Grip Tape On Production Xd

[Interceptor]

Hello,

I was wondering if grip tape on the bottom side of the trigger guard, where the weak hand index finger rests, is production legal? I would like to have my production rig as close to my limited as possible in this regard.

I tried to search, but couldn't find what I was looking for.

Thanks in advance.

Tag

[rack&roll]

Grip tape is legal anywhere on your production gun's frame, as far as I know.

Larry

[Chris Keen]

YUP!

I've even heard it's legal anywhere BEHIND the ejection port.

[Jim Norman]

Friend of ours got moved to open at eh Open/Production Nats in Tulsa. He had grip tape on the front of his Glock Slide. Only reason was for ULSC, but didn't matter. didn't really give any advantage, but didn't matter.

If I were addidng tape beyond what Eric sells, I would get a ruling FIRST

Jim

[rack&roll]

Friend of ours got moved to open at eh Open/Production Nats in Tulsa. He had grip tape on the front of his Glock Slide. Only reason was for ULSC, but didn't matter. didn't really give any advantage, but didn't matter.

If I were addidng tape beyond what Eric sells, I would get a ruling FIRST

Jim

Uh...,rather than be moved to open, why didn't he just REMOVE the grip tape? Or is that too obvious?

Larry

[ihatepickles]

Uh...,rather than be moved to open, why didn't he just REMOVE the grip tape? Or is that too obvious?

It's not an option. Once an RO notices an illegal item on your gun, you've violated the rules and the penalty is you're moved to Open. It's not the shooters choice to remove the illegal part or be moved to Open.

[Shawn Knight]

I have grip tape in the spot you mention and I like it very much. It is more on the smooth side but it helps a lot. I had been having trouble staying indexed on the gun until I did this. No more problems!

[ysued]

It's not an option. Once an RO notices an illegal item on your gun, you've violated the rules and the penalty is you're moved to Open. It's not the shooters choice to remove the illegal part or be moved to Open.

Tell me about it!!

I learned the hard way when I got moved to Open at the 2005 Area 3 because a Plastic Grip Plug on my G17.

Y

[Steve Moneypenny]

Grip tape can only be put on the Grip area of the gun. ANY where else is going to get you move to open according to the powers that be. This was a big issue at nationals and had a lot of question asked everywhere. if you stick it somewhere besides the grips it's an "external modification" which in some ways i can see, but i do not agree with the call.

It could go as far as front strap and back strap are bad... but i don't think anyone will argue there.

[R. Batt]

Where do you find all of these rules? I have looked all over in the rule book and can find nothing about a lot of the rules I read about here.

Thanks

[EricW]

Where do you find all of these rules? I have looked all over in the rule book and can find nothing about a lot of the rules I read about here.

Thanks

You can't. They don't exist.

Also, as flattered as I am that my grips are the reference standard, I wish that there was a more consistent standard. As long as safety isn't compromised, who cares where someone applies skid tape? What possible competitive advantage is there?

Also, although my product is allowed in IPSC as well, I really have to take issue with IPSC's definition of the grip (IPSC is not pleased with how high my grips and A-Grip come up on the frame). There are damned good reasons our grips go as high on the gun as they do: (1) you need traction there for your weak hand, (2) you need the surface area to keep the tape from sliding around. If IPSC has it's way, the gripping area of the handgun is going to be defined as where the strong hand contacts the gun and that's about it.

I'm not happy with that definition.

[chuckw]

If IPSC has it's way, the gripping area of the handgun is going to be defined as where the strong hand contacts the gun and that's about it. I'm not happy with that definition.

I'm pretty sure I read something at the Global Village where Vince said he wasn't thrilled about how far up your tape went but your product was still approved. Did he change his mind?

[EricW]

If IPSC has it's way, the gripping area of the handgun is going to be defined as where the strong hand contacts the gun and that's about it. I'm not happy with that definition.

I'm pretty sure I read something at the Global Village where Vince said he wasn't thrilled about how far up your tape went but your product was still approved. Did he change his mind?

No, but based on what I'm reading on the GV, I expect PD rules and their enforcement to change substantially in the very near future. The quest for the Holy Grail (read: the Unsoiled Production Heater that was packed around Bethlehem by the Virgin Mary herself) has begun, and I don't expect it to moderate itself any time in the near future.

[GeorgeInNePa]

If IPSC has it's way, the gripping area of the handgun is going to be defined as where the strong hand contacts the gun and that's about it. I'm not happy with that definition.

I'm pretty sure I read something at the Global Village where Vince said he wasn't thrilled about how far up your tape went but your product was still approved. Did he change his mind?

No, but based on what I'm reading on the GV, I expect PD rules and their enforcement to change substantially in the very near future. The quest for the Holy Grail (read: the Unsoiled Production Heater that was packed around Bethlehem by the Virgin Mary herself) has begun, and I don't expect it to moderate itself any time in the near future.

My gunsmith had a good idea for USPSA Production shooters who want a grippy slide.

Slide refinshing is allowed by the USPSA rules. There are no accepted or rejected finishes listed.

Well then, just refinish your slide with pickup truck spray-on rubber bedliner!

Then again, getting the gun out of a Blade-Tech might be tough...

[Flexmoney]

I can see the rational to keep it off the slide. We often have to work the slide to load the gun on the clock or clear malfunctions. No doubt that the grip tape on the slide would be a modification when viewed from that regard.

Here is the applicable rule for USPSA Production:

21.6 Aftermarket grips which match the profile of the OFM standard for

the approved handgun and/or the application of grip tape or rubber

sleeves is permitted. Modifications to grips, other than previously

mentioned, not allowed, such as grooves cut to reach mag release

or size reduction.

I don't think we have a definition of "grip". To me, it would mean anywhere I touch/hold onto the gun while shooting. So, the underside of the trigger guard would be go to go for me.

[Interceptor]

I can see the rational to keep it off the slide. We often have to work the slide to load the gun on the clock or clear malfunctions. No doubt that the grip tape on the slide would be a modification when viewed from that regard.

Here is the applicable rule for USPSA Production:

21.6 Aftermarket grips which match the profile of the OFM standard for

the approved handgun and/or the application of grip tape or rubber

sleeves is permitted. Modifications to grips, other than previously

mentioned, not allowed, such as grooves cut to reach mag release

or size reduction.

I don't think we have a definition of "grip". To me, it would mean anywhere I touch/hold onto the gun while shooting. So, the underside of the trigger guard would be go to go for me.

Kyle, that was my thinking also. I will have to inquire of the NROI gods about this one and I will get back to you guys.

[Gregory_k]

It is not a grip, but a trigger guard.

[Flexmoney]

Greg,

While I don't really disagree with you...

Couldn't it also be part of the grip?

Take a magwell, for instance. It serves as a funnel for the mags. It also adds weight to the gun, and it works as a pommel to help the shooter lock their grip into the gun. One part...with more than one function.

If you were working as a Range Officer, would you bump a shooter from Production to Open division for grip tape on their trigger guard?

[Jim Norman]

Friend of ours got moved to open at eh Open/Production Nats in Tulsa. He had grip tape on the front of his Glock Slide. Only reason was for ULSC, but didn't matter. didn't really give any advantage, but didn't matter.

If I were addidng tape beyond what Eric sells, I would get a ruling FIRST

Jim

Uh...,rather than be moved to open, why didn't he just REMOVE the grip tape? Or is that too obvious?

Larry

Too late, Once you have shot the first shot, you have competed i a divisoin with equipment that is not approved for that division. There is no oppurtunity to unshoot a proceedural or unshoot a bump to Open. THink about having 11 rounds in a mag after the load and make ready. even if you never shot the additional round, you have violated the rules, the penalty is the bump to open.

Jim

[ysued]

Kyle,

That is an excellent point.

The Rules require clarification, you brought your own iterpretation of the Rules!!

Rules should not be left to interpretation, they should be firm, fair and concise so even an ESL Dummy like me can understand them!!

Thanks for reinforcing my point in such an eloquent manner.

Y

I can see the rational to keep it off the slide. We often have to work the slide to load the gun on the clock or clear malfunctions. No doubt that the grip tape on the slide would be a modification when viewed from that regard.

Here is the applicable rule for USPSA Production:

21.6 Aftermarket grips which match the profile of the OFM standard for

the approved handgun and/or the application of grip tape or rubber

sleeves is permitted. Modifications to grips, other than previously

mentioned, not allowed, such as grooves cut to reach mag release

or size reduction.

I don't think we have a definition of "grip". To me, it would mean anywhere I touch/hold onto the gun while shooting. So, the underside of the trigger guard would be go to go for me.

[BSeevers]

If IPSC has it's way, the gripping area of the handgun is going to be defined as where the strong hand contacts the gun and that's about it. I'm not happy with that definition.

I'm pretty sure I read something at the Global Village where Vince said he wasn't thrilled about how far up your tape went but your product was still approved. Did he change his mind?

IS this serious?

I want to confirm before I go into a tirade

[ysued]

IS this serious?

I want to confirm before I go into a tirade

Let it loose baby!!

Y

[chuckw]

No, but based on what I'm reading on the GV, I expect PD rules and their enforcement to change substantially in the very near future. The quest for the Holy Grail (read: the Unsoiled Production Heater that was packed around Bethlehem by the Virgin Mary herself) has begun, and I don't expect it to moderate itself any time in the near future.

I kinda get that impression too but I think they've done a pretty good job of keeping production the low cost basic factory gun thing it was supposed to be. IPSC never allowed slides to be milled and the grip tape thing came up when some guy wanted to stick it on his thumb safety AND trigger guard AND at the front of the slide where he grips (verb) his gun.

You could argue you grip (verb) the hammer at times too and I guess that's why IPSC is being hard-assed about it and treats the word "grip" as a noun.

[Jim Norman]

If IPSC wanted to keep Production a "low-cost" division, they would have set a capacity limit so that everyone couuld have had a better chance of playing with what they already had. Instead, to be competitive, you need a high capacity 9mm and you need a Race Holster. Here you can shoot a G-26 and use Uncle Mike. WHich cost more? IPSC High Cap Berretta and C-R Speed? or G22 (One I already own) & Uncle Mike?

Jim

[ysued]

Jim, you have a very valid point.

I very well know that we are drifting off-Topic here....

But.....

Here in the US after we do the Trigger Job and Mill the Melted-Down Bomars you have added another $600 to your Production Gun, so I guess it evens out at the end, but I think we are even higher in USPSA.

IMHO, let's take the best from both worlds and revise out Rules.

Back on topic... What do you mean that Eric's tape is too high???

If IPSC wanted to keep Production a "low-cost" division, they would have set a capacity limit so that everyone couuld have had a better chance of playing with what they already had. Instead, to be competitive, you need a high capacity 9mm and you need a Race Holster. Here you can shoot a G-26 and use Uncle Mike. WHich cost more? IPSC High Cap Berretta and C-R Speed? or G22 (One I already own) & Uncle Mike?

Jim