P320 Damaged Ejectors

[BillGarlandJr]

Thought I'd share some information with everyone.......at our department we have several officers who carry P320s. Yesterday while we were doing some firearms training one of the P320 shooters started having a problem with his pistol where the slide wouldn't go all the way back into battery. I took a look at it after it did this several times, and when I hand cycled the slide I noticed the slide was not moving back and forth with its usual smoothness. Long story short, we field stripped the pistol and upon examination it appeared the ejector had been bent upwards, and was contacting the inside of the slide. The was even a wear mark on the inside of the slide that only could have been caused by the ejector rubbing against it. At any rate, this officer contacted SIG today and was told that while its not widespread, this is a fairly common problem with P320s. Apparently this condition is a result of inserting the magazine too robustly during reloads thus causing it to over insert and make contact with the bottom of the ejector. Has anyone else heard of, or experienced this?

 

This was a newer P320, btw. It has a "born on" date in August of this year.

[Explosiveo]

Hey Bill,
That happened to Adam Consolvo at the oregon state uspsa championship this year.
I guess those plastic basepads on the 21 round mags are supposed to stop it. But a lot of people remove those and put more low profile mag bases like the springer precision.
He ended up just bending it back and continued to use it.
Tim

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[2ndtimearound]

Yes, I have seen 2 come through training that have exhibited this same issue.  Both shooters are defensive type shooters (IDPA and pistol classes)not USPSA shooters.  These guys do, almost exclusively, slide lock reloads and their ejectors have bent and twisted.

 

I have over 3000 rounds on my X5, I have SP pads on 21 rounds mags but I never do slide lock reloads.  I haven't had an issue yet.  I am convinced it is a lock slide lock reload issue.

Edited December 17, 2018 by 2ndtimearound

[jaep1911]

The other day, while doing my dry fire practice, I inserted a full mag (dummies) with the slide locked back. As I released the slide, the slide got stuck. The top round was in contact with the ejector, slightly moved forward in the mag. The mag was also got stuck and it took me a while to clear the mess. I checked the ejector and found no damage to it but since then, I do not slam load a mag in there with the slide locked open. Note that I am still using the factory plastic base plates.

[Archer]

Well, that's a concern.  That ejector is formed from a bent, then ground, steel spur that is integral to the serialized module, and there's no way to fix a broken one short of TIG welding and machining.   This type of material doesn't respond too well to being bent back and forth very well, either.

 

I can't *quite* get a normally loaded mag to push on the ejector- there's a tiny bit of clearance- but I can certainly see how a slightly mis-seated round could raise hell there.

 

[BillGarlandJr]

On 12/16/2018 at 6:24 PM, 2ndtimearound said:

Yes, I have seen 2 come through training that have exhibited this same issue.  Both shooters are defensive type shooters (IDPA and pistol classes)not USPSA shooters.  These guys do, almost exclusively, slide lock reloads and their ejectors have bent and twisted.

 

I have over 3000 rounds on my X5, I have SP pads on 21 rounds mags but I never do slide lock reloads.  I haven't had an issue yet.  I am convinced it is a lock slide lock reload issue.

I’m thinking the same thing. Personally I don’t have much of an issue with it, but I think that’s because my grip keeps the slide from locking back most of the time anyways, thus very few slide lock reloads for me. 

 

I have a theory why we might be seeing this with the X5s mostly. The original P320 grip modules had the cut out that accommodated the portion of the base pad that ran up each side of the magazine slightly. Those pieces mated together and prevented over insertion. The X grips don’t have the same cut out, and the portion of the base pad I’m talking about is beveled now to work with the X grips. Might be why we’re seeing some over insertion issues, and resulting damage to the ejector.

[2ndtimearound]

Agree.  One of the guys I am talking about has a return label from Sig.  Interested to see what they say or if they already know and have a fix or will just replace on an as needed basis.

[Archer]

22 hours ago, 2ndtimearound said:

Agree.  One of the guys I am talking about has a return label from Sig.  Interested to see what they say or if they already know and have a fix or will just replace on an as needed basis.

 

"Replace" means replacement of the serialized frame.  One would think they would be well motivated to avoid that situation, but unless they have a way to weld a new spur onto the frame I can't see how else they can solve a failed ejector.

[Rich406]

Never had an issue with this, with over 35K rounds through various X5s. However I very rarely reload from slide lock.

[Tony13]

Guessing I have about 7k rounds thru my P320. Haven’t seen this problem. I reload from slide lock position a lot. Thanks for the heads up, will keep an eye out for this and up date if anything changes.

[Dasniper]

Just received my p320 X5 back from Sig. I had issues with gun not going into battery. They said bent extractor from over inserting magazines. Should I change base plates??  Not understanding how this happens. 

[jaep1911]

5 hours ago, Dasniper said:

Just received my p320 X5 back from Sig. I had issues with gun not going into battery. They said bent extractor from over inserting magazines. Should I change base plates??  Not understanding how this happens. 

I do not understand, either. That should be prevented by design, no? Unless you are using non-factory mag set up.

[Dasniper]

The sig rep told me it only happens with the 21rnd mag. He said you can insert mag with some force just not too much. I told him I’m not a new shooter and I don’t slam in my mags on reloads. I think this was just a poor design by Sig on this one. 

[rad-dude]

I have had 2 sig P320s with damaged ejectors now.  One "regular" and one Legion.  Per the Sig rep, they will bend it back once under warranty.  If the FCU needs to be replaced, they will charge $199 for a new serialized FCU for something that seems to be a design flaw.  Unfortunately, Sig is unlikely to admit the issue unless there is a significant hit to their market, like the drop test.  Even then, I don't think they ever admitted a design flaw.  They just did the free upgrade.  They are suggesting it is because of over-enthusiastic magazine changes.  

 

On another note, did you know that a 2 inch group within 10 yards is considered acceptable accuracy for the "match grade" X5?

 

 

 

 

[texasref]

Quote

 

Though not a Sig, I just had this same problem with a 1911. Also had the ejector broken on another gun by this problem.

IDPA, slide lock reloads and over insertion keeping the slide from moving into battery. Actually jammed round at ramp and locked up. In USPSA this is rare due to reloading with one in the chamber. Mag can't go that far.

Another shooter saw this happen twice. Told me to get some metal baseplates and that will stop this. (They are on the way).

The plastic base pads get beat up/down and allows this to happen.

[jaep1911]

9 hours ago, texasref said:

Though not a Sig, I just had this same problem with a 1911. Also had the ejector broken on another gun by this problem.

IDPA, slide lock reloads and over insertion keeping the slide from moving into battery. Actually jammed round at ramp and locked up. In USPSA this is rare due to reloading with one in the chamber. Mag can't go that far.

Another shooter saw this happen twice. Told me to get some metal baseplates and that will stop this. (They are on the way).

The plastic base pads get beat up/down and allows this to happen.

 been there done that.

[BobL]

Hi All,

 

I've had this issue with both my standard X-Five and Legion X-Five. My standard X-Five ejector finally snapped off after bending it back down several times. Sent it back to Sig and they had to replace the entire serialized FCU as the ejector is part of the frame.  Sig's advice was to not do slide lock reloads and do mag insertions "less aggressively" and only load 20 rounds so the top round would give when coming into contact with the ejector during insertion.  They said mine was an isolated incident. This was about 10-12 months ago.

 

Got my Legion X-Five about 3-4 months ago and during my first match using it accidentally started a stage with a half full mag (yeah I know) and went to slide lock. Did a slide lock reload and the ejector up bent up and caused the slide not to go into battery.  Got through the stage and bent it back down and finished the match.  This happened day one with this gun.  Was not happy.

 

Ever since I've been overly careful only loading 20 rounds in mags when I'm training and avoiding slide lock reloads.  Well yesterday shooting a steel match I tried to get through a stage without a reload and went to slide lock on the last shot. Did a slide lock reload and finished. Next stage after a planned reload, had a malfunction failure to eject. Cleared it quickly but when I did so could feel the slide catching.  After the stage took the slide off and the ejector was gone.  It had broken completely off.

 

Now I have to send this one back and get a new serialized FCU again. Sig claims this is not a widespread issue but it definitely is an issue. I have a buddy with a Legion X-Five who shoots competitions and he has had to bend his back several times and sooner or later his will break off. When he called Sig they said he had to pay shipping to send it in and they would bend it back but if it breaks and the entire FCU needs to be replaced he would have to pay.  If they tell me that this time, not going to be happy.

 

My mentor knows of 3 other people with variations of p320's that its happened to as well.  It's easy to say "don't do slide lock reloads" but the reality is if you shoot enough matches you're going to occasionally do a slide lock reload and a gun designed for competition should be able to withstand an occasional mag insertion from slide lock without breaking. We'll see how Sig handles it this time.  Stay tuned.

[coryf]

I use my X5 primarily for IDPA.  Would loading only 10 rds in the mag going in help this situation?  Would a full mag put more pressure on ejector?

[BobL]

If you are only loading 10-rounds likely you will not have this issue as the round will give when it hits the ejector. With 21 rounds loaded there is little to no give when the round hits the ejector which is what is causing the ejector to bend/ break.  

[coryf]

19 hours ago, BobL said:

If you are only loading 10-rounds likely you will not have this issue as the round will give when it hits the ejector. With 21 rounds loaded there is little to no give when the round hits the ejector which is what is causing the ejector to bend/ break.  

Makes sense.  Thanks.  Sounds like something we need to watch out for though.  

[Solsand]

On 8/13/2019 at 5:52 PM, rad-dude said:

I have had 2 sig P320s with damaged ejectors now.  One "regular" and one Legion.  Per the Sig rep, they will bend it back once under warranty.  If the FCU needs to be replaced, they will charge $199 for a new serialized FCU for something that seems to be a design flaw.  Unfortunately, Sig is unlikely to admit the issue unless there is a significant hit to their market, like the drop test.  Even then, I don't think they ever admitted a design flaw.  They just did the free upgrade.  They are suggesting it is because of over-enthusiastic magazine changes.  

 

On another note, did you know that a 2 inch group within 10 yards is considered acceptable accuracy for the "match grade" X5?

 

 

 

 

I just stumbled on to this topic and had no idea that this was an issue. My question is this- How can Sig charge $199 for a new FCU for an issue that is a warranty repair? I know the obvious answer (because they can!) but I just don't understand it. The X5 and X5 Legion were designed and marketed as out-of-the-box competitors for action sports which to me would include USPSA AND IDPA. As has been mentioned above, slide lock reloads are an integral part of IDPA, so their position of "not to do slide lock reloads" or to do them "less forcefully" is pure nonsense. That said, as mentioned by @BobL above, IDPA reloads are done with 10 rounds max which it seems would mitigate the issue... ???

 

For what it's worth, I just bought my second X5 last week but this time it's a Legion, and so far so good. Plan to shoot it this weekend at my local IDPA match. My other X5 has almost 10K rounds through it with a mix of practice, IDPA and USPSA and it has run flawlessly from day one about a year ago. I still has all original springs throughout as well as the original guide rod assembly and continues to run anything I feed through it. And at 10K rounds, the stock trigger is better than my new Legion's...

 

Keep us posted as to what happens with your repair going forward. I just can't believe Sig is getting away with charging people for new FCU's. SMDH.

[DirectDrive]

Old thread, but thanks for this intel, OP.

It's ironic that Glock is modular in regards to the ejector and P320 is not.

When I first examined a P320 FCU, I thought about the ejector design.

I predict that someone good at fine welding is going to rescue some of these broken FCU's.

[cdmorten]

I just found this thread as I broke my ejector on a recently purchased Legion tonight.  This is the 4th time I've shot it.  It has maybe 700 rounds through it.  I've been slamming mags into it on slide lock reloads just like I do with all my other guns.  I could never get the Legion slide to move forward upon firmly inserting the mags.  Since all of my other guns will do that, I kept slamming them into the magwell thinking maybe it just needed breaking in.  Who would have guessed a Sig couldn't handle what I would consider normal use.  I'll let you guys know how the warranty process plays out.  

 

By the way, does any of your slides shut when you firmly insert a magazine?  Mine never has from day one.  

 

Thanks.

[BillGarlandJr]

23 hours ago, cdmorten said:

I just found this thread as I broke my ejector on a recently purchased Legion tonight.  This is the 4th time I've shot it.  It has maybe 700 rounds through it.  I've been slamming mags into it on slide lock reloads just like I do with all my other guns.  I could never get the Legion slide to move forward upon firmly inserting the mags.  Since all of my other guns will do that, I kept slamming them into the magwell thinking maybe it just needed breaking in.  Who would have guessed a Sig couldn't handle what I would consider normal use.  I'll let you guys know how the warranty process plays out.  

 

By the way, does any of your slides shut when you firmly insert a magazine?  Mine never has from day one.  

 

Thanks.

Pretty much any service type pistol isn’t “designed” to have the slide go forward when a magazine is inserted at slide lock. It just so happens some pistols do it. The 1.0 M&Ps do it fairly regularly, and I’ve got a couple Glocks that do it on a regular basis. It wasn’t really something a lot of folks who carry guns for a living found desirable, so that “feature” has been designed out. The M&P 2.0s slide stops were designed to prevent it, and if I remember correctly, the P320s aren’t supposed to do it either. I’ve never had a problem with the slide going forward on the P320 (any version) when I insert a magazine at slide lock because the slide almost never locks back for me. A consequence of having larger hands that ride all over the slide stop. When the slide has locked back, I have never had the slide “auto-forward”. I have one I’ve used for work that has over 60,000 rounds through it and it still doesn’t auto-forward, so I don’t think its a matter of breaking in. I just think the P320 isn’t supposed to do it.

[Solsand]

On 2/21/2020 at 9:00 PM, cdmorten said:

I just found this thread as I broke my ejector on a recently purchased Legion tonight.  This is the 4th time I've shot it.  It has maybe 700 rounds through it.  I've been slamming mags into it on slide lock reloads just like I do with all my other guns.  I could never get the Legion slide to move forward upon firmly inserting the mags.  Since all of my other guns will do that, I kept slamming them into the magwell thinking maybe it just needed breaking in.  Who would have guessed a Sig couldn't handle what I would consider normal use.  I'll let you guys know how the warranty process plays out.  

 

By the way, does any of your slides shut when you firmly insert a magazine?  Mine never has from day one.  

 

Thanks.

Please, let us know what Sig tells you. By the way, are you slamming home mostly full, maxed out mags?

Edited February 23, 2020 by Solsand