jhgtyre Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 I recently picked up an M1A and it does not consistantly go into battery. I case gauged the ammo and it seems fine but everyone 3 or 4 rounds the gun just goes click. There is no firing pin mark on the primer so I think the gun is out of battery when this happens. When I got the gun it was bone dry so I disassembled, cleaned, lubed and greased all the parts as appropriate and still get a lot of clicks instead of bangs when firing. What could this be? -ld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynn jones Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 squib or something in the bore? lynn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SharonAnne9x23 Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 what kind of bullet? pointed or round nose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted February 16, 2009 Author Share Posted February 16, 2009 Pointy bullets. The bore is clean. -ld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbrowndog Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Kurt, is on the road to Wyo. right now I'm sure he can help you out when he gets to a PC. Other than him and PK, I do not know anyone else that does much with M1A on this forum. Hoppy also????? trapr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopalong Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Go to the range, shoot the rifle until it does it again. WHEN it does this inappropriate thing. STOP, give it a few seconds just in case of a slow fire. Then check to see if it is in battery (push forward on the charge handle) If it is in battery, look behind the bolt to see if the hammer is fully forward. If they both are in their appropriate positions then unload the rifle, lock back the bolt and drop check the suspicios round back into the chamber with the bolt locked back (and safety on) If the cartridge falls all the way into the chamber (you'll hear it go "thunk") you need to look at your extractor as your next problem. When and if you have the problem, and the cartridge fits fine, drop the bolt. If it goes all the way and closes then try it (fire it) until it does it again. If you continue to have the problem and it is just not going into battery, go to Brownells and get you a new recoil spring (Wolf xpower) and try some more, but I'll bet that takes care of the problem. Good luck, If you continue to have the problem. (Insert Merlin here) I'll give you $200.00 for it !!! Hopalong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 Go to the range, shoot the rifle until it does it again.WHEN it does this inappropriate thing. STOP, give it a few seconds just in case of a slow fire. Then check to see if it is in battery (push forward on the charge handle) If it is in battery, look behind the bolt to see if the hammer is fully forward. If they both are in their appropriate positions then unload the rifle, lock back the bolt and drop check the suspicios round back into the chamber with the bolt locked back (and safety on) If the cartridge falls all the way into the chamber (you'll hear it go "thunk") you need to look at your extractor as your next problem. When and if you have the problem, and the cartridge fits fine, drop the bolt. If it goes all the way and closes then try it (fire it) until it does it again. If you continue to have the problem and it is just not going into battery, go to Brownells and get you a new recoil spring (Wolf xpower) and try some more, but I'll bet that takes care of the problem. Good luck, If you continue to have the problem. (Insert Merlin here) I'll give you $200.00 for it !!! Hopalong Well I thought I was going to get to take the thing out for more testing but that didn't happen. Maybe this weekend. Thanks for the suggestions. -ld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.E. Kelley Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 (edited) Absent the master Kip Millunker, I will try to help. I understand you have case gauged but does this occur with factory ammo? A quick check is to see if the bolt and op rod will fully close on a empty chamber without the spring assembly via gravity. Check too the condition of your bolt roller? Is it present? Sloppy loose? A gummed up or sticky extractor spring can cause this difficulty too. Let us know. Patrick Edited February 17, 2009 by P.E. Kelley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 From worst to best in that order. Head space way out and ammo right at minimum. Most all M1A's that haven't been worked on, and this is all manufacturers EXCEPT Smith Enterprises, will EASILY close on a NO-GO guage, and some on a Field guage!! That plus bare minimum 308...NOT 7.62X51 might lead top CLICK Op rod bent. The op rod should sit square on the tail of the gas piston, not way off to one side. A worn out op rod can and will do this, check the cam surfaces. Pat's test is the right one. Pull out the op rod spring and guide, hold the action horizontal and slowly elevate the muzzle. It should unlock it'sself around 15-20 degrees and should close it'sself in the same range when the muzzle is depressed. I doubt that the EXTRACTOR is your problem if it can't move freely it will usually break and or depart the rifle while firing along with the spring and plunger. The EJECTOR and spring sure could give you this problem if it were real gunked up A cracked bolt roller could do it. An after market firing pin ( non G.I.) not in spec...I have seen a few that didn't protrude near enough, that in conjunction with a loose military chamber and minimum SAMMI spec ammo = no bang. A bent firing pin or gummed up firing pin channel could do it a burr on the back of the firing pin or on the bridge could do it. Not enough gas and in conjunction with a dirty bolt component problem would for sure do it. is the gas cylinder lock ring screwed ALL the way down? Is the gas cylinder lock ring nut screwed down to at least 15 ft. lbs? As a note The more info you can give the more this can be narrowed down. This goes for many postes. For example I got an M1A doesn't narrow the field down much, seeing how Springfield, Smith Enterprises, Fulton armory, Norinco, Federal Ordnance, and LRA make M1As. Next you have ALL Military parts on a civilian receiver, you have latter model parts (non-G.I.) on a civilian receiver, and you have reworked Norincos with Military parts....ETC. Next my ammo doesn't work doesn't help either. Where did it come from, Did you reload it? Did it come from a comercial reloader? is it U.S.G.I? Is it Foriegn Military? Is it hunting ammo? Is it ball? Next I got an M1A doesn't tell us if it has been "worked on" either in the chop shop or by a Gunsmith who may or may not know anything about M1As. If the trigger housing isn't held square to the upper receiver while bedding you can sure have this type of problem...for instance..and if they ratched up the trigger guard, it sure can cause a problem like this ( that would be real rare...but it can) KurtM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.E. Kelley Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 The master has spoken Damn it!!!! I meant EJECTOR!!! ....next time pat write what you meant..... Thanks Kurt Patrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKSNIPER Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 (edited) I recently picked up an M1A and it does not consistantly go into battery. I case gauged the ammo and it seems fine but everyone 3 or 4 rounds the gun just goes click. There is no firing pin mark on the primer so I think the gun is out of battery when this happens. When I got the gun it was bone dry so I disassembled, cleaned, lubed and greased all the parts as appropriate and still get a lot of clicks instead of bangs when firing. What could this be?-ld Agree with Kurt...not enough info here to pinpoint problems/issues. Most likely (in my experience) culprit and easiest and cheapest to fix? 1. Improper cleaning and lube 2. Op rod spring Anything beyond this basic stuff and a few things Kurt suggested probably entails taking it to a gunsmith to fix. I know 1 real good one with service rifle experience that I would trust my M1-A to who is located in Wisconsin. Charlie Milazzo Call the Milazzo genius and ask Charlie to diagnose/fix it for you. 262-363-8779 I can guarentee it will not cost more than it should to fix it (no rip-off) and the work will be top notch. JK Edited February 17, 2009 by JKSNIPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopalong Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 I too stand corrected, Next time I'll say ejector when I really mean ejector. Good luck with it, keep us up to date. (with more info, on trouble and the fix) Hopalong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 Lets see. This is what I know; It is a 2xxx (four digits in the 2000's range) Fed. Ord. with GI parts and everthing looks pretty tight and straight. I have no idea if it has been gunsmithed but it doesn't "look" hacked upon. It has the brown plastic/fiberglass stock with the selector cut out. The trigger housing is tight to the stock and when it is removed the action does not just fall out of the stock; you have to tug a little. When disassembling the rifle the OP Rod does not lift out unless the roll pin that holds it into that ring near the muzzle end is removed first. I used 3 types of ammo; Chilean Military Surplus, home rolled and Black Hills (in the red box). All of the ammo fit the case gauge. We have a gunsmith on the range with lots of experience with these rifles so if the tests that have been mentioned don't reveal any answers I will drop it off and hope for a full recovery. I was also thinking that new springs couldn't hurt. Thank you all for the suggestions. I really wanted to shoot this at SMM3gun so I hope I get it fixed. If not I have a buddy with a nice loaner. Thanks, -Larry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbrowndog Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 See I was going to say exactly what Kip said, but I wanted him to feel NEEDED!!!!! So I let him answer the question. Trapr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 When disassembling the rifle the OP Rod does not lift out unless the roll pin that holds it into that ring near the muzzle end is removed first. The roll pin hold the op rod guide in place on the barrel, and does not retain the op rod. The op rod should lift off from the reciever end, after being disengaged from the track in the reciever, and the bolt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 This is one of those times I hate to say anything, and I hope I am WRONG, but MANY of the Fed Ord rifles had big problems with head space and where the bridge in the receiver was located. I hope yours isn't one of them, and I think I would get it over to Derek sooner than latter. Good luck and let us know. KurtM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted February 18, 2009 Author Share Posted February 18, 2009 This is one of those times I hate to say anything, and I hope I am WRONG, but MANY of the Fed Ord rifles had big problems with head space and where the bridge in the receiver was located. I hope yours isn't one of them, and I think I would get it over to Derek sooner than latter. Good luck and let us know. KurtM I think that might just be my next stop. Thanks, -ld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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