Is my holster safe?

[MAC702]

23 minutes ago, Studentofthegun said:

 

Unwarranted commentary of a personal nature that reveals a substantial amount of jealousy.  Stay classy.

 

Holster is marketed as if it is for USPSA so it should therefore be USPSA legal at the very least.  The holster maker needs to make it right.

OP specifically opened his thread by wanting straight-forward comments for his thick skin.  He offered that his papered girlfriend was "super smart," yet sneaks up on him and sticks her fingers in his holster to activate the trigger.  I'm a little busy right now to figure out how to politicize advice for that one.  Forgive me.

 

Not sure where there is any cause to impute jealousy.  I'm irrelevantly papered, too, substantially.  Only means something to someone that needs the papers.

 

Agreed that the holster-maker is on the hook here.  If he can't fix it, he needs to replace it with a USPSA-legal holster.

Edited April 3, 2017 by MAC702

[NoKimberDave]

I have no intention of going nuclear or anything else. But I will happily tell the truth and let other people judge for themselves. I want a safe holster that can be used in competitions per the rules and safely. Because I PAID for that. Period. I do not have anything personal or any ax to grind with this dude. I have zero interest in knowing or contacting him at all. It was only his lack of making a safe holster that made me contact him, after trying to have it fixed locally.

 

Nothing has been done to the holster other than some dry draws and practice one evening before realizing this was a problem. Not trying to pull one off, not trying to get something for nothing, not trying to start some kind of lame vendetta. I am a 48 year old professional, not stupid, have shot and RO'd many matches, and wanted people to view these images and state their opinions. 

 

There are other annoying things about this holster, I am not going into it and don't want to bad mouth anybody, but it boggles my mind that a professional holster maker would deem this a good product and safe to use. It is NOT safe to use. Further, the willingness to let this get out in the ether rather than spend 20 minutes and 10$ worth of kydex to make one right really has me stumped. 

 

I figured I'll deal with my other minor complaints, but this is a safety issue. It can't be used. There's just not enough material for anybody I know to fix it.

 

But, in view of the price (heck regardless of price), I shouldn't have to fix anything at all. 

[MAC702]

I like giving him the opportunity to make it right.  If he does, you sing his praises for doing so.  If he doesn't, then you warn us.

[NoKimberDave]

11 minutes ago, MAC702 said:

OP specifically opened his thread by wanting straight-forward comments for his thick skin.  He offered that his papered girlfriend was "super smart," yet sneaks up on him and sticks her fingers in his holster to activate the trigger.  I'm a little busy right now to figure out how to politicize advice for that one.  Forgive me.

 

Not sure where there is any cause to impute jealousy.  I'm irrelevantly papered, too, substantially.  Only means something to someone that needs the papers.

 

Agreed that the holster-maker is on the hook here.  If he can't fix it, he needs to replace it with a USPSA-legal holster.

 

I hope you realize I was joking about my girlfriend sneeking up and doing this often. But, she can certainly do it and has per me asking her to try to!

 

I appreciate your opinion on this, and SOTG is a shooting friend locally, so he's just looking out for a buddy, which is how he rolls!

 

 

 

 

 

[MAC702]

Just now, NoKimberDave said:

 

I hope you realize I was joking about my girlfriend sneeking up and doing this often. But, she can certainly do it and has per me asking her to try to!

 

I appreciate your opinion on this, and SOTG is a shooting friend locally, so he's just looking out for a buddy, which is how he rolls!

I must admit I'm bad at seeing that.  Thanks.  Obviously, purposeful, planned, permissive testing would be exempt!

[KrymSIX]

Definitely unsafe as it is. I would Not try to heat an reshape it yet. You gotta go back to the maker and get it either remade or fixed to comply with uspsa rules if he's selling it as a uspsa holster. Furthermore, as is, it's just an unsafe holster. 

 

Hopefully it gets taken care of tor you

[IHAVEGAS]

This holster and this gun?

 

1  A sharpie that is a bit under 1/2" diameter can be pushed in parallel to the frame but I can not deliberatly wiggle and force things around enough to pull the trigger. 

 

 

 

2. I can not force my little finger into close proximity of the trigger and I tried hard and it was sort of ouchy. I figured I would take one for the team on this issue. 

 

 

3. It is good to go from the sides and meets all USPSA regulations. 

 

 

 

If this is what we are talking about then the only way to get to the trigger would be to take something J shaped, push it down with the hook parralel to the gun, turn the hook in toward the trigger guard, and pull upward. Or have someone do it for you who had skinny fingers. 

 

???

 

 

[NoKimberDave]

3 minutes ago, IHAVEGAS said:

This holster and this gun?

 

1  A sharpie that is a bit under 1/2" diameter can be pushed in parallel to the frame but I can not deliberatly wiggle and force things around enough to pull the trigger. 

 

 

 

2. I can not force my little finger into close proximity of the trigger and I tried hard and it was sort of ouchy. I figured I would take one for the team on this issue. 

 

 

3. It is good to go from the sides and meets all USPSA regulations. 

 

 

 

If this is what we are talking about then the only way to get to the trigger would be to take something J shaped, push it down with the hook parralel to the gun, turn the hook in toward the trigger guard, and pull upward. Or have someone do it for you who had skinny fingers. 

 

???

 

 

 

I have video of it being done easily with a number of implements.

 

But let me ask you this: Do you think it is safe if only people "with skinny fingers" can do it?

To do it on any other holsters I have ever owned your fingers would have to be skinnier than a credit card.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[NoKimberDave]

Trust me on this:

Plenty of time was spent by several good shooters and a good holster maker to be completely sure that the trigger can manipulated by various objects so as to make the trigger break and the gun to go off (if it was loaded). Anybody has any doubts and I can send you a link to video. Just want to give maker a chance to make it right before I post their name, as I don't want to be a prick.

 

I have video, too. Which I will happily post if and when this isn't handled. Honestly the more I think about it and the makers response the more pissed off I get!

 

The purpose of this video is to make sure I am not on crazy pills and verify that anybody with a brain in their head and some shooting experience can recognize that being able to set off a trigger with a sharpie, while it is holstered and mounted to a Stoeger DOS while being worn, is no bueno.

The only reason I had to do this is because the dude that made the holster seems to think it is perfectly fine.

 

I think it's pretty obvious that everyone here would prefer a holster that does not allow for that. Period. And it some cases, would probably not allow me to shoot a match because the holster is not legal per the rules.

[IHAVEGAS]

3 minutes ago, NoKimberDave said:

Trust me on this:

Plenty of time was spent by several good shooters and a good holster maker to be completely sure that the trigger can manipulated by various objects so as to make the trigger break and the gun to go off (if it was loaded). Anybody has any doubts and I can send you a link to video. Just want to give maker a chance to make it right before I post their name, as I don't want to be a prick.

 

I have video, too. Which I will happily post if and when this isn't handled. Honestly the more I think about it and the makers response the more pissed off I get!

 

The purpose of this video is to make sure I am not on crazy pills and verify that anybody with a brain in their head and some shooting experience can recognize that being able to set off a trigger with a sharpie, while it is holstered and mounted to a Stoeger DOS while being worn, is no bueno.

The only reason I had to do this is because the dude that made the holster seems to think it is perfectly fine.

 

I think it's pretty obvious that everyone here would prefer a holster that does not allow for that. Period. And it some cases, would probably not allow me to shoot a match because the holster is not legal per the rules.

 

Would be interesting to see the video. In the manufacturers defense, when I saw only what you posted here I thought you were nuts too  (and this is the forum where you always get highly excited answers to anything safety related). Since you can use something like a sharpie to activate the trigger then it sounds like the cheese is more binding.

[NoKimberDave]

Here's a front shot, remember this is made for a gun WITHOUT a thumbrest. All that space isn't helping, that's for sure, and I can't figure out why he feels it needs to be like this as I have a ton of other holsters, none of which has this huge gap next to the gun.

[teros135]

Looks like this guy is a "holster maker".  Nothing that's been said makes him seem at all a "professional holster maker".  That thing doesn't fit the gun it was made for.  Hope he makes it right.

[IHAVEGAS]

Hmmm, without the thumb rest I do not understand the required clearance either.

 

CZ75 frame, else the same. 

 

[NoKimberDave]

24 minutes ago, teros135 said:

Looks like this guy is a "holster maker".  Nothing that's been said makes him seem at all a "professional holster maker".  That thing doesn't fit the gun it was made for.  Hope he makes it right.

 

I hear that.  But, he has a reputation here, and a website, is a prolific poster here, sells a lot of holsters, and is a good shooter. Should know better than anybody here.

 

I got a couple local guys that could have made me a holster, but it was his reputation on this website, and the fact he lists a gun that no holsters are made for yet, that sold me on him. I figured his experience would be worth the double-the-cost that I could have done locally.

I sent it back feeling very confident it would be handled the minute he put his hands on it. Because every single person that has seen it was shocked how bad it was.

 

[htomeheb]

To answer the question: No, that holster isn't safe.

 

When people defend bad workmanship because the guy selling them happens to be a "nice fellow", they allow bad (and in this case unsafe) products to continue to be made and sold, and that could eventually lead to someone getting hurt or potentially killed.

 

 

Edited to Add: 

 

The lack of quality with these holsters is quite apparent. I understand that with some guns it's hard to find holster options, but sometimes its best to just get a bladetech and modify it if need be. It wont be flashy, and it might not be the best ever, but it'll work, and it'll be safe. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 3, 2017 by htomeheb

[IHAVEGAS]

1 hour ago, htomeheb said:

To answer the question: No, that holster isn't safe.

 

When people defend bad workmanship because the guy selling them happens to be a "nice fellow", they allow bad (and in this case unsafe) products to continue to be made and sold, and that could eventually lead to someone getting hurt or potentially killed.

 

 

Edited to Add: 

 

The lack of quality with these holsters is quite apparent. I understand that with some guns it's hard to find holster options, but sometimes its best to just get a bladetech and modify it if need be. It wont be flashy, and it might not be the best ever, but it'll work, and it'll be safe. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ever seen one? They are solid as a rock and the best I've found. When my next one comes in that will be #4 and I've been through the usual subjects previously (Comp-tac, blade-tec etc) . 

 

It appears that the o.p.'s holster was molded with the required clearance for the thumb rest supplied with his gun, and that the one holster design apparently only works well for the gun in its original configuration. So yea apparently a mistake was made, if indeed there is a legitimate safety issue with this order (not doubting the o.p. but I haven't seen the video or held the holster so there is no way that I could make a fair judgement). 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 3, 2017 by IHAVEGAS

[Kingman]

This is the holster he sent back. Many of you guys have bought off me and have no issues. 

 

So so here's the deal. Dave buys said holster for no thumb rest. Puts holster with thumb rest in place on gun and complains that the thumb rest fits. Also says gun is the tightest he's ever had in holster. So I get said holster and can see it's clearly not indented for a thumb rest. 

 

So i take Orange and test with and without. With thumb rest no where near legal for anything. Without thumb rest perfectly normal as I have always done. 

 

I will attach both pictures. Additionally will share all emails with anyone that wants.  Basically if you want to use a holster another way than other than it was made it won't work. 

[Kingman]

Without Thumbrest attached. 

 

 

 

 

 

[wtturn]

A plain reading of the rule tells us it's not compliant if the trigger can be manipulated with an object.  With that said, when I RO I don't really give holsters a second look unless it's obviously unsafe, doesn't cover the trigger guard laterally, or a SERPA or something stupid.    

 

 

Edited April 3, 2017 by wtturn

[Kingman]

Without Thumb rest. 

 

 

 

Funds have already been refunded.  

[wtturn]

14 minutes ago, Kingman said:

This is the holster he sent back. Many of you guys have bought off me and have no issues. 

 

So so here's the deal. Dave buys said holster for no thumb rest. Puts holster with thumb rest in place on gun and complains that the thumb rest fits. Also says gun is the tightest he's ever had in holster. So I get said holster and can see it's clearly not indented for a thumb rest. 

 

So i take Orange and test with and without. With thumb rest no where near legal for anything. Without thumb rest perfectly normal as I have always done. 

 

I will attach both pictures. Additionally will share all emails with anyone that wants.  Basically if you want to use a holster another way than other than it was made it won't work. 

 

[NoKimberDave]

50 minutes ago, Kingman said:

Without Thumb rest. 

 

 

 

Funds have already been refunded.  

 

Please do post the emails.

 

The holster is unsafe because you made it that way. YOU.

Nothing on this holster was changed or worked or manipulated in any way. The only thing done by me was mount it and stick a gun in it. I don't know how many holsters you made and how many people you satisfied, you made this one wrong, and now are trying to place blame elsewhere. That says a lot about your character.

 

These photos prove my point. Look at the bottom one.

 

Just answer this simple question:

Can the trigger be set off with the gun in the holster with an object like a sharpie? YES or NO.

 

Here's video:

 

 

 

 

 

 

[NoKimberDave]

Here's one FOR thumbrest and the green one above:

 

 

[NoKimberDave]

Notice how low that side of green holster is?

 

And, gun with thumbrest smoothly and easily fits in gun. As if it were made for it. 

[NoKimberDave]

Red Hill Tactical refunded my money. Thank you RHT.

 

You can rest easily knowing you won't ever have to deal with me again!

 

Sorry I had to go to this trouble. Would have been a simple thing to not blame customer and instead just make it right out of the gate. 

I certainly don't like getting into this kind of thing over something I paid for and always, always, always go to the person first to make it right (which I did), and if I had my druthers it would be face to face.

 

I've said my piece. Plenty of proof from every angle posted, everyone here can decide for themselves. Cheers. -NKD