ULASC

[motosapiens]

guy shoots a stage, at ULASC does the flip and starts to holster

So, wait a minute, did he pull the trigger in between the flip and starting to holster? I'm interested in the 'show clear' part, but pulling the trigger on an empty chamber is what counts imho. If he did that and nothing went bang, I'd be satisfied. If he didn't pull the trigger on an empty chamber, he's not done yet.

See post #4, above, for a convenient look at the 2 rules that apply here. (you are only addressing 1 of them)

Yeah sure, but in real life (meow) we all know that alot of shooters ULASC pretty quickly and then pull the trigger so the RO knows the gun is empty and many RO's don't always see into the empty chamber every single time, but I'm pretty sure they do all observe the hammer falling without going bang. Certainly if the RO feels he didn't get a good enough look, the competitor is obligated to show clear again if requested.

My only point was that in the original post, the hammer down part was never mentioned, it almost made it sound like the competitor just showed clear and went to holster, which would be as crazy as refusing to let the RO see the empty chamber. I was trying to understand what actually happened.

[JKSNIPER]

I see no valid reason for a shooter to object to an R.O. wanting to verify that the weapon is safe before allowing a competitor to waltz off.

Not judging but it seems, from the information presented, that this individual was looking to provoke the R.O. for some reason. Kind of the chip on the shoulder stuff where the guy walks around daring people to knock it off.

Funny thing is this guy, according to the rules quoted, was flat out wrong.

[ac4wordplay]

...

My only point was that in the original post, the hammer down part was never mentioned, it almost made it sound like the competitor just showed clear and went to holster, which would be as crazy as refusing to let the RO see the empty chamber. I was trying to understand what actually happened.

The competitor in question DID hammer down.

[Jammer1911]

Don't care if he hammered down. The rule is, "If you are finished, UNLOAD and SHOW CLEAR" "If clear hammer down, holster...."

Don't allow yourself to get sloppy as an RO just because it is an experienced shooter. MAKE them comply!!! We are as safe a sport as we are because we ENFORCE the rules... Verbatim!

Just my rant as I had this happen at a major match a while ago.

[ac4wordplay]

Don't care if he hammered down. The rule is, "If you are finished, UNLOAD and SHOW CLEAR" "If clear hammer down, holster...."

Don't allow yourself to get sloppy as an RO just because it is an experienced shooter. MAKE them comply!!! We are as safe a sport as we are because we ENFORCE the rules... Verbatim!

Just my rant as I had this happen at a major match a while ago.

I hope it didn't seem that I was defending the competitor (because he did hammer down) - I was simply adding some info to clarify the events.

When I work majors I don't have this problem.

It's a bit harder to "force" compliance at a level 1 match (without a RM designated RO embedded in the squad) when a type A personality (who's held the timer a fair part of the day) refuses and argues the issue. It might be a person we regularly see at local matches and he may be "popular and influential". I think outerlimits acted reasonably when he didn't push the issue any further - it would have escalated. We learn who we prefer not to squad with. Disappointing? Yes.

ac

[Sarge]

To spin this around -- I'm shooting a match, where you're the CRO or RM. I have a problem with your RO. From looking at this, I could form the opinion that appealing the decision is pointless, because once you hear the RO's opinion you won't hear anything else....

Nothing could be further from the truth. I'll side with who is right, whoever that may be. A shooter can take issue with an RO's call but he can't stand there and like a (fill in the blank)and have a debate . We have policies in place for dealing with these issues. You either go to the RM and seek assistance or you obey the reasonable commands of the RO, show some respect and move out. This guy did neither and like somebody already said he should have done what the RO told him to do and then made his argument later.

RO's are human and get it wrong sometimes and I will make sure the shooter knows I am on the side of right.

[Ming the Merciless]

So, wait a minute, did he pull the trigger in between the flip and starting to holster? I'm interested in the 'show clear' part, but pulling the trigger on an empty chamber is what counts imho. If he did that and nothing went bang, I'd be satisfied. If he didn't pull the trigger on an empty chamber, he's not done yet.

Yeah sure, but in real life (meow) we all know that alot of shooters ULASC pretty quickly and then pull the trigger so the RO knows the gun is empty and many RO's don't always see into the empty chamber every single time, but I'm pretty sure they do all observe the hammer falling without going bang. Certainly if the RO feels he didn't get a good enough look, the competitor is obligated to show clear again if requested.

My only point was that in the original post, the hammer down part was never mentioned, it almost made it sound like the competitor just showed clear and went to holster, which would be as crazy as refusing to let the RO see the empty chamber. I was trying to understand what actually happened.

If you're depending only on seeing the hammer drop to verify the gun is empty and not visually inspecting the chamber, then all it takes is one high primer and somebody is walking around with a loaded gun.

Edited March 28, 2013 by Ming the Merciless