Scooter Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 A McLaren F1 is still faster AND more efficient. The McLaren can get 26 mpg highway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpolans Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 So what would you think of a Murcielago LP640 ? Overweight POS. Like Colin Chapman says, you need to add lightness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 I repeat: A/C, or HEAT, DEFROST, & HEADLIGHTS, WIPERS, TRAFFIC. And it takes 3-1/2 hours to fill'er up. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 Well...the wipers work. (I can't believe the crappy weather they had during the filming of that video.) I think they have some traffic in LA...and jay said he had 500 miles on it already. The 3.5hrs is assuming you actaully run it completely dead. Anyway...just plug it in over-night, right? (What if you had to take your cell phone in to the filling station every few days? Instead of plugging it in over-night?) This thing is like an Open gun. It might not be the most practical, but it shows what could be possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 (edited) My only problems are the short range (I put 27K or so on the car a year - 220 miles in a day is pretty easy going to a match or something), and the fear of battery replacement cost in about 4 years after I buy the car... That's gotta be a big price tag... I think this signals things to come, though... Hey, Jim, why the woodie over hybrids? Just the relative fuel economy? You're forgetting battery lifetime and replacement costs there, too... If its environmental concern, you're doing more damage to the environment (if we assume that carbon footprint == damage) than you would buying regular internal combustion... At least these guys actually build their batteries in the US instead of shipping them all over the world... ETA... my wife saw an Elise for the first time yesterday... she's in love What I didn't realize about them is that all four Lotus models are built on a Toyota power plant... hmmmm.... Me likee the Toyo vroom-vroom.... Edited May 1, 2008 by XRe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 Actually I am not a big fan based upon the costs and all, however the current technology and the ability to fill it up at a already in place infrastructure is why I currently favor the hybrid idea over pure electric. Now that said... IF I lived in town and needed a station car. I could get away easily with an electric to drive two miles each way to catch a train. I would't want any of them for a road trip yet. I had a 1968 Dodge Dart with a V-8, 3 spd and 4 doors. Carried 6 people, had a trunk large enough to put my Honda SL-125 in, altough I did have to tie it shut. It would smoke the tires in all three gears, did over 90 in second and I don't want to know in third. got over 20 mpg. It did not have: A/C, Power Windows or seats, Automatic trans, power brakes or even disc brakes. It did need Points, plugs, rotor, dist cap and condenser every 10k miles. It did have VENT WINDOWS!!!! You couldn't give this away today, sadly. Closest I have now is my wife's Jeep Liberty. Smaller, slower and much more loaded, but only 16-18 MPG. I think that a lot of the pollution garbage that is added to engines and our fuel MAY put out less PPM or PPB measured against the number of gallons consumed but if the mileage isn't there, are we maybe putting out more per MILE??? Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted May 1, 2008 Author Share Posted May 1, 2008 (edited) Replacing the batteries after 4 or 5 years is not a big deal. How many $ did you not spend on gasoline in those 100,000 miles? Not to mention they plan to bring out a mass market production model which is much more affordable for us mortals in the near future. This is the car they built to prove it could be done, and, I suspect, to help fund the R&D and provide a little marketing. I wonder how many of you nattering nabobs of negativism would have laughed at Fulton, or, at the very idea of putting an electronic red dot sight on a competition pistol? ETA: The range is a consideration for longer trips. You might have to allow a little more time to stop and plug in while you have lunch. If you drive 200 miles to a match and there is no place to plug in I'd suggest a portable generator in the trunk to charge the car while you shoot. Edited May 1, 2008 by AikiDale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 Actually I am not a big fan based upon the costs and all, however the current technology and the ability to fill it up at a already in place infrastructure is why I currently favor the hybrid idea over pure electric. Gotcha... you favor the practicality... I can dig that You couldn't give this away today, sadly. Closest I have now is my wife's Jeep Liberty. Smaller, slower and much more loaded, but only 16-18 MPG. I don't know... someone restoring old cars w/ big motors might be interested... Seems like its a semi-popular restore job (in fact, I know someone doing one right now... late model Dart...) I think that a lot of the pollution garbage that is added to engines and our fuel MAY put out less PPM or PPB measured against the number of gallons consumed but if the mileage isn't there, are we maybe putting out more per MILE??? Possibly... The problem is, too, that in order to get the best specs in PPM/PPB, they've down tuned the motors so violently that you have to go WOT to go anywhere, and that's the worst option for fuel economy... Still, some of these new V-8s get 20-ish MPG in a big SUV (due to running fewer cylinders or whatever), but still have some grunt when you need it... Hell, my WRX only gets 22 MPG... of course, it gets up and moves when you want it to... but its only a 2.0L, 4 cylinder motor... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 Replacing the batteries after 4 or 5 years is not a big deal. How many $ did you not spend on gasoline in those 100,000 miles? I'm not nay-saying it, Dale Don't get me wrong.... but how much of the $100K price tag is battery? If I had to guess.... given production rates and battery technology, etc... $15-20K ??? On top of a $100K car, I have to plan to dump $15K into it in 4-5 years? Yeesh... Too rich for my blood, and not capable enough to be my daily driver (range). Not that I could buy a $100K car right now anyway Obviously, this isn't a prime-time option yet. If they can come up with something affordable, with same or better range, and similar performance characteristics, I'm game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce282 Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 Hell, my WRX only gets 22 MPG... of course, it gets up and moves when you want it to... but its only a 2.0L, 4 cylinder motor... City or highway? Mine got 28-29 mpg doing between 70 and 80 on I81-I66 coming home from a match in Roanoke. But I'm going get mad when I have to pay over $4 a gallon for the good stuff next fill up. Last time was 3.93. What really irks me is in the good old days there was normally a 5 to 10 cent difference between the 3 grades. Now I'm seeing a 30-40 cent jump from middle to premium grades. Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 City or highway? Mine got 28-29 mpg doing between 70 and 80 on I81-I66 coming home from a match in Roanoke. Don't know how you managed that I've had two of them, now, and the best I've managed is 24 on highway only tanks (same speed range). Interestingly, even with foot heavily into it, I only seem to ever drop down to 20 at the lowest. Pretty much always get 21-22 over the course of a tank.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted May 1, 2008 Author Share Posted May 1, 2008 I have no idea what the replacement costs are to be honest Dave. There is a local guy building electric mini-truck conversions for $15,000. The lead-acid batteries have to be replaced every 4 or 5 years at a cost of $1,500. This particular vehicle only has a 60 to 65 mile range or I'd go for one right now. 220 miles I could live with but I'd have to sell a lot of photos first to buy a $100,000 car (and I haven't sold the first one yet). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted May 1, 2008 Author Share Posted May 1, 2008 Just for the record, my little Saturn gets 36 mpg, the 350 HD Diesel a bit less.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 My Father had a Buick Park Avenue with a super charger. It was BIG, It was COMFORTABLE, It RAN (Actually it could get you in a lot of trouble REAL FAST), It got Mid-20's MPG! and when he drove it across Texas, he was in the UPPER 20'S!!!! What has happened? Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 The new VW Jetta TDI (due in summer 2008) will do approx 50mpg. I love the idea of the Tesla though I would prefer the Tesla's original car (if it could ever be found) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom S. Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 I'm just guessing here, but I bet it won't pull my 37 foot fifth wheel. :popcorn1: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce282 Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 City or highway? Mine got 28-29 mpg doing between 70 and 80 on I81-I66 coming home from a match in Roanoke. Don't know how you managed that I've had two of them, now, and the best I've managed is 24 on highway only tanks (same speed range). Interestingly, even with foot heavily into it, I only seem to ever drop down to 20 at the lowest. Pretty much always get 21-22 over the course of a tank.... I don't know Dave, mine is 2004 with 49k miles on it, 5 speed. I do remember is that almost that tank was driven on Cruise control, not much traffic. When I drive back and forth to the Fredericksburg match on 95, even if it's not stop and go, you are always on the gas, then brakes then gas. I hate those folks who park their a$$ in the left lane and just toddle along. I'll see what I get going to Area 8. Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted May 1, 2008 Author Share Posted May 1, 2008 I'm just guessing here, but I bet it won't pull my 37 foot fifth wheel. :popcorn1: My Saturn won't but I bet the 350 HD will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 What has happened? We're not allowed to talk about it on this forum, due to forum policy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larry cazes Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 I have no idea what the replacement costs are to be honest Dave. There is a local guy building electric mini-truck conversions for $15,000. The lead-acid batteries have to be replaced every 4 or 5 years at a cost of $1,500. Does that include Hazmat fees? I suspect not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted May 1, 2008 Author Share Posted May 1, 2008 I have no idea what the replacement costs are to be honest Dave. There is a local guy building electric mini-truck conversions for $15,000. The lead-acid batteries have to be replaced every 4 or 5 years at a cost of $1,500. Does that include Hazmat fees? I suspect not. Hazmat fee? Last time I had to replace an automobile battery the old one got me $10 off the price of the new one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 The Tesla battery is a RoHS design - and disposal and recycling are built into the design and the initial price of the battery. Don't know about Dale's truck guy, though... SLA batteries are taken care of in a different fashion than LiIon... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted May 2, 2008 Share Posted May 2, 2008 Replacing the batteries after 4 or 5 years is not a big deal. How many $ did you not spend on gasoline in those 100,000 miles? Applying logic here. Since we have to compare comparable cars. Toyota Camry LE in 4 cyl vs. Camry hybrid $21,225 vs. $25,350: Difference of $4,125 26 mpg avg vs. 33.5 mpg 3846 gals to 100K mi vs. 2985 gals $15,384 to 100K mi @ $4/gal vs. $11,940: Difference of $3,444 So you would have $681 in your pocket for not buying the hybrid. Having owned a Camry, the actual mpg for the 4 cyl is about 30 mpg average. Toyota Corolla LE vs. Prius $16,650 vs. $21,100: Diff $4450 31 mpg vs. 46.5 mpg 3226 gals vs. 2151 gals $12,904 to 100K mi vs. $8604: Diff $4300 $150 in your pocket for not buying the hybrid. You really don't save money by buying a hybrid if you drive less than 100K miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted May 2, 2008 Share Posted May 2, 2008 (edited) Replacing the batteries after 4 or 5 years is not a big deal. How many $ did you not spend on gasoline in those 100,000 miles? Applying logic here. Since we have to compare comparable cars. Toyota Camry LE in 4 cyl vs. Camry hybrid $21,225 vs. $25,350: Difference of $4,125 26 mpg avg vs. 33.5 mpg 3846 gals to 100K mi vs. 2985 gals $15,384 to 100K mi @ $4/gal vs. $11,940: Difference of $3,444 So you would have $681 in your pocket for not buying the hybrid. Having owned a Camry, the actual mpg for the 4 cyl is about 30 mpg average. Toyota Corolla LE vs. Prius $16,650 vs. $21,100: Diff $4450 31 mpg vs. 46.5 mpg 3226 gals vs. 2151 gals $12,904 to 100K mi vs. $8604: Diff $4300 $150 in your pocket for not buying the hybrid. You really don't save money by buying a hybrid if you drive less than 100K miles. It is not that simple I can't remember if it is state or federal, but you can get several thousand in tax rebates for buying a hybrid. Then factor in that you will be paying several thousand to replace the batteries, if you keep the thing long enough. Figure that out of warrantee repairs will be more expensive. If the car gets wrecked, call in HazMat, and hope you don't get billed for that. Edited May 2, 2008 by wide45 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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