Jump to content
Brian Enos's Forums... Maku mozo!

DQ for removing gun belt with gun in holster


Skydiver

Recommended Posts

DQ under 5.2.1. NROI has already ruled on this. See NROI uling.

Exactly so. :cheers:

NROI Rulings

Title: Removing holster and/or holster from person while handgun still in the holster.

Created: 12/02/08

Updated: 12/09/08

Effective: 12/09/08

Rule number: 5.2.1

Applies to: Pistol

Ruling authority: John Amidon

Status: Released

Question

After I have been unloaded and shown clear on the line by an RO, can I go back to my bag and remove my holster and/or blet with the holster attached while the handgun is still in the holster

Ruling

A competitor who, while not at a safety area or under RO supervision, removes his/her holster or his/her equipment belt with his/her handgun still in the holster, shall be considered to be in violation of Rule 5.2.1 and subject to disqualification from the match. Safety areas are provided for doing this while not under the supervision of a RO.

Troy

Edited by mactiger
Link to comment
Share on other sites

LOL!

I remember the story of the dropped gun in the porta-potty as recounted by the instructor for my RO class. I'm having a great chuckle again remembering that. :-) I'm dreading being the RO who has to fish the gun out and make sure it's clear. :-(

Thanks guys for the clarification of the rules as well as for the laughs! As always, there is a great store of knowledge in this forum.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just read through this, and got quite a chuckle. What about removing the rig in the safety area without touching the magazines? At our range, I would feel safe enough to ask a friend to ogle it while I run quickly to take care of business.

This invariable becomes an issue at stage 2. I just put my mags in their pocket of my range bag,take my bag to the safety area, drop the gun in it, put my outer belt through the handles, and leave them on the ground near the safety area. I was just asking about the magazines for clarification's sake.

JZ

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Go in the pisser, take off your belt, piss, put it back on. Being doing this for 20 yrs.

Thats why they have a lock on the Porta-jon. I do suggest removing the belt though. There was one competitor who "dropped" their gun in the porta-jon. I believe it was as single stack gun also. I can remember going out to dinner after a match with them and hearing the story. It might have been after the Honda Spree story :ph34r:

Flyin

Link to comment
Share on other sites

a guy dropped his gun in one of those PORTALETS a couple of years ago at the FL Open

he got a brand new bluing job on his pistol....(probably brown as well) :roflol:

i would hate to be the RO to pick that up from one of those :ph34r:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Go in the pisser, take off your belt, piss, put it back on. Being doing this for 20 yrs.

Yep, and maybe get DQ'd like the guy at DTC a year or two ago :lol:

It was last year. The guy left the gun in the john when he was done.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

most everyone carries their range bag around right? why not take the little padded case that comes with most bags to the safe area, unholster and put in that little padded bag. carry that to do your business, come back to the safe area and re-holster. probelmo....solved!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I had one of those moments once at a match, I was working hard pasting targets and setting steel just waiting my turn to shoot, when suddenly without warning, :sick: I had to go and go right now!! The outhouse at this range was not close to the shooting bays, so I waddled all the way to the outhouse, writhing in pain, I opened the door and to my horror! :o NO TOILET PAPER!! To make a long story short the last thing on my mind was whether or not I was going to get DQed. :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Let's say I have go to use the restroom. Can I be DQ'd if I remove my gun belt with the gun still in the holster while not in a safety area? Or if I have a paddle holster, can I be DQ'd if I remove the paddle holster and gun as a unit while not at a safety area?

The common answer I hear is "yes", and when I ask by which rule the response is that it is 10.5.1.

As I read 10.5.1:

10.5.1 Handling a firearm at any time except when in a designated safety area or when under the supervision of, and in response to a direct command issued by, a Range Officer.

In the Corrections to USPSA Handgun Competition Rules of January 2008 it says:

Handling (as in “handling a firearm”) The act of manipulating, holding or gripping a firearm while the trigger is functionally accessible.

Since a legal holster prevents access to the trigger and I'm only dealing with my entire gun belt or paddle holster and not manipulating the gun, I don't see how 10.5.1 applies. Even if people argue that at some point I may have to touch the gun while removing the belt or holster, the trigger is still not accessible.

Another response I can think of is "yes", but rule cited is 10.5 in general for unsafe gun handling, instead of the more specific 10.5.1. This is since 10.5 is not an exclusive list, but simply a list of examples. In this case, I refer back to the definition of "handling", and again it looks like I'm not "handling" the firearm by the definition of "handling".

I'm straining hard here to make the answer be "yes", but it looks more and more like the answer is "no". Can anybody with a lot more RO training/experience guide me into the correct way of thinking here?

Anyway, to avoid the issue entirely, I always go to the safety area first to case my gun if ever I need to take my belt off.

Guys, its a simple case of priorities. If nature dictates speed to the facility and bagging would be a problem you can either fill your pants or do what you have to do and risk the DQ. Myself, I would risk the DQ

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm glad I read this. I've been a naughty monkey while seated at the tailgate of my SUV, while putting my outer belt w/ holstered gun on and taking it off there at the end of match.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Go in the pisser, take off your belt, piss, put it back on. Being doing this for 20 yrs.

Yep, and maybe get DQ'd like the guy at DTC a year or two ago :lol:

It was last year. The guy left the gun in the john when he was done.

So, why was he DQ'd?

Troy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'll admit that I'm the guy that did this and that the OP refers too. :)

This was one of those painful learning lessons and I hope others learn from it. It's one of the odder ways I've ever heard of someone getting DQ'd. My brainfart, 5.2.1 is pretty clear. I have no problem with it at all. I simply misunderstood the rule. I've seen this done before and I have done it before and no one ever said anything about it. After I was DQ'd another shooter mentioned to me that he had done this before as well thinking that so long as the gun was locked in a holster, you were good to er...go ;) For the record, not that it matters, it was locked in a Limcat holster. So, let this all be a lesson to everyone and spread the word. I think this would make a great Front Sight rules topic just to spread the word that this is a no-no B)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...