Just4FunLP Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 I've been shooting USPSA production for a while now, and I'm going to shoot a steel challenge match in the morning. I have a new CZ with DA/SA and a manual safety. What is my starting condition? I'm hoping cocked and locked. In USPSA it's hammer down. I know I could probably find the answers in here somewhere, but I need to get some sleep. I hope I find some good news in the morning. Sorry for posting such a lame question. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatriotMRD Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 I just read through the Steel Challenge rules and it is vague but, we have always defaulted to USPSA start conditions for the respective divisions. DA Production guns start hammer down. If someone can show me where I'm wrong, please do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornetx40 Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 I just read through the Steel Challenge rules and it is vague but, we have always defaulted to USPSA start conditions for the respective divisions. DA Production guns start hammer down. If someone can show me where I'm wrong, please do so. You are correct. In Prod.it must be shot DA first shot in each string. The only problem I have encountered with prod guns is the shooters don't understand that ULSC new shooters will use a decocker to drop the hammer. You have to watch them and make sure they drop the hammer with the trigger on the empty chamber. Usually after explaining the reason for this they understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatriotMRD Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 I just read through the Steel Challenge rules and it is vague but, we have always defaulted to USPSA start conditions for the respective divisions. DA Production guns start hammer down. If someone can show me where I'm wrong, please do so. You are correct. In Prod.it must be shot DA first shot in each string. The only problem I have encountered with prod guns is the shooters don't understand that ULSC new shooters will use a decocker to drop the hammer. You have to watch them and make sure they drop the hammer with the trigger on the empty chamber. Usually after explaining the reason for this they understand. I've cought this many times with new shooters and make them repeat the ULSC. I do explain why and don't remember anyone having a problem with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaylanGivens Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 Shoot in Limited instead of Production... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 I just read through the Steel Challenge rules and it is vague but, we have always defaulted to USPSA start conditions for the respective divisions. DA Production guns start hammer down. If someone can show me where I'm wrong, please do so. Which rule is vague and how would you change it to make it less vague? I'm working with DNROI on a rules update so we'd might as well address this while we're at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatriotMRD Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 I don't see where it specifies hammer up or down for Production. You have to cross reference to USPSA rules to figure that out. The rulebook should be able to stand on its own or combine the rulebooks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 I don't see where it specifies hammer up or down for Production. You have to cross reference to USPSA rules to figure that out. The rulebook should be able to stand on its own or combine the rulebooks. Thanks for the feedback. That's one suggestion I made. We need to have our own, complete, stand alone, rule book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Shooting Steel Challenge with my CO rig I always start hammer down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photoracer Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 I have always done what I did in USPSA. Safety on in the 1911/2011, nothing on the Glock, and de-cocking my HK. The HK is a DA/SA with both a safety and a de-cocker (same lever). So in that case, same as every other organization I shoot it in, I always de-cock the hammer before holstering the gun for the next run as that is correct for a gun with all the options on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornetx40 Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Thanks for the feedback. That's one suggestion I made. We need to have our own, complete, stand alone, rule book. Zack that is probably the biggest problem with the rules. Crossing two sets of rules is confusing. If SCSA wants to go buy the Prod gun list thats one thing......You should go back a couple of years before the rules were chopped with no input. Some of the lost rules were needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Zack that is probably the biggest problem with the rules. Crossing two sets of rules is confusing. If SCSA wants to go buy the Prod gun list thats one thing......You should go back a couple of years before the rules were chopped with no input. Some of the lost rules were needed. Would you have any idea where I could find a copy of the old rules? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottlep Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Here are 2011 rules. Has differences from the 2013 book. 5.2.3 - "Finger out of trigger guard" for rimfire was one of the first ones I saw. http://steelchallenge.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/SCSARules.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottlep Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Here are even older rules... 2009 - http://steelchallenge.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/SCSA%20Draft%20Rules%20for%20dist2-17.pdf more 2009 - http://steelchallenge.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/SCSA%20Draft%20Rules%20for%20dist4-24.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornetx40 Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Zack those are the same ones I found. Scott beat me to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottlep Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 I am reading through the 2011 rules now wondering why some of them were removed or reworded to make them more vague. Seems like many of the changes that wound up in the 2013 rules just added to the current confusion. 2011 rules had an Open Revo division too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Thanks for the links! I've copied the text from each them into text files. After I do some formatting on them I can use my "diff" program to show me the differences between the various versions. This will be a big help for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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