TDean Posted November 22, 2003 Share Posted November 22, 2003 Good stuff Brian, I honestly don't think about points when I'm shooting (or preparing to shoot). I just assume that I'll get a few Charlies and hopefully no Deltas or Mikes. I rarely remember seeing my sights lately. I haven't remembered a clear, consistent sight picture over the duration of a match since the days just before I made Master. So much for the principle of shooting good points fast if I'm not adhering to the learned skills (visual patience) that guided me initially. I need to start calling my shots (again) on targets in the 5-10yd range. To "shoot good-points as fast as possible", I need to trust my target aquisition speed, have the patience to watch the sights settle in the sweet-spot (twice per target) and most importanly, settle into a comfortable, calm mindset where I apply this principle "without doubt". I feel a little insight creeping in..... Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted November 22, 2003 Share Posted November 22, 2003 Sounds like you might be shooting at brown shapes, not a-zones. Boy have I been there... SA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twix Posted November 23, 2003 Share Posted November 23, 2003 So Steve, would you like to share how you got back from there? i.e. shooting brown shapes instead of A zones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravisT Posted November 24, 2003 Share Posted November 24, 2003 TDean is the shit. Fear the day he makes 'em all worth 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted November 24, 2003 Share Posted November 24, 2003 Twix, Sometimes I'm still there. The only way I know to get back is to let vision break the shot. SA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDean Posted November 24, 2003 Share Posted November 24, 2003 Hey TT, I just glad I was fortunate enough to be introduced to this game in an area that YOU were living in (at the time ) Watching you shoot was/is inspiring! Good job at Area2 by the way. What made you decide to shoot Lim-10? ....and why do you insert, remove and reinsert you mag on the load'n make ready? What are you checking for? Take Care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3quartertime Posted November 24, 2003 Share Posted November 24, 2003 This is a really,,, really great thread. I think many of us have the most problem with shot patience. I know my personal speed is faster than my shot patience. Waiting to call the shot seems to be the great obstacle to overcome. My question is,,, Some shooters seem to 'get' this fairly easily, ie,,, the shooters that go really far very quickly. And some shooters ( Like me ) seem to struggle with the concept. Is the ability to 'get' shot patience learned or intuitive? Or both? On the forum TGO's avatar text is " looks at target", I guess BE did that. Is Rob one of those types that just ' got ' shot patience from the start? It's been said that he has an increadible index. Could he be that good with just an extrordinary index skill? Probably not. Steve A. once posted that in dry fire make sure to not just point. Make sure you see the shot. I've been really working on this lately. I like the idea of seeing the shot in dry fire, but the patience during a match is another issue. The study of just that one point seems to be overbearing and I would say that most either quit the sport or stagnat in it because they just can't wait for the shot. I know that speed and accuracy are supposed to be equals but speed comes too easy. I know an M/GM that mikes fairly often but can make up for it with tremendous speed. ( local matches of course ) He also hates this site, I think because he thinks the zen approach is just BS. I guess I'm just wondering about these two very different approaches to great shooting. Point shooting and speed shooting. If I just want to make class and do good at matches there seem to be several examples that pure speed wins. If I want to get the most fulfullment out of the whole experience then point shooting would be the way. A mixure of both would seem the best but bad accuracy is such a negative factor. Last local match I felt like I shot horribly but I finished high enough that many would have liked my spot. Bad accuracy!!! Just rambling,,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted November 24, 2003 Author Share Posted November 24, 2003 ...patience during a match is another issue. The study of just that one point seems to be overbearing and I would say that most either quit the sport or stagnat in it because they just can't wait for the shot. I see that match after match after match... Is the ability to 'get' shot patience learned or intuitive? Or both? For me, it is learned. I have to constantly re-learn it as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravisT Posted November 24, 2003 Share Posted November 24, 2003 Hey TT, I just glad I was fortunate enough to be introduced to this game in an area that YOU were living in (at the time ) Watching you shoot was/is inspiring!Good job at Area2 by the way. What made you decide to shoot Lim-10? ....and why do you insert, remove and reinsert you mag on the load'n make ready? What are you checking for? Take Care You're too kind bro. In my sick and convoluted mind, L-10 is the *essence* of practical pistol! I guess that mag thing is just a habit to make sure they fall free 3/4- Rob learned it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDave Posted November 24, 2003 Share Posted November 24, 2003 Getting it (what we're talking about) is an epiphany. A glorious realization that is beyond description. Allowing this to occur 100% of the time is awful damn difficult. The state of mental clarity is unreal, but very peaceful. Its not so much about being in the experince as it is putting things that get in the way, like tension and "wants", aside. I think that is what seperates the A/B shooters from the M/GM crowd and the SuperSquad from everone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted November 25, 2003 Share Posted November 25, 2003 Yes, after years of struggle and effort, Rob learned that he could know he hit as quickly as he could not know if he hit or missed. be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDean Posted November 25, 2003 Share Posted November 25, 2003 ...he could know he hit as quickly as he could not know if he hit or missed.be After reading that 3-4 times, I finally got it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blkbrd Posted November 26, 2003 Share Posted November 26, 2003 Last weekend I had the best match fundementally of my life. This weekend (Sunday) I shot a match and only got 87% of the points, with my new gun. HMM.....last weekend I was using a borrowed gun, now my new gun that I just got back. Still gotta get those points regardless. Paul; So if I understand right, you re-borrow the SV and I shoot your new super duper open gun instead of the singlestack that I'm using because my perty new Limited gun is broken again, 3rd times a charm? we will both shoot the best matches of our lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 I remember some time ago doing some draw and fire on a target. Target was the usual 7 yds. My partner was to set a par time (I am not told the time as this is a drill to develop consistency of draw and fire speed). Not knowing the par time I rushed the draw, did not see the sights and fired into the C zone, in the area just below the A zone. I also broke the shot just as the par time beeped. Normally I would not need to see the sights to break the A-zone at that distance and that low stress level but I scored a Charlie because I rushed. So next draw I did not rush and decided to settle myself. I told my partner not to change the par time. This time I fired within the par time in the A-zone. Did this 3 more times before my partner lowered the par time. The essence of my story is a common mistake we all make. We believe that 'Rushing' means 'Going Faster'. How do we know when we are rushing?? When there is tension/thought in the movement!! Palms sweaty, wobble area increases, poor grip etc. How do we avoid getting into a 'Rushing Mindset'.. Don't think of what you need to do (e.g. I must score an A here or I lose this match), just do it. It is obvious that you needed to shoot As generally to do well, and if you were doing that then you wouldn't need to be rushing now This is the concept of Munen muso: spontaneity, an impassive mind, no sign of effort. . Paladin, If it is within you let it free If it is not within you, put it there!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted August 17, 2006 Author Share Posted August 17, 2006 I was searchig for a different thread and found this one. Three years later...same stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mscott Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 Might as well bump this up to go with part 2. I think I'll read them both a couple more times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallow Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 (edited) Post deleted by Gallow Edited February 22, 2008 by Gallow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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