Draw/Split/Transition/Reload Times

[kdj]

Having had the luxury of an uninterrupted hour of practice at the range today, with no one else near by, I finally managed to get some times for the various components of my shooting. So, now I can appeal to the collective wisdom of this august group to tell me where I most need to focus my attention for the next little while

Shooting about 150 rounds, times came out as:

Draw: Average around 1.2 with a spread of 1.0 to 1.35 (except for the one dodo 1.57 where I just didn't get a good grip and fiddled for way too long )

Splits at 10 yds: Average around .23 with a spread from .20 through .25

Transitions at 10 yds with targets about 1' apart (I was range limted): Average around .3 with a spread from .27 to .4

Reloads: Averaged 1.5 with a worse case 1.8. I bobbled every single reload. At the end I realized why. In dry practice, I used weighted safety mags; in matches, I use full mags; today I was reloading with 2 or 3 rounds in the mag and they felt very different! Note to self: Use full mags!

Most of the above were A hits. Some wondered into the Cs and there were 2 "why did I pull the trigger when I could see what was going to happen" Ds

This is the first time I've ever been able to get this data. I also notice a lot more tension in my live fire than my dry fire (it only took me 10 years to get over this problem with swords so by the end of the decade I should have it ironed out).

I'm a newly minted C class shooter but have asperations to do better, so which aspect of this looks to most need remedial attention? "All of it may be true" but would probably be the least helpful response

Any suggestions would be gratefully appreciated.

Thanks,

Kevin

[ErikW]

Eh, another poll without the right option? OK, I'll order from the menu: transitions. All the times are very good for C class (Open?). But with only 1' spacing between targets, the trans. could be a little closer to the splits. Next time, use more spacing and mix up the spacing in an array. Also hang targets upside-down, diagonal, sideways, and have some hardcoverd and some no-shoot covered. Learn to find the A zone. Don't get in the habit of setting up targets such that you can just move the muzzle sideways and level to the next A zone.

[kdj]

Eh, another poll without the right option?

I'll happily take the right option. Uh ... what should the choice have been? The afore mentioned "All of the above and everything else"?

This set up was a couple of targets side by side on one hanger in an indoor range. And yes, this was Open - hence the shots actually being on the target rather than somewhere near by which is what happens with them there old fashioned guns

I know that, in general, where I really need to practice most is on moving in to and out of shooting positions without waste since I've been watching tape of me shooting a stage and comparing it to people who know what they are doing. Talk about dawdling along!

Anyway, Transitions with emphasis on mismatched targets sounds like an excellent place to play for a while ... and there are even dry fire ways of improving that, right?

Thanks muchly very,

Kevin

[eric nielsen]

Kevin

You need to read Brian's post here:

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...=0entry142261

And everything else he's written about "uncertainty", which you spelled "dawdling".

Just click on Brian's icon & search every post, my advise.

Short answer - transitions. At home, work on mag changes. GMSHTR's post:

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=12106

Phil's a good one to read every post also.

[shred]

Those times sound pretty good for C-class. Getting to the shooting is probably where you're losing time.

GM's don't really shoot faster than B-shooters, they just get to it and get on with it faster.

[Ron Ankeny]

If you do the math, I think you will find those par times, when applied to the majority of classifiers, would see you deep into A class if not Master class. Putting it all together is the problem.

[Rosshooting]

In my opinion there is pretty good times!

[Kingman]

I am C for right now. Will make B at the September update since two clubs did not get the rest of my 60+ ones in.

I now can do sub 1 draws on 10yd targets.

I got my splits down to about .15 or so

Transitions moving about .20 or so now.

Reloads about 1 second when I am concentrating on it. I don't practice them to often since I try to reload while moving most the time.

[Ron Ankeny]

Take Bob's par times of:

Sub one second draw at 10 yards

Splits of .15

Breaks (transitions) of .20

Reloads of one second

I personally don't have reliable par times in those ranges (I am slower), but I believe Bob when he says those are realistic times (in practice I assume) for where he is currently at in his skill development. If you apply those times to most classifiers the hit factors will come out over 100 per cent, but the math just never works out.

Sure it's important to get speedy in all areas of our shooting, but the real job is putting all of the elements together, then closing the gap between those awesome runs we pull off in practice and what we do on demand come game day.

[Matthew_Mink]

If you are shooting Lim10 or Production, then definately the reloads. If Lim or Open, then look at splits and transitions first.

But practice everything.

[Flexmoney]

I bobbled every single reload.

I also notice a lot more tension in my live fire than my dry fire...

I think those two are VERY closely related. Moreso than the weight of the mags.

Tension = bobbled reload.

Let the strong arm/gun be loose. Ensure that you see the mag "pause" as it comes to the insertion point.

Transitions should be nearly the same as splits at that distance and with that little amount of spacing (the nudge the muzzle spacing really isn't super helpful, nor infomative). As Erik said, try to mix it up a little.

I'll also suggest that you are likely following the dot/front sight to the next transition target area, NOT snapping your eyes ahead of the gun. That will prove slower and less accurate. SNAP the eyes ahead of the gun. As soon as you call the shot, snap the eyes to the next target..the gun will follow.

Overall, everything looks pretty strong. As Ron says, if you tied that all together stage after stage, you would be right there with the upper class shooters.

Most of this can be worked on in dry-fire. And, your movement into and out of positions will be vital.

[Kingman]

Yeh, I can't do those in a match. Mind works differently see below.

I have been shooting in excess of 1000 rds per week to get those numbers down to that point.

My last two classifiers running close to those times have been at 80% about.

The main thing is now the mental game. Once you get to those times it becomes all mental. I could make GM quick and be very competitive at those times all the time. But for some reason my mind just does not work at that rate in a match, too many distractions. I keep reading For the Winning mind and it is starting to help. Running a program everytime changes your focus and allows you to do better.

I have noticed the stages I run the program I do very well at. Those that I forget to or get precocupied with something else I blow. So its not only a matter of getting a mental program that works for you, but running it every time. Repitition is key.