Keeping it together

[ErikW]

This question is mainly for Travis and Brian (and anybody else who is consistently at the top of their class or overall at big matches)...

How do you avoid self-destruction? What keeps you from falling apart?

I'm having a terrible time at non-local matches, and it's not because of match nerves or butterflies, which don't really affect me. I don't think it's because I'm trying to go too fast and shooting beyond my abilities. My speed is right where it should be. My classification percentage is 93+% but I'm consistently shooting around 75% at matches I travel to, mainly due to misses.

Almost every miss is a surprise, so I'm obviously not calling my shots. Which means I'm not seeing what I need to see when the shot breaks and following through.

This wasn't a problem when I started shooting big matches in 1999, when my first big match was my first match as a B. (I won B Limited at every big match I entered: Area 1, Golden Gate, and the Nationals.) I didn't shoot any big matches in my "winter in A class." Then I made Master and all last year I stinked up the class outside my local clubs. 65%-77% just about everywhere but the NorCal section match, which was mainly locals.

So I figured a new year, a new me, and I headed to the 3 Gun Nationals for my first big match of 2001. I tanked the long gun stages but won the Limited pistol overall, over Robbie and Taran and a host of other GMs and Ms. (I was at my usual speed and accuracy, without the misses.) I thought I had it all figured out. Then I went to the Linea de Fuego sectional and went down in flames, adding "failure to engage" to my list of stupid tricks. (I also got upset at crappy stages and crappy officiating and I let it affect me.)

This is frustrating like you wouldn't believe. I think I have the shooting skills to nip at the heels of the big dogs but I just can't keep it together. I think it's a matter of confidence, focus, and concentration on the task at hand. At Las Vegas I felt this incredible confidence in my ability, I knew exactly where the targets would be, I saw the right sight pictures for the shots I was taking, I called my shots, and I just plain had my shit together. I remember the same confidence in other good matches, but I never had it at the bad matches.

How do I get it back on demand?

[Detlef]

Let me add to the question: I'm at a similar point to where Erik is, and I experience the same frustration. I do really well when I consciously *take it down* a notch or two (but isn't taking it down shooting below capability???) and simply don't shoot unless I see what I need to see. But there are stages where I just seem to *forget* about my own rule of seeing, and then misses and no shoots occur. How do I avoid *forgetting*?

I am convinced that in big matches you cannot throw dice, i.e. you cannot shoot misses/Ds/no shoots etc at a rate of more than one in every 500 shots fired. Or can you?

Incidentally, there may also be something wrong with the way I train. Hardly any training session (I usually shoot about 200 rds per session, then I seem to get tired and/or lose concentration and practice the wrong things) without missed shots. Now why would I expect to do better in a big match than at home practicing? Should one go for completely flawless training sessions? I just don't seem to be able to get into *match spirit* during practice sessions, and I experiment more (than I should?).

This *should* really be one of the most active threads!

--Detlef

[BigDave]

First off, let me qualify myself in saying that I have no actual experience in shooting pistol matches, but in reading the questions, I would like to offer my opinion.

In Brian's book he describes his shooting at (I think it is his first) Bianchi Cup.  During the mover he was having trouble with his sight tracking.  I belive he ends up describing his thoughts as (para) 'I loosened my grip, relaxed and the sight tracked perfectly!'  Maybe that is worth some thought.  Is it possible in the big matches you are feeling rushed or you have to go that much faster to 'win'?  I don't think it is a confidence problem, maybe its a rushing problem.

Look at the thread in the Shooting Technique forum under the Fast Draw where one of the members describes that after the gun clears the holster and is at gut level, slow down up to presentation.  What I am getting at is, you said that you have shown that you already posses the ability to shoot very, very well, maybe what is keeping you from doing that at all levels is that maybe you are feeling rushed or hurried at the top levels.

What if you were to try to deliberately slow yourself down a bit at the next 'big' match and see how that works.

I liken what I am talking about to golf in regards to the driving range vs. an acutal round.  At the range, I can crush my driver 340-350 yds off the tee, consistantly.  However, when I get play an actual round, I can't hit that club to save my life.  However, on odd occassions I will find that certain point in my game where I am totally relaxed and not activly thinking about how to hit the damn ball and actually do it.  Sorta like the line in the movie 'Tin Cup' - "Just grip it and rip it!!!"

Does this make any sense?  I hope so...

[38supPat]

This SHOULD be one of the most active threads..unfortunately it's also one of the hardest to answer.

Some of this should answer both sets of questions...I hope.

In most forms of racing ( and IPSC sort of falls into this category ) The top runners are not going at max. ability. I know thats hard to swallow after seeing someone like Rob L. Jerry B. or Todd J. smoke a course. (or Travis and Brian too). The problem is if you are going at 100% of the limit of your ability there is a huge chance you'll push just that little bit over your limit and crash. The Top guys know that winning stage glory is fine but if you want to win the match you gotta be consistent. In 1997 Jerry Barnhard won the Open Nationals without winning a single stage. He just stayed steady and played his game. No blistering stages but no mistakes. One thing I've learned over time is that more often than not, the match is not decided by who out shoots who, but who made the least errors. Especially in the big matches.

In practice I like to start by shooting groups, work on sight visualization and tracking as well as focus. Then I'll work on the drill of the day. Here I'll work up with some predictable steady runs then try to build up the speed. Test the limits of what I can do. If I start to miss or bobble, I turn it down a notch. You have to push yourself to go fast in practice and see what happens. Then moderate it with clean consistent runs. See how fast you can go then see how much you have to dial back to stay in control. You have to experiment to see what you are capable of then see what it takes to be steady.

You have to be driven to stick with the game plan rather than be sucked into trying to keep up with or beat the M's/GM's. The squad I usually shoot with as the U.S. Nationals is brutal. There are several high M's to mid Gm's all of who are capable of coming close to the Super Squad. Unfortunatly it becomes a hosefest every year with each shooter feeding off the speed of the others. Everyone is out to smoke each other from stage to stage, not play their own game. And most crash and burn sooner or later. Ignore the other scores, get your plan and do what you can do. Don't push and don't hold back. Decide whats acceptable and do it. If you think about going fast or shooting A's your mind isn't on what it's actually doing. I know I'm going on here in length but here's a small story. In 1996 I went to the Open Nationals. I was shooting well and getting alot of attention from the masters on my squad. It was my first U.S.  Nationals and I was shooting very well, they all commented favorably on my skill (look at my head swell will you) All was good til I got to the Chronograph. Did I mention I was shooting a borrowed gun (mine broke at the Can. Nationals that year) and hadn't had time to work up a load, I just went with a suggested one. Well I ended up minor (really sux), this was half way through the match. Many guys on my squad said 'just shoot A's'. I didn't, because I knew my head was already screwed up enough I didn't need to be thinking of only hitting A's. I shot as I would have had I been major and still managed to beat some fellow squad members even though I was minor. Afterward they commented on how well I shot and didn't seem to let the minor score affect my shooting. It never occured to me to change. I did what I knew I could do. No more, no less. And still managed to come home with a couple of hundred dollars worth of prizes. I learned alot from that. Play YOUR game and you will do the best that you can.

Pat    

[John Thompson]

Concerning Detlef's question about getting into practice, this is how I turn up the pressure.  All you need is about one to three friends(two are better), a stage pit, a couple of paper targets, some none falling steel, maybe a prop or two, and a hand full of quarters.  Oh yeah, don't forget to bring at least 500rds of ammo.  Every couple of weeks me and a couple of friends set up some targets and think of different ways to run it.  Then we have contests to se who can run it the fastest with all A's.  The winner keeps the quarter bets.  Double tap the steel(keeps things going quickly because you don't have to past as may targets) and change the course of fire after a few runs.  Try this,for me it's way more fun then any match and it can really get  competitive.

[ErikW]

I think at the 2000 LimNats I may have been sucked into going shooting beyond my ability by my squad. (I still think I can take J.J.!) But the other times I've been shooting well within my ability, not pushing it. The crashing and burning has got to be something else.

BTW, I don't believe in "shooting too fast" or "slowing down" anymore. I've learned I just need to see a certain sight picture and have a certain trigger pull to shoot an A on a given target. Speediness or slowness is just a result of the equation, not a desired effect.

[TravisT]

(Edited by TravisT at 6:16 pm on June 11, 2002)

[38supPat]

Thanks Travis, but don't hold your breath on a book...I still have way too much to learn.

I think we've all learned from past performances...good and bad. I've blown my share of leads too. Just ask Derrill Imrie or Doni J. They've seen me throw away the Nationals a couple of times (oops). But I've learned from what I've done . I avoid carrying the outcome of one stage with me to the next. Each one is a whole new experience, to limit it by thinking of what happened on the last run just destroys your  confidence and focus.

Erik: take a look at the stages you've crashed on. Is there a common thread? Here's a reason for keeping a journal, it'll help identify any common problems you might have. Sometimes I find I've taken a skill set for granted and not practiced it enough, I just expect to be able to perform it on demand. An uncalled miss just means you didn't see the sights, I've seen good shooters miss targets just because they 'knew' they could hit them (I've done it myself) usually on fairly easy targets. Or something interrupted or degraded your focus, this is one reason I don't over visualize a stage. We've all seen shooters behind the line go through the stage over, and over, and over in their head. Sometimes walking it over and over. I find it hard to maintain focus that long. My mind gets tired and shuts off or drifts (usually as I'm actually shooting the stage). Now I look at the stage, get a plan, visualize it a couple of times and then do something else, patch, talk to others, joke around or anything to keep my mind free of thought. Then when I'm on deck I'll look the stage over again, make any changes if nessessary (according to what I may have seen happen with other shooters) and visualize it once. Clear my mind and wait for my turn. After the load and make ready, I'll visualize once and assume the start position. I only have my race face on for the minimum amount of time I need to. Some shooters can stay focused for long periods eg. the Burner or Doug Koenig but I know that doesn't work for me. It's a personality thing, you'll have to experiment to see how long you can focus and if there's a time when you just have to walk away and clear your head.

Pat  

[kellyn]

Hey there dark horse!  I am in the same boat you are.  I have a great deal of trouble shooting a consistant major match.  One thing that has really been helping me lately is to shoot the match my own way.  I used to 1) try to burn each stage down shooting it at 110% and 2) religiously copy Rob  L, Voight etc.  While I would win some stages, I would crash in others.  I have changed my strategy and it seems to be helping.  At the Mystery Mtn 3 Gun, I think I shot every stage differently than the big boys, which was hard b/c I was squadded with them.  The only one I crashed in was the last one where I tried to copy Miculek.  Big MISTAKE! I've found that there are some things that others do that I cannot do consistantly.  I've also found that I can do things that others can't do.  I've really started to look at matches as a whole, instead of trying to win each stage.   Learn from others but BE YOURSELF!!!  

[benos]

Detlef, Kelly, and Eric,

One thing you might be missing when you speak of "adjusting" your speed at the match is that - when you're shooting "just right," YOU CAN'T, OR SHOULDN'T BE ABLE TO, TELL HOW FAST YOU ARE GOING. You, the censor, disappear in the action. If you are not "gone," you are confusing yourself.

You can't "simulate" a match in practice. The mind is tricky like that. If you doubt this, think of how tricky it is at the nationals.

One more thing: I know for certain (from Eric's question on "how do you prevent?...&quot that you can't prevent ANYTHING; you just have to BE THERE each and every time.

An ancient said: There has never been anything given to anyone, and there has never been anything received from another.

There is no insurance. (I made that one up.

be

[BigDave]

Brian -  "there is no insurance", I beg to differ!!!  I am in the insurance business, according to you, my paycheck must be an mirage!!!  Just kidding!  I agree...

One common thing I am reading here is that all who responded emphasize that you (me) must be in the "present tense" or the hear and now.  I must say that this type of mindset applies not only in shooting, but in life as well, and dammit, it works.

I am an insurance adjustor (quit your booing, we really are not that bad) for a very, very large insurance company.  I deal with losses involving homes and commerical poperty.  When I was a trainee and went to my first total building loss (enitire house and belongings destroyed by fire, very, very sad) I was overwhelmed emotionally, physically and mentally.  My mentor, a well seasoned adjustor, pulled me aside and told me " you have done this before, single room losses, this building is just a whole bunch of them together.  Break it down into pieces you can see and understand, then, at the end bring it all together into one"  Talk about an epiphany (sp?)!!!  Perhaps these big matches are the same way.  Anyone here has shot a COF of some type, the only difference in the "Big" matches is the number of competitors and perhaps the quality.  Is it really all that different from your local events?  Look at like a 20 oz. t-bone steak.  Hell, if you try to eat it all in one bight, you are going to choke!!!  But, if you break it down into small, manageable, understandable pieces (a stage, a string, a target, a draw, get the picture?) you have no choice but to succeed, on your own level.  The question then is, if I just performed the best I could at this moment, is that better than the guy next to me?  Maybe it is, maybe not.  If so, great.  If not, still great!!!  At least you know at that point in time and in those circumstances you did everything at the top of your own ability. What more can you ask of yourself?  

[ErikW]

Brian, in the matches in which I did well, I felt like a detached observer while shooting. I wasn't moving the gun or focusing on the sight, it was all kind of just happening before me. Great, so if that's the key, how do I get into that mindset?

Travis, at the 3 Gun Nationals, no other Limited pistol shooters kept it together for four stages. I only had two thirds, a fifth, and a sixth, but it was enough. I'm sure with a couple more stages Taran and Robbie would have ended up ahead of me. And remember, it was a 3 gun match; I only did well with 33.3% of the guns!

I can't believe you shot only 1000 rounds of practice last year. That's incredible! Just how much dry-firing was that?

[TravisT]

(Edited by TravisT at 6:17 pm on June 11, 2002)

[ErikW]

Is there anybody playing this game who is not a privateer? (Besides Todd J. and Rob L.) I'm sure everybody else pays for some of their components and most of their travel expenses.

I'd really like to have help with bullets or other components, but I'm told you have to win big matches to get your name out there and snag sponsors.

[Detlef]

Travis,

1000 rds a year and 20 min dry-fire per month???!!!??? I'm going now to find a tall building to jump off....

--Detlefffffff (sound of plunging body...)

[Rich Bagoly]

---

I've learned I just need to see a certain sight picture and have a certain trigger pull to shoot an A on a given target.

---

Do you stop looking before seeing the sights lift?

This is a big problem for me.    

Don't let your brain get lazy on you.  It may have calculated the sum of the sight picture and trigger pull, but all the variables don't factor out until the bullet leaves the barrel.

[benos]

Guys, you have to realize that our friend, the Great Young Hope, is extremely athletic by nature - it helps. I remember the first time I saw him shoot was at a match in New Mexico. Someone told me to check out this new kid, he was really fast and moved like a gazelle, although he was somtimes lacking in his actual score on the target. I watched him fly through this big assualt stage - I just stood there with my mouth hanging open - I had NEVER seen anyone move like that! I asked around, and was told he was an quite the adept at soccer, which helped explain the footwork. And I don't think the arms, eyes, and hands are that much different.

Anyway, as far as seeing the sights lift - dont' fall into the trap of thinking you have to do the same thing on every target. At each moment, which is most important or difficult thing you need to do - hitting the target you are shooting at, or getting to the next target quickly?

be

[PaulW]

Back on the subject of "keeping it together" at big matches....  I use to play a lot of golf, I mean a lot.  Sooo many times I would be shooting a good score and then I would stop and ad up where I was on the 15th or 16th hole.  The next several holes I usually fell apart.  I started thinking that each hole was it's own seperated game.  Play all 18 games and then add up the score.  Well now that shooting is my main focus I try the same thing.  A few years ago at the Fl. State I had a "mike" on the first stage.  I let it eat and eat at me untill I could hardly stand myself.  So at big match and even local matches I play each stage as it's own game.  Play that game (Shoot the stage)  the best you can, at that moment.  I try not to even bother myself with the scores at a big match until I am done.  I can't change the score, and I can only shot each stage the best I can at that moment.  Once I have shot my last stage I will go through and figure out hit factors and check the posting to be sure they are accurate.  This has taken a lot of the pressure off....Shoot the best you can and let the computer add 'em up!

[benos]

A little mind trick I practiced was, when approaching a stage at a match, ask yourself - how would I shoot the stage if this was just one stage in a match that encompased the entire shooting year? If you use this approach from stage to stage at a match, you will benfit, if you look at each stage in each match as part of the "big match" it might help to keep the racer wanting to see the "checkered flag" in the basement, and you doing what needs to be done.

be

[TravisT]

(Edited by TravisT at 6:17 pm on June 11, 2002)

[Kevin Kline]

I agree with Pat in his post when he talked about the consistentcy instead of winning each stage. (Actually I believe Todd won the 97 Nationals, Open and Limited. Thats the year of won both. He had won the World Shoot in 96. Jerry won both Limited and Open Nationals in 96 and again in 99.)

But he is correct in saying that you don't have to win any stages to win the match or do very well. Also, believe it or not, Rob, Jerry, Todd and the other greats are probably not shooting at 100%. Todd had told me in a class to shoot to 95% of your ability, no more. His reasoning was that you want to shoot to 95% of your ability because this is what you can do on demand everytime. If you shoot at 100%, chances are pretty great that will go over and crash and burn and doing so in just one stage will blow your match, compared to the shooter who shoots at 95% for the entire match and has consistent match points.

Kevin/IPSC Supercop

[38supPat]

My bad...You are correct on Nationals winners. But the result was the same, Jerry did not win a single stage but walked away with the match trophy.

Some thing else..and this depends strongly on personality type...Some shooters try to stay hard (no comments Mike ) for too long of a period. If you take the US Nationals as an example, with squads of 12-18 shooters it can be a long time from the walk through, where you formulate your plan, to your actual shoot time. If you attempt to stay focused that long (and I'm talking more of a directed focus here ) you will inevitably fry your mind. Some are quite good at it. Jerry B and Doug K. are exceptional. However I have observed that Todd, Robbie, and a few others don't opperate in this fashion, neither do I. I like to get my plan, work it out how I want to shoot the stage, then do something else. I'll clean mags, reorganize my gun bag, or just joke around and have a bit of fun . I've recently been told that this is a bit distracting to other shooters, but its how I deal with match pressure. I need to clear my head, then when its time to shoot I'll go over my plan again, visualize the stage, joke a bit with the RO and load and make ready. NOW I'll put on the game face. This year I've done quite a bit of experimenting on my attitude and mindset when I approach a match/stage. Generally I find that if I distract myself from what others are doing when they shoot, or to keep myself from over analyzing/visually practicing the stage, I will do better.

Next time you are at a smaller local match, play with this, see where your mind needs to be to operate without stressing yourself out.  There is more to learn about this game than just how to pull a trigger.

Pat

[Kevin Kline]

Pat,

Sorry, I wasn't trying to make a point on the Nationals thing, just tried to keep the record straight and it isn't often I get one on the Big Boys like you and Brian. But you are correct on dealing with match pressure and nerves. It's almost scary listening to you describe the way you handle it because I am almost exactly the same way. I mean almost everything you said you did and the way you do it is exactly the same way I do it. Seems to work for me though.