end is tougher than it sounds, but you will learn something with any big challenge, that I can guarantee.

[AlamoShooter]

Big steps are easy at first. But thier is so many things to practice burn out can be avoided. 30K in 30 days , most of the early part = like first year or more is just learnning how to learn. after over 10 years I am still finding how to learn, as much as what to learn. I have watched shooters put a big volum of bullets down range and practiced bad habits to become better at being bad. and will argue that "! they tryed that! at some time and it didn't work , or This is the only way I can do it! They just practiced being bad.

Find how to learn form at least 50% of your practic shots, and that would be grate,= like did you call the shot to within 1" per 10 yards. At 10 yards can you call the shot to with in 1" 30 yards to within 3"

On a 10" plate at 15 yards can you tell that the bullet will hit or miss befor it arives or misses. can you get passed hearing a steel plate get hit, and just see it?

I know that can be learned in less than a month with a good coach/ teacher.

learn to call a shot to with in 1" at 50 yards in one month that would be an acomplishment unabel to be rated by a club clasification.

[MikeFoley]

One can make a lot of progress with 30 continuous days of shooting even basic drills. There are GM's for rent in many forms. The most accessible is buying Saul Kirsch's books, Brian's book, Matt Burkett's book and videos, etc. The next accessible thing is a class from someone like Max Michel and Travis Tomasie and many others. I once fired 500-600 rounds in a half day class with David Sevigny, that helped me a lot. The magic for most of us is finding the 30 days. In that time period, I think it would be beneficial to shoot a match with your instructor too. Maybe even a week long camp wouldn't be out of the realm of possiblity. Heck, ladies and juniors have camps, why not everyone else? The key is knowing what you need to work on. 30 days affords a lot of different skills practice.

[Clay1]

Merlin, ONE SERIOUSLY COOL PROJECT. Just wish I had the clams to make that one happen. This year I would like to hire a coach for the first time. Would love to train with Travis and Max. Also have a local fellow who is from the Frank Garcia school that will see some of my money this year.

For some reason, shooters many times think that we are MEN. We are born with some special innate ability to shoot properly. As a student of shotgun games (sporting clays) I hired a number of coaches and saw my score go up. Any professional athlete, even at the very highest level of the game, has a coach/trainer that they work with. Many have more than one - I.E. mental game coach, technique coach etc.

Keep us posted on your adventure,

Rick

[AlamoShooter]

Merlin, ONE SERIOUSLY COOL PROJECT. Just wish I had the clams to make that one happen. This year I would like to hire a coach for the first time. Would love to train with Travis and Max. Also have a local fellow who is from the Frank Garcia school that will see some of my money this year.

For some reason, shooters many times think that we are MEN. We are born with some special innate ability to shoot properly. As a student of shotgun games (sporting clays) I hired a number of coaches and saw my score go up. Any professional athlete, even at the very highest level of the game, has a coach/trainer that they work with. Many have more than one - I.E. mental game coach, technique coach etc.

Keep us posted on your adventure,

Rick

I was lucky with Sporting Shotgun to get help, and to get Coaching from a great teacher that could tell you what your eyes saw on a moving target at 45 + yards, he was so good he taut me how to coach. It is hard to watch talented shooters " do things the hard way" just for the lack of asking for help. Sporting shotgun can make a Handgun shooter learn how to see 10 things in one tenth of a second, IF you get help on how to "see"

Get The Best Help You Can! or at least use a video camera, and see it the camera "film" picked up the same thing as your camera brain

[Jake Di Vita]

If you had a coach with you every step of the way I think the gains could be staggering.

Just make sure you pick the right coach.

[davidball]

I think a better format would be 30 days of training in a 40 day period - 3 days on, 1 day off - or something of that nature, to avoid burnout out / loss of focus.

[Sharyn]

Heaven... a dream come true.

I'd give up anything and everything to be able to do this... even just for a week.

Maybe someday... *sigh*

[Bigbadaboom]

I would have a blast! With all that positive energy of having that much fun I have to learn a lot. I understand that it would burn some people out but I just love shooting too much.

[AlamoShooter]

Too much of a good thing, No, but every thing has a price. I used to practice at what was probly ? mayby? an unresonable amount for Sportsman's Team Challenge.

put in up to 60 hrs trainning/practice a month, for about three months a year. gave up all my family vacation time and $ for several years.

It all amounts to (What are you willing to give up)?

=I still give up about three weeks a year with out pay to shoot events.

If you looked the question 30,000 rounds and 30 days. 30,000 rounds would cost about $70a thousand x 30 that is only $2,100 thats the cost of a resonable ski vacation. take your vacation time to shoot and you have what some call a dream.

If you move up to ?Master? in one year would it be worth it?

[Merlin Orr]

.....vacation time to shoot and you have what some call a dream.

If you move up to ?Master? in one year would it be worth it?

I have very limited time because I work ALL the danged time - therefore I have the $$ - the time is what I don't know if will come.

Oh yea, Master would be outstanding. I have been told by some people I respect that I am to old to make Master - "they" tell me be happy if I ever see A.

If I could substantially cut down on the mental screwups I would feel it worthwhile. Of course if you can eliminate most all your screw ups the other things (advancement in classes) will follow.?? At 53 if I make Master I would feel that a Extremely worthwhile accomplishment. Or a solid A class shooter - all day and every day would be fine.

Hell, If I get out and shoot a match without anything falling off I am happy..

I have not really explored the "who for a coach" thing but it seems that most think the idea has some merit.

[AikiDale]

There is a fellow just North of here who started shooting after he retired. He holds a GM card. Tell those folks who think you are too old to make Master they have insufficient data to make such stupid comments.

[dajarrel]

Oh yea, Master would be outstanding. I have been told by some people I respect that I am to old to make Master - "they" tell me be happy if I ever see A.

.............At 53 if I make Master I would feel that a Extremely worthwhile accomplishment. Or a solid A class shooter - all day and every day would be fine.

Hell, If I get out and shoot a match without anything falling off I am happy..

Merlin,

Would you REALLY want to make master. I believe your acceptance of a "Solid A class shooter" is a worthy goal.

If you were to shoot for the 30 days you speak of (I sure would like to attempt it!!) you would just about have to move up. Your skill levels would have to improve. Master would be attainable.

But... could you maintain that skill set? Naturally some of the theory you learned would still be there but without continuous, objective practice, could you stay there or would you just be frustrated because you couldn't compete.

I'm just a low "B" like yourself. I would like to improve my game and move up as my skill levels improve. But, I want to be competitive. I don't have to win but I want to be in the running.

OBTW, I think the age thing is overated. Sure, I don't have the reflexes of a 20 year old, but I have the cunning and experience of a 52 year old.

just my $0.02 worth

dj

[davidball]

I have been told by some people I respect that I am to old to make Master - "they" tell me be happy if I ever see A.

I'm sure these people have the best of intentions . . . but don't listen to them. There are too many people who have done what they were told couldn't be done . . .

[AlamoShooter]

... At 53 if I make Master I would feel that a Extremely worthwhile accomplishment. Or a solid A class shooter - all day and every day would be fine.

Hell, If I get out and shoot a match without anything falling off I am happy..

I have not really explored the "who for a coach" thing but it seems that most think the idea has some merit.

The "Coach" thing is a proven in Sporting Clays, it is diferent for handgun and the method for a coach system is not in place. Coaching and teaching are not the same. in handgun a coach would help you find the best way to shoot a stage, and keep the teaching at practice times only. A coach would help you find what you would best benifit from in practice and point out every little thing you are Good AT And it looks like to me that the classification system has the same problems for IPSC. And a Sloid A is aout the same thing as an average Master. A solid B shooter would be an average A.

A great guy is close to you near Bastrop that Teaches,

And the age thing I see as an equal + &- , for me at 49 it is the iruries that slow me down. And hopfuly at 53 you would not be hinderd by an ego as bad as some.

I have liked Steel Shooting probley becuse that is how I got my start, But now I see how You are realy shooting against ,or "for", yourself on every stage. = Can it be shot faster and smother. or are your times in a match close to your practice times.

Oh and the class thing = I was told the first year I started that my goals were not reallistic, I went way past my goals. I am better than I ever thought I could be, and I have had what is called "The most fun you can with your clothes on"

Edited November 26, 2005 by AlamoShooter

[Flyin40]

I think it depends on your current level. I kinda did the same thing this past spring. I was off for 2 months with a new baby. I was able to make it to the range 4 times a week. I made dramatic improvements because of it. Not just shooting but I worked on specific things. I think its extremely important to have a gameplan for this instead of just showing up and shooting and not working on anthing in particular.

For me I hadn't touched a pistol since 1999 so for me just getting range time is going to make me improve.

I'm planning of doing it again next spring but I'll be working so it will be alittle tougher to have the time.

Flyin40

[Steve Moneypenny]

given proper instruction you would gain in leaps and bounds!

however i think you would get injured a lot, nothing would heal and u would crash and burn before that 30 days is up. Your muscles (the ones u use to run, draw the pistol reload, etc. need up to 3 days and longer to heal if you completely wear them out. which shooting 1000 rounds on the first day will totally fatigue everything from your thumb loading the mags to your toes keeping u upright. and it will never fully heal because u will be doing that every day.

I don't care if you are 5 or 55 don't let ANYONE whine about your age and tell u that it is a hinderance. only YOU decide what you can do, one of my pet peves is those who set limitations on others to hold them back because THEY lack the will to do what it takes. if you want to be the guy who makes GM at 55 i believe you can do it if YOU really really want it.

[mygunmusboff]

How much can you NOT learn in 30 days, 30 months or even 30 years? I believe it is a very personal issue. I work with a GM who hasn't been shooting but a hand full of years and I work with a whole bunch of guys who have been shooting a very long time and have abunch of rounds down range that just don't shoot a whole lot better than they did this time 10 yrs. ago. Learning to learn aint easy to learn. My ego hates that stuff.

[Merlin Orr]

given proper instruction you would gain in leaps and bounds!

however i think you would get injured a lot, nothing would heal and u would crash and burn before that 30 days is up. Your muscles (the ones u use to run, draw the pistol reload, etc. need up to 3 days and longer to heal if you completely wear them out. which shooting 1000 rounds on the first day will totally fatigue everything from your thumb loading the mags to your toes keeping u upright. and it will never fully heal because u will be doing that every day.

I don't care if you are 5 or 55 don't let ANYONE whine about your age and tell u that it is a hinderance. only YOU decide what you can do, one of my pet peves is those who set limitations on others to hold them back because THEY lack the will to do what it takes. if you want to be the guy who makes GM at 55 i believe you can do it if YOU really really want it.

I spoke at length with a guy I know about the first part of what you said yesterday. He recommended 300 round sessions every other day. A day to shoot - day to reload and do a little dryfiring.

As to the second paragraph of your reply...I don't know if I have the "want" to go balls to the wall for that goal, but I damn sure like that someone other than myself agrees it is actually possible - with the right training and approach.

The guy I spoke to last night is a very savy shooter who coached his wife to a solid Master. She started without any real knowledge and relied on him as a coach and She got it done and now is a very reconized shooter. I will be starting with him as my "coach" in later Feb of next year. We (I) shall see.

I have the dryfire book - guess I better open it....

Edited November 27, 2005 by Merlin Orr

[Steve Moneypenny]

Let me know if there is anything i can do, Love teh bottom quote there. very very true. In my life i was told a lot of things, I was told i could not go from beginner to black belt in 3 years... why? "it's never been done" well, i did it with 3 months to spare! I was told in high school, "your not college material" i have a 4 year degree plus 2 years of graduate classes. my last semester with 15 hours of senior level classes in multiple diciplines i made a 4.0!

Here are a few thoughts

Rob Letham is near 50 and just won the world shoot,

We have many forum members 50 or greater that are a/master level Bill nesbitt is one i know personally, Vluc here is moving up in class and skill headed towards A.

One of my martial arts students is near 50, has had both knees blown out, 9 ribs broken, an ankle and various other injuries. Has to wear 2 knee braces to every class. he is on his way to black belt, and is a model student, after a ATV wreck doctors told him he could never do it, but he loves it and wants it!

There are books filled with inspirational stories. bottom line is if you want this no obstacle is too great and all of those nay-sayers are just motivation so you can laugh louder later.