38supPat Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Ok, been having an issue with the new top end. The first hand cycled round hits high left. It always hits high left. The rest of the mag will go into a proper group at point of aim, but the first always goes to the same spot. I've tried loading by locking the slide back, using the racker, or not using the racker. If I load one shoot two out of the mag and unload and then load one and shoot two out of te mag I will get two distinct groups, both fairly tight but with the first round always high left and the second at point of aim. A ten shot group (freestyle) looks like this. Any suggestions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Bear Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Have you tried to see what happens if you hand rack several rounds? Example would be fresh magazine, load and shoot #1, eject #2, shoot #3, eject #4, shoot #5, eject #6...... Do not really have an idea why it is going high left on the first round, but if all hand loaded rounds go high left even if a round is ejected it will say something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Try this: Lock the slide back, put in a 1-round charging mag, drop the slide. Pop out empty mag, slam in full mag, DON'T chamber-check, and shoot a group. Compare to your hand-cycled group. On several of my guns that shrunk the flyer size by half. I've also had gunsmiths tell me to change the barrel link size. Sometimes helped, usually didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted June 30, 2012 Author Share Posted June 30, 2012 Have you tried to see what happens if you hand rack several rounds? Example would be fresh magazine, load and shoot #1, eject #2, shoot #3, eject #4, shoot #5, eject #6...... Do not really have an idea why it is going high left on the first round, but if all hand loaded rounds go high left even if a round is ejected it will say something. Yeah tried that an get two distinct groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted June 30, 2012 Author Share Posted June 30, 2012 Try this: Lock the slide back, put in a 1-round charging mag, drop the slide. Pop out empty mag, slam in full mag, DON'T chamber-check, and shoot a group. Compare to your hand-cycled group. On several of my guns that shrunk the flyer size by half. I've also had gunsmiths tell me to change the barrel link size. Sometimes helped, usually didn't. Tried that too, tried using the slide lock to drop, tried chamber checking and not chamber checking, everytime get two district groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Bear Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Have you tried to see what happens if you hand rack several rounds? Example would be fresh magazine, load and shoot #1, eject #2, shoot #3, eject #4, shoot #5, eject #6...... Do not really have an idea why it is going high left on the first round, but if all hand loaded rounds go high left even if a round is ejected it will say something. Yeah tried that an get two distinct groups. So if you load a round, then insert a fresh magazine and eject the first round so that the fresh magazine is providing the first fired round everything goes COM? It is only rounds chambered without ejecting a case that go high left? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OperationHitFactor Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Hey Pat, I'm just taking a shot in the dark. Check the slide stop and make sure it is not catching or dragging the slide. What might be happening is on the hand cycled rounds the slide stop is not fully seated putting uneven pressure along the slide stop. Once a shot is fired it locks the slide stop into a different position from the jolt of the gun being fired. I'm going out on a limb, but maybe the slide stop has something to do with it. Try pulling down on the slide stop and wiggling it around a bit with the first round chambered. Then fire a few rounds and wiggle it around again, check the tension and feel if seems to be in the same position as the hand cycled rounds. If that doesn't work, then you should donate it to the operationhitfactor foundation and buy yourself a new gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie j Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 I with OHF on the slide stop thing, but my thinking is an over sized stop would seat the barrel higher in the upper lugs when the gun is running as opposed to hand cycled . If it were me I'd try a few different stops and see if one a couple thou smaller makes a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Seems to me that the barrel needs to be refit. Whatever gyrations you may have to go through to eliminate the flyer/s, it shouldn't be doing that in the first place. At least, that's how it looks to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlockWise Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 I used to find that I don't shoot accurately on my 1st shot but better on my follow-ups. We all know that if you release a trigger slowly and stop when you hear/feel the reset, it's a lot easier to break off the next shot without jolting your hand. Have you already considered this? Did you try resting your finger on the trigger before you release the slide so you get the same feel on every shot? I don't want to offend you, I'm not saying your a lousy shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Bear Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 (edited) That's your problem Pat, you made Master and forgot how to shoot. :roflol: I think it would not matter how quickly Pat shot and reset, he has demonstrated his ability to shoot. Edited July 4, 2012 by Poppa Bear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 Lol, thanks Poppa bear! I'll try to post some groups this weekend if I get a chance. I'm running a level I match so it might be tough to squeeze some groups in. Fwiw I just posted that one group but I can shoot groups all day and everyone will look like that (that one was shot @ 25m freestyle) actually if I can I'll mount a camera to catch the shots and see what I mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Elliott Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 (edited) Pat, I know we talked about this on the weekend but I had my head up my *ss so I wasn't thinking clearly. I'm in agreement with post #9. The barrel isn't locking up consistently so whether it's the slide stop, standing lugs, barrel link or a combination of any or all three of those components, it isn't fitted correctly and should be redone. I doubt you will be able to fix this by just swapping links. Edited July 11, 2012 by R.Elliott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 Me too.... I guess I should have also mentioned that this is the original barrel and the slide is new because the previous one cracked, I'm starting to think there might have been a fit issue with the first slide and either uneven wear or something has caused this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Bear Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 That can make a big difference. Most barrels are fit to the slide instead of the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted July 15, 2012 Author Share Posted July 15, 2012 Yeah, I might order a new barrel.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Pull a slide stop from another gun and try it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CocoBolo Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 If it was an open gun I'd say the reverse plug is hitting the comp, causing a different lockup point when hand cycled versus shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoshidaex Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Pat, PM Enos member GM iprod about this issue. I read a post of his a while back regarding this same issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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