sti eagle for uspsa and idpa?

[3djedi]

I've never handled a 2011 and I don't know anybody who has one. How is the grip compared to, say, an m&p? Is it much thicker?

[Jim Watson]

Not much thicker, a good deal more squared off.

I don't mind and I have medium-small guy hands.

I agree that the .40 Eagle with bushing is the most versatile.

If you didn't mind loading and keeping separate .40 Minor for IDPA ESP and Major for USPSA Limited, you could even have separate recoil springs balanced for the two loads. If you wanted more weight at major, put the major spring on a tungsten guide rod and leave it there.

I once saw an ad for a heavy barrel with a tungsten cone over a steel tube to add weight where it would affect the action the most. I don't know if it is still available, but if so, it would go with your major ammo and USPSA setup.

As said, you could have a set of 126mm magazines for ESP - you wouldn't have to have but three - and some 140s for Limited... or shoot L-10.

Edited August 8, 2013 by Jim Watson

[3djedi]

Thanks!

Out of curiosity do any of you also have an m&p? I'm just wondering what kind of benefits I would see from switching from my m&p pro 40 5" to the sti eagle.

The m&p does a pretty good job. Accuracy isn't the greatest but one nice thing is I can just swap in a 9mm barrel and use it in idpa. Put back the 40 barrel use the 140mm mags and go nuts for uspsa limited...

[3djedi]

And I don't reload yet. Would I be better served by running the m&p I already have and buy some reloading equipment instead? Maybe put off the sti until next year. I'm just not sure what to do. I'm just drooling over the sti! Lol

[RH45]

Just get a eagle bushing in 40 to use in both sports if you only want to buy one gun.

+1

[3djedi]

Is it cheaper to reload anyway? I get .40 for $16/50 and 9mm for 14.50/50

[Forgetful]

Is it cheaper to reload anyway? I get .40 for $16/50 and 9mm for 14.50/50

Depends on how much you pay for components. Right now they are still inflated a bit and sparse from the Dec12 panic.

Using components I bought in November (with free brass)

I'm at

$11. 5per 100 for 40

$10.5 per 100 for 9

Both using lead bullets; add an extra 2-3 dollars for plated/jacket per 100.

With today's prices add another 2-5$ per 100 (unless you're patient and can wait for a deal)

Fwiw you can get minor and major 40 from Atlanta arms loaded long OAL. Loaded long is a key part in feeding a 2011 smoothly.

[mjohn]

Is it cheaper to reload anyway? I get .40 for $16/50 and 9mm for 14.50/50

My criteria for compassion purposes is to compare USA made FACTORY AMMO from a top name manufactrure, not reloads, brass cased and FMJ. I think it might be impossible to find $16 40 and $14.50 9.

There is a difference in quality and bullets. Make sure you compare apples to apples.

[3djedi]

Is it cheaper to reload anyway? I get .40 for $16/50 and 9mm for 14.50/50

Depends on how much you pay for components. Right now they are still inflated a bit and sparse from the Dec12 panic.

Using components I bought in November (with free brass)

I'm at

$11. 5per 100 for 40

$10.5 per 100 for 9

Both using lead bullets; add an extra 2-3 dollars for plated/jacket per 100.

With today's prices add another 2-5$ per 100 (unless you're patient and can wait for a deal)

Fwiw you can get minor and major 40 from Atlanta arms loaded long OAL. Loaded long is a key part in feeding a 2011 smoothly.

Unfortunately, Atlanta arms isn't accepting any new customers at this time.

[3djedi]

Is it cheaper to reload anyway? I get .40 for $16/50 and 9mm for 14.50/50

My criteria for compassion purposes is to compare USA made FACTORY AMMO from a top name manufactrure, not reloads, brass cased and FMJ. I think it might be impossible to find $16 40 and $14.50 9.

There is a difference in quality and bullets. Make sure you compare apples to apples.

Yes, these are commercial factory reloads fmj.

[Jim Watson]

Yes, I have both a Plastic M&P, a 9mm standard length with Burwell trigger and fibre optic sight; and a 2011 .45 by a local gunsmith in Eagle configuration.

I shoot mostly IDPA and have no need or interest in .40.

The 2011 is a great shooter but has been a constant aggravation over magazines. I have seven, no three alike; three pairs and an oddball. Rather than try to get them exchanged on warranty or pay to have them "tuned," I tinkered with loads until I arrived at something they would all handle. Not feasible if you are buying your ammo.

The PM&P just works.

[3djedi]

Yes, I have both a Plastic M&P, a 9mm standard length with Burwell trigger and fibre optic sight; and a 2011 .45 by a local gunsmith in Eagle configuration.

I shoot mostly IDPA and have no need or interest in .40.

The 2011 is a great shooter but has been a constant aggravation over magazines. I have seven, no three alike; three pairs and an oddball. Rather than try to get them exchanged on warranty or pay to have them "tuned," I tinkered with loads until I arrived at something they would all handle. Not feasible if you are buying your ammo.

The PM&P just works.

Whats the issue with mags?

[3djedi]

Yes, I have both a Plastic M&P, a 9mm standard length with Burwell trigger and fibre optic sight; and a 2011 .45 by a local gunsmith in Eagle configuration.

I shoot mostly IDPA and have no need or interest in .40.

The 2011 is a great shooter but has been a constant aggravation over magazines. I have seven, no three alike; three pairs and an oddball. Rather than try to get them exchanged on warranty or pay to have them "tuned," I tinkered with loads until I arrived at something they would all handle. Not feasible if you are buying your ammo.

The PM&P just works.

Whats the issue with mags?

[Forgetful]

2011 mags can be interesting...

But if you know what to do with them or send them to someone that does they're good.

Feed lips to proper dimensions, load rounds to OAL of 1.18-1.22 if at all possible, make sure front to backa/side to side dimensions are within spec with a vice, extractor beveled if needed, followers (Grams in particular) trimmed so they don't prematurely lock back.

[2MoreChains]

My experience with 9mm and .40SW STI 2011 mags has been pretty good reliability when I kept them in stock configuration. Issues seem to pop up when trying to maximize capacity.

Shooting IDPA or L-10 I just use stock mags since capacity is restricted to 10 rnds. For Limited and 3-gun I've had to change out followers and basepads to get max capacity, but had to do some tweaking (mainly with the followers) to get them 100%. Plus you have to make sure your extended mags fit the gauge.

[CocoBolo]

First lets clear the air on USPSA. The fastest Limited Gun in Texas shoots an Eagle, GM David Wears. So, the Eagle in 40 is an extremely competent gun in good hands. Another Limited GM i shoot with also shoots the Eagle and prefers it to the heavier Edge the defacto most common Limited Gun, he currently shoots Open, aging eyes. So yes Eagle rocks for a limited gun. I prefer the heavier Edge. YMMV

IDPA, I don't shoot it much but every time I do, they bitch about my gun, even my USPSA legal 45 single stack, its been to the box and scales several times, legal, then I proceed to piss them off by shooting all head shots. Its a tack driver. Ok enough COCO humor. With the low round count in IDPA stages I just don't seen much advantage in downloading to minor, and there isn't enough cost savings to make any difference in cost. Shoot major forget about minor.

Just start with a good load that will give you recoil similar to a 9 mm with 40. Stick to the heavy bullets 185gr Precision is my favorite or the 180gr Bayou, with 4.7gr WST or 4.5gr N320 at @ 1.185 OAL. Jacketed bullets take 5.0gr or more to get to major, and the recoil can be a bit snappy.

STI Mags - In 40 I bought 4 over the counter mags, put "DAWSON" followers in them and they have run for 5 years with no tuning or modification. They don't hold as many rounds as the Grams or Bolens followers but they are 100% reliable, which is way more important than an extra round. I have 8 mags for my open guns, 9 major the hardest to make run, all are just plain stock mags with either stock guts 140's or Grams followers in the 170 mm big sticks, these run 100%. I would have more confidence in this tuning if they did it with the gun, how can a mag be assured to work if you have not tried it in the gun? Want to make the gun choke load up some short ammo @1.140 or shorter.

New STI Gun: You got about a 50/50 chance it will run out of the box, if you order it from Dawson, for an extra cost you can get him to "run test it" he has a range in the shop, it will need a trigger job anyway and you will want the fiber optic sitght etc. I bought all my STI's used, except one I had built, they all run 100%. Dave Dawson is good people so is Bob Londrigen at Brazos.

Reloading - In 2008 I was shooting 40 all the time, a box of 180gr 40 was $7.57 I didn't reload, shooting 2,000 rounds a month cost $300, today it would cost $800 to $1000, and that would have me sitting at home knitting. Even with todays component costs I can reload 2000 40's for $400. I load a lot of .223 and shoot them, my .25 a round compared to $1.50 a round is way cheaper, and my reload with 69gr SMK's a way better. The cost of the equipment is a wash, if you get a Dillon press reload for 10 years and sell it you will get almost all of your money back, so it was basically free. I started reloading with $1,000 best money I spent in the sport.

[40S&W]

Buy an Eagle 40 bull for USPSA and have a 9mm bushing top end built for it for IDPA. The only thing you do is change the top ends and mags (about 2 minutes). Now you have the right gun for USPSA & IDPA.

[v1911]

Buy an Eagle 40 bull for USPSA and have a 9mm bushing top end built for it for IDPA. The only thing you do is change the top ends and mags (about 2 minutes). Now you have the right gun for USPSA & IDPA.

Different ejector, no?

[IHAVEGAS]

Hmm, with the new IDPA rules an Edge or equivalent can be shot in the 'non-competition class' in level 1 matches. Makes it tempting to buy an uber kewl USPSA gun & just live with being 'non-competition' at your local IDPA matches, will be interesting to see if the non class becomes the most popular class as time goes by.

[mjohn]

Hmm, with the new IDPA rules an Edge or equivalent can be shot in the 'non-competition class' in level 1 matches. Makes it tempting to buy an uber kewl USPSA gun & just live with being 'non-competition' at your local IDPA matches, will be interesting to see if the non class becomes the most popular class as time goes by.

Where did you read this? I did not find a mention of a "non-competitive class" in the 2013 rule book under 8.2.

[v1911]

Hmm, with the new IDPA rules an Edge or equivalent can be shot in the 'non-competition class' in level 1 matches. Makes it tempting to buy an uber kewl USPSA gun & just live with being 'non-competition' at your local IDPA matches, will be interesting to see if the non class becomes the most popular class as time goes by.

Where did you read this? I did not find a mention of a "non-competitive class" in the 2013 rule book under 8.2.

8.2.7. Not For Competition

8.2.7.1. IDPA encourages shooters to practice their gun handling skills with commonly carried firearms.

Many everyday carry firearms do not fit into the 5 competition divisions.

8.2.7.2. IDPA allows clubs to add a Not for Competition scoring division for Tier 1 matches only. This

allows calibers smaller than 9mm, carry optics, and other pistols which do not fit into the 5 competition

divisions to participate in local club matches.

8.2.7.3. All other IDPA equipment rules apply for holsters and loading device holders as well as their

placement on the body. Match Directors also have the option to allow junior shooters with .22 rimfire

firearms to begin strings at low ready in lieu of requiring a holster.

8.2.7.4. All IDPA membership rules apply.

8.2.7.5. Clubs are not required to implement this provision, and Match Directors are allowed discretion

with implementation so that match quality remains high.

[mjohn]

^^^^^^^^

Thanks!!!!!

My speed reading skills have let me down. I will now pay attention to details and no more speed reading.

[3djedi]

Buy an Eagle 40 bull for USPSA and have a 9mm bushing top end built for it for IDPA. The only thing you do is change the top ends and mags (about 2 minutes). Now you have the right gun for USPSA & IDPA.

That's an interesting thought. I was thinking about staying in production for awhile longer. What about getting a 9mm bushing barrel for idpa and production and later on getting the 40 bull for limited. What do you think it would cost getting a new top end?

Edited August 11, 2013 by 3djedi