Downloaded .45 Acp In Ssp/esp?

[RePete]

Mike, if they tried to enforce that statement then there would be no IDPA. Less than 20% of the shooters I know use "full power" loads. That 20% is made up of those that use 9mm Blazer or white box. I know of one CDP shooter that uses factory ammo.

It is not a rule, but a "mission statement".

The mission statement contradicts the Power Factor rule. Most factory 230 gr ball ammo has a PF of over 190. Typical 115 gr 9mm ammo runs a 138-145 PF.

SSP and ESP would be a 9mm only Division. Why would anyone shoot a .40 in these Divisions?

Not picking on you, but you are not living in the real world of IDPA.

I have advocated having a Major and Minor PF scoring system in each Division for years. Minor would be scored +.50 sec. and +1.50 sec. Major would be +.25 and +.75 sec. I would even split CDP into two PF. Minor would be 165 and Major would be 190 for those that want to shoot a manly load. That would make things a little interesting in CDP. A 230 at 718 fps or a 230 at 826 fps might be fun.

FWIW I shoot IDPA and IPSC with a 625 in 45ACP (2 different PF's). I can't be bothered making up 2 different loads for the 2 games (yes games), so I load to IPSC PF (don't want to pick up a box of the wrong game load and get chono'd down to minor).

I chrono'd last Sunday in +6C temps (a beautiful day) to 176.226PF (230gr Plated over 5.0gr Bullseye, for an average velocity of 766.2fps).

JoeD: I like the idea of Major/Minor but it may not happen.

Merry Christmas to all.

RePete.

[leam]

The mission statement contradicts the Power Factor rule. Most factory 230 gr ball ammo has a PF of over 190. Typical 115 gr 9mm ammo runs a 138-145 PF.

I have advocated having a Major and Minor PF scoring system in each Division for years. Minor would be scored +.50 sec. and +1.50 sec. Major would be +.25 and +.75 sec. I would even split CDP into two PF. Minor would be 165 and Major would be 190 for those that want to shoot a manly load. That would make things a little interesting in CDP. A 230 at 718 fps or a 230 at 826 fps might be fun.

I shoot a 230 lead RN at 718+. I think we crono'd 4.0 grains of Bullseye averaging just over 720 with some below 718 so I bumped it up to 4.1 grains for a margin of error. Supposedly the 230 gives less recoil than a faster, lighter bullet.

IDPA rules state the PFs so we'll go by those. The issue of "what you carry" becomes problematic, some of us might not carry anything. Or some folks home defense load might be a 100 PF .45 ACP because they live in an apartment or crowded neighborhood. If we were just after manliness it'd be something like 10mm Auto or 357 Mag. Certainly more manly than I! To be enforceable and consistant something must generally be measureable. A PF is, an ideal isn't.

I like the guy that loads the same for IPSC/IDPA. Keeps things simple. I have 3 loads currently, the IDPA load, the Monday Night pseudo Bullseye load, and the bowling pin load. Not that I see a lot of difference but I just started reloading so playing with different loads is fun. Since all three shoots are games I can have fun at it. Which is also an IDPA P&P.

ciao!

leam

Edited December 27, 2006 by Duane Thomas

[richardschennberg]

It does not appear to be against the rules. Perhaps 125-130 PF would be excessively gamey if done for a competitive advantage, but not if this is your standard Bullseye load and you want to be able to use your LSW bullets and not have to change your reloading press back and forth. I don't see anything wrong with loading slightly below 165 for ESP, whether the caliber/case is .45 ACP, 9mm, 38 Super, .40 S&W, or 10mm. The only ethical issue with loading .45, .40, 10mm at 125-130 PF is it might be offensive to other shooters even if it is within the IDPA rules.

I personally would rather my gun function well than gain a slightly reduced split time. Next time I shoot 10mm I will be shooting 200 PF not because I have to, but because I'd rather use up my old ammo. If I use up my old stock of hot (similar to factory) 10mm, my next load will depend on which bullets are available, what powders I already have on hand, and what funcitons in my gun. Since the ESP PF floor is 125 it should not matter whether it comes out 160 or 170.

[Aircooled6racer]

Hello: I guess I'm more of the gamer type. I built a STI in 40 for both games. I use the 155 grain bullets loaded to the lower power factor for IDPA and 185 grain for the other game. I'm with "Joe D" on the using the higher count magazines for ESP. I figure if someone can start with 11 rounds why can't I. I also shoot CDP and reload for it as well. I chrono everything to make sure they are going to make the power factor and add a little to make sure. I don't see anything wrong with legal minimum loads in 9,40 or 45 in ESP. Thanks Eric

[ryucasta]

Whats the problem I've done it with a G21. That the only gun I know that can be used in CDP, ESP and SSP and all you need to do is change springs and loads. Having said all that though I tend to use a G22 for ESP and SSP with 135 PF loads oh yeah but thats a gamers load...