MAKE READY Posted August 14, 2011 Share Posted August 14, 2011 I need to develop more skill shooting practice groups at 25 yards and beyond. My question becomes could I do this with a rimfire or should I just practice shooting groups with my competition gun? I anyone has any advise I would sure like to here it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MustangGreg66 Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 If you do use your rimfire pistol for groups make sure it's an accurate pistol and you're using accurate ammo. I'd suggest match ammo (match pistol). Then you'll know any fliers in the group were made by you and not the ammo/pistol. What are you trying to accomplish with this group shooting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jar Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 Get an accurate rimfire and shoot some bullseye matches. I shoot in a 50 foot 22 rimfire bullseye league in the winter, and I think it's very valuable cross-training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 I need to develop more skill shooting practice groups at 25 yards and beyond. My question becomes could I do this with a rimfire or should I just practice shooting groups with my competition gun? I anyone has any advise I would sure like to here it. If your goal is to improve your group shooting with your competition gun, then I'd recommend practicing group shooting with your competition gun. Get an accurate rimfire and shoot some bullseye matches. I shoot in a 50 foot 22 rimfire bullseye league in the winter, and I think it's very valuable cross-training. I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAKE READY Posted August 15, 2011 Author Share Posted August 15, 2011 I need to develop more skill shooting practice groups at 25 yards and beyond. My question becomes could I do this with a rimfire or should I just practice shooting groups with my competition gun? I anyone has any advise I would sure like to here it. If your goal is to improve your group shooting with your competition gun, then I'd recommend practicing group shooting with your competition gun. Get an accurate rimfire and shoot some bullseye matches. I shoot in a 50 foot 22 rimfire bullseye league in the winter, and I think it's very valuable cross-training. I agree. I want to improve on my accuracy past 25 yards. I am not sure what type of drills to do. I thought that shooting a rimfire might help. If you guys have some 30 yard drills that you do please share them. Thanks for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 I want to improve on my accuracy past 25 yards. I am not sure what type of drills to do. I thought that shooting a rimfire might help. If you guys have some 30 yard drills that you do please share them. Thanks for the help. For many years I started and ended every practice with some slow fire group shooting drills. At 30 yards, shoot a 5-shot, slow fire group, with the goal being to take all the time you need to shoot the smallest group possible. Repeat that about 10 times every time you go to the range. And keep your smallest group, which will motivate you to shoot an even smaller one. be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEricksen Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I'm somewhat taken back by the response to the original posters question in this thread. Learning firearm control by shooting groups has very little to do with ammo selection, caliber, firearm choice, accuracy of any particular firearm or distance. It's my personal opinion that the single best training tool a person can own for practical pistol, speed steel, or defensive firearms training is a .22 rimfire pistol. The pistol does not have to be accurate, reliable, or of any particular configuration. Group size does not matter......... Group consistency for any given pistol matters. It doesn't matter if the pistol is capable of sub moa, or an inch at 10 yards. Shoot until you learn what the pistol is capable of, and then practice shooting groups. Trigger control, grip, sight picture, breathing, stance........... repetition is what is important. Practicing good fundamental skills over and over again is what matters. Distance does not matter. If a person has to shoot everything at 10 yards, so be it. If a person only has 50 yards, again the fundamentals are all the same with group size improvement as the target. Even when I was shooting 5-6,000 rounds of 45acp per month, I was still shooting 10,000 rounds or so of .22 rimfire through an all stock Ruger Mkii 5" bull barrel pistol. There was no way to shoot more 45 when work, time, and money were factored. .22 is cheap, no brass cleaning, reloading, and the cost cannot be beat. My opinion: Buy a .22, buy cases of Federal bulk ammo from Wal-Mart (375 packs are actually cheaper than the 550 packs), and shoot as much as possible. Shoot fast, shoot slow, work on breathing, trigger control, grip, sight tracking, etc. A .22 will improve your skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEricksen Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) Just another note: I regularly shoot hundreds of rounds off hand with my MKIII 22/45 5.5" Hunter with a C-More/8moa dot at 50-60 yards on 8" and 10" plates. .22's work great at 25+ yards. A20650 Edited August 17, 2011 by TEricksen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Texas Granny Posted October 1, 2011 Share Posted October 1, 2011 Aim small. Miss small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardo Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 I got a .22 slide for my 9mm competition gun (CZ Shadow). So the grip and trigger feel are the same. I start my drills with 200 rounds of .22s. Gives me a good warm-up, and goes easy on my ageing elbows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe L Posted October 29, 2011 Share Posted October 29, 2011 I have a 22 conversion for my SIG P226. Works great and is very accurate. I go to one range where I can shoot the gun at 50 yards from a rest at plates. At first, I couldn't get all the shots on the plate, now I can. Turns out my improvement in trigger control has carried over to the 9mm P226s and my 1911. I have about 3000 rounds through the 22 now, and will put another 200 itty bitty holes in paper this morning...before getting out the 9. Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grapemeister Posted October 30, 2011 Share Posted October 30, 2011 I agree that the fundamental are the same no matter what kind of gun you shoot. But, since you compete, then you should be training with the gun you use in the competition. Again the fundamentals are the same, but your larger caliber competition gun reacts quite differently than a .22, and your body, and mind may react quite differently to a larger caliber gun. If you don’t have a clear understanding of the basics, then search this forum. There is tons of info that will help you improve your accuracy. Do you have a clear understanding of proper sight alignment, sight focus, seeing the front blade lift out of the notch, follow thru, calling your shots, etc. Some of us think we understand the basics, but have you really studied the basic concepts and put them into practice when shooting? I do lots of group shooting, but I also like to do drills that mimic what I do in practical shooting competition. I do simple things like drawing and firing two shots on a 25 yard target, and then running to a second box, and firing tow shots on a 2nd target set at 25 yards. This gives me the opportunity to work on entering, and exiting a shooting position, sight acquisition under pressure, etc. It’s also great exercise if you run back and forth several times without taking a break. Sometimes I only set the shooting boxes, and targets two yards apart, but sometimes I’ll set them 10 yards apart to get in good workout, and add a little stress to the shooting. I may never be able to get two good A zone hits on a target at 25 yards while shooting on the move, or while leaning, and getting ready to move out of a shooting position, but I still practice it. Who knows maybe one day I’ll be able to do it consistently, but I certainly won’t ever be able to do it if I don’t at least practice it. My thoughts on shooting for today. Thanks Brian for the opportunity to get these thoughts out. For the most part, all of this writing is for my benefit, and I really don’t care if anybody reads it. If it does help somebody, then it’s icing on the cake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted October 30, 2011 Share Posted October 30, 2011 Think of it as dryfiring with a tangible result... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 I do lots of group shooting, but I also like to do drills that mimic what I do in practical shooting competition. I do simple things like drawing and firing two shots on a 25 yard target, and then running to a second box, and firing tow shots on a 2nd target set at 25 yards. This gives me the opportunity to work on entering, and exiting a shooting position, sight acquisition under pressure, etc. It’s also great exercise if you run back and forth several times without taking a break. Sometimes I only set the shooting boxes, and targets two yards apart, but sometimes I’ll set them 10 yards apart to get in good workout, and add a little stress to the shooting. I did LOTS of those sorts of simple drills, over many years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LPatterson Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 I know I am different than most people because I was told many times during my military career that I was not a team player (whatever that means). I enjoy going to the range to shoot the rimfire with no thought other than to see how small a group I can shoot. The other advantage is that I am not worried about having to pick up the brass after shooting 300-400 rounds. When I practice with my match guns I am worried about draw speed, followup shots, transitions, moving box to box and then recording everything. The other day I spent 120 rounds just working on reaction time and keep all the shots on a 6" plate at 25 yards. Never got below .2 but then at my age I probably can't, this is not something I would have tried throwing a nickel downrange with every trigger pull. What's more fun is trying to keep them in a 10" plate with the MKII 6" Competition with a comp and a scope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dravz Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Think of it as dryfiring with a tangible result... Pretty much. And almost as cheap too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoubleA Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Right now I am focusing on my accuracy and have noticed another reason to make sure and shoot groups with your competition gun and power factor. I cannot group worth a crap with my G35 at major pf, but if I run minor pf then everything is as it should be. I can group great with a .22 as well, but as soon as I pick up the full power glock then it all goes to heck. It is a physiological block that I can not seem to get past. The anticipation of recoil along with the extreme desire to make the grade with my weapon just seems to screw all the other fundamentals out of the picture when it is time to fire. The frustration in trying to beat a mental block is unreal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe L Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 What I have observed is that I can't easily make the transition to good groups with the 9 after 100 rounds or so of tight groups with the 22. So now I tend to shoot the 22 one day and the 9's the next. This works great for me and the 22 training definitely has helped my accuracy with the 9, especially at 25-30 yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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