Just4FunLP Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 I've got an XDM 5.25 with about 60 - 70 thousand rounds on it. It's had the usual parts replaced as well as the slide. The barrel is the original. I checked it the other day shooting seated on a picnic table with my range bag as a rest and could manage about a 5" group at 25 yards shooting Bayou 124gr RN and 5.1 gr of Accurate No. 5. I think I should be getting better results. How should I go about figuring out what to do next? Is it worth putting anything into it? Should I ship it to someone for evaluation? I'd like to find someone locally that has a Ransom Rest. Should I use some factory ammo or another bullet to see if I get better results? Is so what do you recommend. Thanks for your help.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted October 14, 2015 Author Share Posted October 14, 2015 Hmmm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rancher5 Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 I've got an XDM 5.25 with about 60 - 70 thousand rounds on it. It's had the usual parts replaced as well as the slide. The barrel is the original. I checked it the other day shooting seated on a picnic table with my range bag as a rest and could manage about a 5" group at 25 yards shooting Bayou 124gr RN and 5.1 gr of Accurate No. 5. I think I should be getting better results. How should I go about figuring out what to do next? Is it worth putting anything into it? Should I ship it to someone for evaluation? I'd like to find someone locally that has a Ransom Rest. Should I use some factory ammo or another bullet to see if I get better results? Is so what do you recommend. Thanks for your help.... Personally its not a great test,25yds actual, bullet barrel combo makes a big difference. 5" whitebox ammo 25yds good group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grapemeister Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) I would think you should be getting better groups. If the barrel is good, the ammo is good, and your confident in your bench rest shooting ability, maybe have SA look at it. Maybe the barrel needs to be refitted or replaced. SA will definitely tell you what's going on. If their cost, plus the shipping back and forth is too much, get a new gun. They do ware out, you know. Or maybe you'll get lucky, and it's something that is still covered by the warranty, but I have doubts about that. I've actually thought about sending one of my old Tacticals in to be tightened up, but their cheap, and I may as well get a new one. Of course, mine is almost all stock, and I haven't put very much money in it. Edit to add: I don't know what your shooting game is, if any, but no matter what, a 5" spread at 25 yards is not acceptable, even with factory white box. If it's USPSA, the lower A is about 5 inches wide, so under normal conditions, and with the usual wobble zone when not shooting from a bench rest, there isn't much room for error. Same goes for a plate or pepper popper at 25 yards. Hope you let us know what you decide to do, and any results. Edited October 14, 2015 by grapemeister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.E. Kelley Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 Have you put that 60 to 70K though the gun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robport Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 I've got an XDM 5.25 with about 60 - 70 thousand rounds on it. It's had the usual parts replaced as well as the slide. The barrel is the original. I checked it the other day shooting seated on a picnic table with my range bag as a rest and could manage about a 5" group at 25 yards shooting Bayou 124gr RN and 5.1 gr of Accurate No. 5. I think I should be getting better results. How should I go about figuring out what to do next? Is it worth putting anything into it? Should I ship it to someone for evaluation? I'd like to find someone locally that has a Ransom Rest. Should I use some factory ammo or another bullet to see if I get better results? Is so what do you recommend. Thanks for your help.... Personally its not a great test,25yds actual, bullet barrel combo makes a big difference. 5" whitebox ammo 25yds good group. I agree with this. I believe that first you might try the same thing with several types of ammo. Before you spend a lot of money on it, you may want to rule out the fact that your gun just doesn't like that ammo. On the other hand, you could have a bigger problem with other stuff if your gun does like it....either way, you might want to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted October 14, 2015 Author Share Posted October 14, 2015 Have you put that 60 to 70K though the gun? Yea. At least 60,000 - 70,000 rounds. Mostly Precision Bullets, but now I'm shooting Bayou. Mostly 124gr for what it's worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted October 14, 2015 Author Share Posted October 14, 2015 "and your confident in your bench rest shooting ability".... That's the thing. I'm not confident of much of anything. I'm barely B in USPSA production trying to do my best to keep it in the A zone, my gun has some miles on it, and I do everything I can to keep my reloading costs down. In Saul Kirsch's book Thinking Practical Shooting he mentions that a competition gun should be capable of 2" groups. I cant remember off the top of my head what the distance was, but 25yds sounds correct. (he does seem to lean towards open guns). As you mentioned if I'm trying to hit an A zone with a gun that can barely do it from a rest, so I'm going to be a frustrated shooter until I figure out what the problem is. I guess I mainly need a recommendation on some accurate ammo to purchase for testing and hopefully someone local (Tallahassee Florida) with a ransom rest I can borrow. It's probably the shooter, but I want to know for sure. Thanks for the responses, it's always a big help... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_striker Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) One thing I've noticed when shooting groups with pistols off of a rest is that you need to support your wrists and elbows with the rest rather than the gun itself. I've noticed that with a few different brands of pistols. Whenever I support the gun off the bottom of the frame, I get really big groups. Support wrists and elbows and the group tightens up quite a bit. What were groups like when you first got that gun? Edited October 14, 2015 by d_striker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted October 14, 2015 Author Share Posted October 14, 2015 Wow. Never tried it that way. I've been shooting by sitting on a picnic table bench with my range bag and whatever else I happen to have handy sitting on top of that and resting the front of my gun on top. My wrists and elbows are free. The sights don't move (I think), so I figured it was an OK technique. That's why I'm interested in the ransom rest. It looks like using this should make the aiming very repeatable. When I first got my gun I didn't know how to shoot, but I think I have (with a little luck) been able to put 5 or 6 in the B zone on on a metric target standing at 25 yards, but haven't tried that in a while. I'll have to give your method a try. They write a lot about shooting in a match, but I haven't seen much about how to checking for accuracy. I did have to send my gun back to SA one time because of a damaged slide. When it came back I took it to practice and figured I would need to sight it in, but found that it shot better than it ever had. I asked them if they could just send be the part, but they said it had to be "fitted" to the gun, so I assume the guys in the shop probably take more time and do a better job test firing it that the factory. Anyway it was a very noticeable improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_striker Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 It could just be me. It's worth a try next time you're out shooting groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skywatcher Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 i would think it needs a barrel as mine is sloppy frame to slide fit and only 1000 thru it but good accuracy but i dont see it going 50,000 and being accurate without a major overhaul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 support your wrists and elbows with the rest rather than the gun itself. Whenever I support the gun off the bottom of the frame, I get really big groups. About a year ago, Brian Enos posted that he thought you should support the gun itself, and I questioned it. I had always heard NOT to support the gun, but the wrists, also. He reiterated his point, so I tested it at the range. Supporting the gun on a bag and the mag firmly grounded, I shot The Best Pistol Groups of my life (ten shots in 3" at 52 yards = and eight of them in 2"). So, now I'm a firm believer in securing the entire gun, plus my wrists if possible - seems to work pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_striker Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 support your wrists and elbows with the rest rather than the gun itself. Whenever I support the gun off the bottom of the frame, I get really big groups. About a year ago, Brian Enos posted that he thought you should support the gun itself, and I questioned it. I had always heard NOT to support the gun, but the wrists, also. He reiterated his point, so I tested it at the range. Supporting the gun on a bag and the mag firmly grounded, I shot The Best Pistol Groups of my life (ten shots in 3" at 52 yards = and eight of them in 2"). So, now I'm a firm believer in securing the entire gun, plus my wrists if possible - seems to work pretty well. That's good to know. It must be something that I'm doing then as I get better groups without the bottom of the dust cover resting on a bag or hard object. When supporting my wrists, the bottom of the mag is often supported though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powderman81 Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 Springfield will install a new "match" barrel for $190. If its really bothering you its not a bad idea. Powderman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blaze190 Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 I've also got a XDM 5.25 but in 40. I've got about 10,000 rounds through mine so far and I have experienced the same 5 inch group problem with mine at 25 yards but only when I switched to the blue lead bullets to try a cheaper alternative to plated or jacketed. It drove me crazy until I went back to my tried and true extreme 180 grain hollow points. With the extreme it will group around 3 inch groups at 25 yards shooting freestyle. So you may want to try a different bullet. Mine for some reason would not group well with the blue bullets no matter what I tried so you might be experiencing the same thing with the bayou bullets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted October 22, 2015 Author Share Posted October 22, 2015 Awesome responses. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted November 7, 2015 Author Share Posted November 7, 2015 (edited) I would think you should be getting better groups. If the barrel is good, the ammo is good, and your confident in your bench rest shooting ability, maybe have SA look at it. Maybe the barrel needs to be refitted or replaced. SA will definitely tell you what's going on. If their cost, plus the shipping back and forth is too much, get a new gun. They do ware out, you know. Or maybe you'll get lucky, and it's something that is still covered by the warranty, but I have doubts about that. I've actually thought about sending one of my old Tacticals in to be tightened up, but their cheap, and I may as well get a new one. Of course, mine is almost all stock, and I haven't put very much money in it. Edit to add: I don't know what your shooting game is, if any, but no matter what, a 5" spread at 25 yards is not acceptable, even with factory white box. If it's USPSA, the lower A is about 5 inches wide, so under normal conditions, and with the usual wobble zone when not shooting from a bench rest, there isn't much room for error. Same goes for a plate or pepper popper at 25 yards. Hope you let us know what you decide to do, and any results. I decided. After my front sight broke off at the Monster Match at Universal I shot the best match of my life (which may not be saying much) with a borrowed XD. This gun had a very good trigger and the owner said he had another one with a significantly better trigger. That's it! My days of learning to be a gunsmith are over. I plunked down the bug bucks for a CZ Accu Shadow. They had it in stock and I would have had it this weekend if the @$&!!! FFL would have been in when the Fedex truck made the delivery. No more blaming the gun. It's all about my lack of skill now. Edited November 7, 2015 by Just4FunLP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grapemeister Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 Good luck with that....traitor! But in all seriousness, the CZ's are nice. I was on a savings plan to get one myself, until I found out Seeklander is having a class here in Gainesville next month. I figure the class will be more beneficial for my shooting than switching to a CZ, so the CZ idea is ditched, indefinitely. The left over money is going for more ammo, which of course, we can never get enough of. Besides, I still like shooting my XD's. Best wishes, Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted November 7, 2015 Author Share Posted November 7, 2015 (edited) Yea. I was planning to take a class myself when it cooled down. Maybe they'll do anothen class after the Florida Open. I may not have enough strength left.... Edited November 7, 2015 by Just4FunLP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 Pick someone you shoot with that is a good shot and let them shoot it, see how they do. Obviously, a Ransom Rest is the best solution if you can run across someone that has one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckie45 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 let's see the Accu Shadow Groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted November 10, 2015 Author Share Posted November 10, 2015 Well. I held it in my hands today, but I have a waiting period to deal with. You know I'm not much of a gun collector. I bought one and shot the heck out of it, so I didn't remember all the ins and outs of transferring. What a pain. In the 60 seconds I held it in my hands I'll say that the grips, if that's what you call them, are nice looking, but aren't so good. Maybe I won't be so negative after I spend some time with it. I think I may go with JGus and end up buying the cheap CZ plastic grips and covering it with Talons. I know all the CZ guys are cringing. I will say when I got home I pulled out the old XDM and realized it's really a great feeling gun. It's worn out and beat to death, but it's a good design. Also, the DA seemed really, crazy, long, and heavy. Again, that's just me. I've only had one pistol, so the CZ in very unfamiliar. I'll trust all the guys on BE who say it's not difficult to figure out the DA. Of course the target in the box shows a really tight group, and the the SA is crazy. I put my finger on the trigger and the hammer falls. After cycling the slide I let my finger out about 3/16 and it resets. :). When I finally put it in the truck I'm headed straight to the range for some 25yd head shots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted November 23, 2015 Author Share Posted November 23, 2015 let's see the Accu Shadow Groups. All shots were from a standing position and shooting at a fairly steady rate. Need to adjust the sights to compensate for me... 25 yards 50 yards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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