Brian Payne

Splash, Doing a search would give you a better explanation. The gun weights and cycles the same as a 5", you can use lower power ammo. to still make major due to the 6" barrel, a little more weight out front (balance), and from personal experiance I find the longer slide weapons to point better for me. Probably a purely psychological finding though. Oh yeah, it is built by Benny Hill, what more can you ask for. Like I say, there are a lot of threads out there that explain it a lot better than I can.

Precision40, Now THAT is what I am looking for. I really like your first one with Hardchrome. What type of holster are you using? I hadn't thought that the 6" might be a problem for holster fitting. I am using a CZ STD IPSC in a CR Speed holster now. Would that holster adjust to fit this gun? or should I be planning to purchase something else? jessej, Thanks for the idea to look in the "Gallery". I didn't even know that was there.

I am looking into having Benny Hill build this weapon for me. I have seen the photo of the weapon on the web site but would like to see some others. Does anyone have a photo of their weapon they would be willing to post for me? Thanks in advance.

Bear, If you do a search for HK Fabarm you should have a thread "photo's of 3-gun weapons" or something like that. Thread started by me. First picture would have that shotgun on it. Poor picture, but gives you an idea. Great shotgun for HM in my opinion. I am still looking for screw on chokes for this weapon. Does CDNN have them for sale?

To get more information check the web site www.trigunchallenge.com. There seemed to be some dissatisfied shooters last year so there may be some openings. I think every shooter walked away with more in door prizes than they spent in entry fees. It was my first 3-gun competition and everyone was friendly, helpful, and seemed to be having a very good time. I liked the fact that there is not a 'super squad". Al the big dogs are on squads with the normal shooters. I shot with Bennie Cooley and Todd Salmon. Both were very helpful and went out of there way to "educate" this new shooter.

If you are using a right handed shotgun, I envy you. I shoot right handed and reload the same way you do, only backward. I really wish I had a left handed shotgun so the ejection port would be right in front of my face when reloading. Makes for a much faster bolt locked open reload, and for malfunction clearing. I would want to keep my right handed safety though. A quick question for the experts. In the Remington 1100's does the left handed model also have a left handed safety?

Entry fee check put in the mail today. Shot this last year, great people, great time, great prizes. Can't wait.

You may have watched more Heavy Metal shooters compete at the Nationals this year if there would have been a little more advanced warning. When I first called to sign up I was informed there would be no Heavy Metal. I purchased new weapons to use in the Standard (Limited) Division and was ready to go. I later learned that there would be a Heavy Metal Division. Oh well. Next year it is Heavy Metal for me. I must admit though that I really had a blast shooting semi-auto shotgun (never done that before) and using the CR speed holster with a CZ Standard IPSC. I can't say it was more fun, but it was different enough for me to really enjoy myself. I am 46 yrs. old and will soon need stronger glasses, but I still want iron sights on my .308. But I will happily go with whatever the rules allow.

Tewlman, I have the same shotgun only with a pistol grip stock (I load weak hand and like the pistol grip better). I put on a Choate mag extension, it isn't listed on the web site but a call to them will get you one. I like this shotgun because it unlocks the bolt like the Winchester 1300. The Mossberg and 870 can "lock up" due to pilot error when firing fast. The Fabarm and 1300 will unlock the bolt even if you are pulling on the forearm when the trigger is pulled.

Used DPMS 20" with American Eagle 55 grn FMJ, and iron sights. The three long targets on the right took me four shots. The three targets on the left took almost 15 rounds. The only thing I noticed is that I had a lot of dust get kicked up by the comp. Much more so shooting at the left targets than shooting from the first port. Loved that stage though. I've never shot at anything that far away with irons or scope.

Hot holstering the weapon is not a big deal - until you add the time constraints of a match enviornment. By that I mean to LAMR is not timed, so not that dangerous. The matches requiring you to reholster and then transition to another weapon are no big deal if the course of fire lasts more than a short amount of time. When you have a course of fire that has a total competitive time of 30 seconds or less (just random time made up by me), you are asking for problems if there is the holstering of a hot weapon within that time constraint. Everyone will be doing anything to get that extra .10 of a second advantage. The time taken to throttle back to holster safely may not be taken. You would soon be seeing shooters trying to holster as quickly as they are drawing. I have been an LEO and Police Firearms Instructor for 26 yrs. I have never had a training accident on the range and we do hot holstering and weapon transitions all the time but the time constraints are not near that of what you experiance at a match. But on the same token we have a large department not far from me that has had 13 AD's since 1990, and those have taken place when the Officers were in the process of holstering their Glock. Nothing wrong with the weapon, or the holster, or the training the officers received. More a problem of mental concentration of the Officer based on the situation they were in. The best example I can make is seeing the number of traffic accidents caused by people driving and talking on Cell phones. Diverted concentration affects all humans. I just don't think people should drive AND talk on the cell phone. Nor should they be holstering hot weapons under time constraints IF AT ALL POSSIBLE! It can be done by all level of shooters. The chances of an AD just go up to a certain extent. I would not be willing to put our competition shooting safety record in possible jeapordy just for a little extra leeway in course of fire options. Would it make some courses of fire more enjoyable and tactically correct? You bet. Would it be worth the risk? My opinion it would not. YMMV

I shot that same stage. Prior to shooting the stage I asked the RO if it was legal to "re-engage" a busted clay target or re-engage a downed steel to avoid having to dumping a round down range or hand unloading an unfired round. He told me to shoot one of the previously engaged targets. I wound up loading four slugs into the tube on the fly, then loaded the proper number of shot shells behind the slugs. Then made sure I didn't miss with the shot shells. Just transitioned to the paper targets and engaged with the slugs. No need to worry about having an extra shot shell in the weapon when I moved to the paper targets. I loved that stage!

Zak Smith Point taken. I also agree that this topic is not a "bash the USPSA 3-gun" topic. This is just a group of people sharing ideas to try to help the world of 3-gun become better and stronger. I think we all have the best interests at heart. I also do not get the feeling that "the big dawgs" are out to change anything to meet their needs only. I for one am a very inexperianced 3-gun competitor. At the DPMS Tri-gun and the USPSA Nationals I received help and advice from countless "Big Dawgs". They did so without any sort of attitude. This type of behavior is what will keep new shooters coming back and allow 3-gunning to grow.

BDH I really enjoyed stages #1, #6, and #11. Mainly because of the slug shooting. Stage #6 was really enjoyable because it let you know how well you can control a shotgun in full recoil. If I remember right there was 17 slugs shot on that stage. Awesome. Federal Power Ball Slugs - yeah baby!!

When drawing your weapon, even under stress, there is no chance of having your finger on the trigger as the weapon is grabbed. Holstering on the other hand, could easily leave your finger on the trigger while trying to reholster. No further picture needs to be drawn. Shooting on the move can be dangerous, that is why we have the 180 rule. There are rules in place to punish people for unsafe gunhandling with your finger on the trigger, holstering is one of the few times a RO won't have enough time to step in and stop you before someone possibly gets hurt. If the P in USPSA would stand for real life practical situations - then when I am faced with several rooms containing 14 hostile targets, I sure as hell am not going to go in alone, even with three small arms. Grenade comes to mind maybe, or air strike, or Tank, or - whatever. In competition we do not deal in practical, real life situations. We deal in situations set up by match directors to challenge our small arms weapons handling skills. The biggest challenge is in coming up with scenarios that are fun, safe for all levels of shooters, and allow us to be able to use weapons commonly found in your closet or purchased for not a large amount of money. The shotgun I used for the Nationals I purchased from the local pawn shop for $200.00 and it came with three barrels. $60.00 in parts and I was good to go. I have to be honest and tell you that I sucked with that shotgun, but it did not fail me, and I had fun. I will be using this same weapon next year. Just some thoughts. YMMV

Hot holstering: Easy to accomplish and extremely safe. Until you add stress and time constraints. I don't care how accomplished of a shooter you are. Add the stress of a match environment + clock running + possible movement + going for another weapon + poor footing = AD and possible injury. Right now non shooters (like people living right next to ranges that have just moved there knowing the range was there but are now sick of the noise) are looking for any reason to shut ranges down. One or two injuries or worse, good luck keeping that range open. I like the idea but I just don't see it as practical.

Same here. Hope to see you at another match soon.

This comment coming from a newbie to the sport so please have patience. I got into three gun because of the fact I was able to "play" with three different weapons at one match. The thought of being "practical" or "tactically correct" never entered my mind because to me this is a game. To say the Shotgun is no longer practical and is an antiquated weapon system is a little closed minded and sort of misses the idea of the "game". Most people don't (can't) have access to sub-guns, and few people want the expense of the precision rifle. Much less having access to ranges that allow you to practice shooting this type of weapon to its ability. I am a full time LEO and in all honesty, after shooting some of these matches I must admit that I am rethinking my thoughts on the shotgun being inferior to the subgun in real life applications. I shoot the Standard (limited) division due to the fact I didn't want the added expense of optics. I understand you can get the Simmons Pro Diamond for around $50.00, but I see a lot of $700.00 + Acogs and such. I have looked through both and have my own opinion as to the advanages of one over the other. Allow some shooters to keep it simple, and as inexpensive as possible. Still able to have fun playing the game. I like the idea of power factors but only because I like to play the game on a level playing field. That is the reason I like the idea of Heavy Metal. 20 round magazines, .308 caliber or larger rifle(no optics because we are old school in this division), 8+1 12 ga. pump shotgun (again - old school), and .45 caliber handguns with magazines of any capacity but only loaded to 8 rounds (don't want the single stack to be at a disadvantage). Keep Heavy Metal a seperate catagory. For the rest of the divisions keep the major/minor type of scoring. Score whatever way is the easiest and quickest. I like the IDPA type of scoring because it is easy and uncomplicated. The more you miss, the more your score goes down the crapper. I shot the DPMS Tri-gun Challenge and the USPSA-Nationals this year. Both were different styles of scoring, and different types of shoots. Had a blast at both. Just because they were different didn't make one better than the other. Just different. Different isn't always a bad thing.

This shoot was awesome. Great stages, Great RO's, Great weather, can't think of a single complaint. I shot on squad 17, and this being my 3rd 3-gun match, learned a lot from every other shooter on the squad. Very helpful group of people. Got to see some awesome shooting displays. Lots of room for improvement in my shooting, but all of my weapons and gear functioned perfectly. Can't wait for next year. Brian Payne

Scraped ice off the windshield of the car this morning so 80 degree weather sounds pretty good right now. Everything is packed and will fly out tomorrow evening. I am hoping the ammo. I shipped will make it to the hotel in time. I also hope the trip through the airport will go ok. First time flying with weapons. I put everything except ammo. in a 4-long gun SKB case and cable locked the unloaded shotgun, rifle, and pistol together on the first layer with the holster, mag pouchs, rifle and pistol magazines, shotgun shell holders, belts. etc.. in the second layer. Guns are unloaded and no ammo. anywhere inside this case or the carry on. Triple checked and will check again before leaving for the airport. Also have an empty hard sided pistol case in my second checked back just in case they make me put the handgun in a seperate case. The long gun case is pretty heavy and I am sure I will have to pay extra for the weight but I am hoping the baggage people can't throw it quite so far this way.

Thanks downO. I am sure I'll be able to find something. Just need birdshot, don't want to ship or carry that much weight. The handgun, rifle, and slugs I can handle. 95 degree weather will take a little getting used to. Just had 33 degrees two nights ago. Shorts and T-shirts I guess.

Tewlman, I am on your squad. Coming down from Minnesota. We have never met but I am guessing you also shot at the DPMS Tri-gun this year. Does anyone know if the Range in Vegas sells ammo.?

Dang - I normally shoot Heavy Metal but when I checked earlier, I was told there would not be a Heavy Metal Division at the Nationals. Now it looks like they will have that Division after all. At least according to www.uspsa-nationals.com. I bought a new .223, Mod. 1100 with appropriate gear, and a CZ 75 IPSC and gear, all for nothing. COOL!!! Now to decide which Division I would rather shoot in. I have been having a ball practicing with the normal Standard Division gear and weapons. I may just stay with that. Even though I may not shoot in the Heavy Metal Division for this shoot, I am glad they added it. Sorry for the new thread but I thought it was a different enough topic to warrant a fresh start.

The warning has apparently been in the rule book for quite some time. I'm lucky. I am new to all of this so if the rule book says power factor is 520, then my ammo. will make 520. I will assume everyone else will play by the same rule.

Rules are made for a reason. To keep people honest and make the playing field level for all competitors. (not meaning to imply anyone is less than honest, just speaking of rules in general). I like the idea of 520 power factor and I will make sure I have ammo. that will qualify. If you want to shoot this competition you have three weeks to find loads of the proper power factor that work in your gun. I bet if they reduced power factors, it wouldn't take three weeks to find a loads that worked, yet still made the lower power factor. Getting three weeks advanced notice is a nice gesture if you ask me.