Gregg K Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 No one in my area has an IDPA box. I guess that I'll just build one. I have the official dimensions but can't remember how thick the wood is or if the sides sit on top of the bottom or if the sides are around the bottom. Does anyone have plans or a close picture of an official box? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 The "INTERIOR" dimensions of the box are what is given for the mesurements. As long as you have those dimensions, how the box is assembled does not matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Murphy Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 What Crusher Said, However the ones from berryvill are made by 1x material, which is 3/4" thick. Ted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 Speaking of the IDPA box; is there any reason they didn't use the IPSC standard box? I know it's only a couple mm off each side, but it seems like it would havebeen simpler since folks already ahve them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
standles Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 Speaking of the IDPA box; is there any reason they didn't use the IPSC standard box? I know it's only a couple mm off each side, but it seems like it would havebeen simpler since folks already ahve them. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> IDPA is not IPSC/USPSA we will do anything to distance ourselves from that sport. Repeat 100 times in a mantra like chant and come to the next 4 koolaid parties. By then all should be revealed. And this from me... an IDPA shooter Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freeidaho Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 Our club made one. We made ours of 3/4" plywood, because the ones made of pine eventually warp and the lid won't close all the way. Ken Reed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 (edited) Standles- I'm an IPSC Standard shooter, and coming home to shoot some USPSA and IDPA, so it would just make checking my gun that much easier. But I catch your sarcasm, which is good, 'cause you were laying it on pretty thick. Edited October 9, 2005 by dirtypool40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregg K Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 Thanks for the information on the thickness of the wood used for the official Berryville box. I just figured that as long as I was building one that it might as well be identical. I got it built today to the exact specks. I used birch plywood that I already had since it was 3/4" and should not warp as some said of the pine box. Thanks for the info and tips! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Murphy Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 (edited) Maybe they hate the metric system. Ted Edited October 12, 2005 by Ted Murphy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincent Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Some folks think the IDPA box dimensions may be derived from measuring some full size carry guns setup within IDPA guidelines. Add a little slack for tolerances and you have the box. The first time I put the ever popular 5" 1911 with ambi's, Bomars, S&A magwell, and WC 8 round mag in the box, it seemed like it was made to hold it. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEPAKevin Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Some folks think the IDPA box dimensions may be derived from measuring some full size carry guns setup within IDPA guidelines. Add a little slack for tolerances and you have the box. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> It's probably just coincidence, but the box also is a pretty good fit for two stacks of the membership brochures and applications that they send out to the cubs. I would suggest building one with nice hardwood and lining it with cedar so when not in match use it could double as a humidor. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayonaise Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Every official club is given a box. You can buy them for $15 I think from HQ. I asked them to bring a couple to the nationals for me last year. A couple of us wanted one to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 Some one needs to machine one out of steel. The official wood box besides being warped is not that accurate. Woodworkers don't work in thousandths of an inch. My magwell is shaved to 1.615". It will fit in a accurately made box, but the wood box lid might not close sometimes. We had the box out in June and July and my gun fit fine with the lid all the way close. Last month, couldn't get the lid to close and this is with the same box and same gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayonaise Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 Some one needs to machine one out of steel. The official wood box besides being warped is not that accurate. Woodworkers don't work in thousandths of an inch. My magwell is shaved to 1.615". It will fit in a accurately made box, but the wood box lid might not close sometimes. We had the box out in June and July and my gun fit fine with the lid all the way close. Last month, couldn't get the lid to close and this is with the same box and same gun. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Try Polyurethane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banjobart Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 I made a box of full one inch thick hard maple. This prevents someone (I won't mention his name) from squeezing in an oversize gun and pushing the sides of the box and lid out and hard maple also prevents cutting a groove in the sides with the sights. It is a great prop for staging a gun at the beginning of a course. We call it the gun "Safe" in a procedure. I put in the state match last year in a stage at the start position (the gun had to be retrieved from the "safe" at the start) and this saved an hour off check in time, we did not have to check guns for box fit at registration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Murphy Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 (edited) Some one needs to machine one out of steel. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> FWIW, when I was working as a cabinetmaker, with good equipment you could make a wood box within 1/32, and with the right gear, 1/64" is possible. If your gun is such that 3/100" (1/32") is enough tolerance that your gun might not fit the box, you are pushing the envelope way too far A metal box would be rather cost prohibitive at that tolerance. And don't forget when you want to get accurate to a thousandth of an inch, the price goes up. I know of some fella on his own made an IPSC box that way,but the problem was the corners ended up being rounded, which caused its own problems. Ted Edited October 12, 2005 by Ted Murphy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincent Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 With standard pine or plywood the IDPA boxes are cheap enough to be replaced regularly. If warping is a constant issue then change wood and protect it with deck stain or similar. You could make a "super" box but it would probably not be worth the expense. Although I think a box made of transparent 1/2" plastic would look pretty neat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 (edited) If your gun is such that 3/100" (1/32") is enough tolerance that your gun might not fit the box, you are pushing the envelope way too far Hehehe I guess I'm an envelope pusher. I had my STI magwell machined down/reshaped and at it's maximum width it is 1.620" (.005" under maximum allowable width) so I hope your boxes are "accurate" because my micrometer is. Edited October 12, 2005 by Crusher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Murphy Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 (edited) : I had my STI magwell machined down/reshaped and at it's maximum width it is 1.620" (.005" under maximum allowable width) so I hope your boxes are "accurate" because my micrometer is. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> My box is accurate enough and is the one I got from Berryville. If your gun doesn't fit in the "official" box I'm using for the match you've got a DQ. Ted Edited October 13, 2005 by Ted Murphy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincent Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 (edited) I wouldn't want it that close. Using the box as a start position is pretty common at major matches and with tolerances that tight you are likely to have an issue getting the gun out of the box unless you take it out just right. My totally factory SVI Cross Competitor with SVI mags and basepads fits in the box with plenty of room to spare. I'd rather not have to worry about it. I personally think that IDPA is sending a pretty clear message to folks that it doesn't want people pushing the limits of the sport. If that's something you like to do it will probably catch up to you. Edited October 13, 2005 by vincent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 My box is accurate enough and is the one I got from Berryville Well if a box lid won't close on "my gun" the "official box" is out of the "official specs" *, by at least .005" To DQ a competitor with a legal gun because a box is skewed is ............... well............... so IDPA. *Fit in the IDPA gun test box measuring 8 ¾” x 6” x 1 5/8.” with an empty magazine inserted. Note: 1 5/8" - 1.625" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 I thought I was cutting it close, I still have .010" but I'm also 10 grams under the max weight. There's no problem with getting the gun out of the box. It usually the magwell that is right at the limit of the box. So if someone's gun doesn't fit in the official box, but proves that the box is not within the specifications but the gun is indeed within specifications, how would you rule that one? My calibrated digital caliper is usually in my car if an accurate measuring device is needed. I don't like leaving my calipers at works because my company is too cheap to buy decent ones. You know it is a wood box. A couple forceful closing of the lid will make put a big enough indentation to make it close. Also if you try the 4 different orientations, usually one way will fit. It's usually works if you orient it with the magwell towards the hinges. If you look at the lid, it doesn't sit flush all the way around. Usually there will be a big gap by the hinges. You can make a steel or aluminum box without rounded corners. It's more work, but it can be done by either broaching or scraping. A plexiglass box will be much more dimensionally stable than a wood box. No matter how you treat the wood, it's still going to warp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Murphy Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 I thought I was cutting it close, I still have .010" but I'm also 10 grams under the max weight. There's no problem with getting the gun out of the box. It usually the magwell that is right at the limit of the box. So if someone's gun doesn't fit in the official box, but proves that the box is not within the specifications but the gun is indeed within specifications, how would you rule that one? My calibrated digital caliper is usually in my car if an accurate measuring device is needed. I don't like leaving my calipers at works because my company is too cheap to buy decent ones. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Look, I keep my box inside and out of the elements. Take a good metal ruler, and it measures out to the specs. If your gun is so tight that it a box .003" out of spec is going to make it not fit in, it is too tight. The book is all about the benefit of the doubt, but that is ridiculous. And as vincent says, it isnt' smart to make a gun that tight. When your gun fits the box tight, a stage that starts in the box will cost you a match if you cannot get the gun out. And I've seen that happen. They push the gun in there and get the rear sight lodged in the wood. Then at the beep, they are fighting the box. Usafe stage? Or someone who should have filed a bit more off. Learn the hard way then. Ted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 This is confusing My (guns) messure 8.65" long (box is 8.75" long), 5.90" in height with magazine inserted (box is 6.00" height/tall) and 1.620" wide (box is 1.625") the ONLY issue I have run across is with an out of spec box (several years ago) that had lid warpage and left the box lid open (visable gap) upon closure. I fliped the gun around (magwell toward hinges) and the lid fully closed. I have never had the need to "wedge" my guns into the box even though I am (lenght x height) within 7/64 of maximum lenght x height and .005" within maximum width (warped lids can cause an issue, however if the lid won't close on "my gun" I KNOW the box is out of spec). I guess my point is if a competitor is going to get DQed from a match even though the gun is fully compliant with regard to it's overall dimensions and this DQ is based on a "questionable box" dimensions AND the competitor KNOWS his/her gun is compliant, a set of calipers on hand might not be a bad idea to avoid the wrong call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Murphy Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 (edited) I guess my point is if a competitor is going to get DQed from a match even though the gun is fully compliant with regard to it's overall dimensions and this DQ is based on a "questionable box" dimensions AND the competitor KNOWS his/her gun is compliant, a set of calipers on hand might not be a bad idea to avoid the wrong call. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Who says the dimensions of the box are questionable? Rules say "Box" not calipers. I'm all for helping guys out and I've even went got a second box to make sure a gun would fit. But you are taking this to a ridiculous conclusion. I know you all hate the "spirit of the game" argument, but some MD's may well think you are volating it when you build a gun so close to the envelope you need NASA to construct the box in order to check a gun. And again, you will end up trying to pry your gun out of a box one day on the clock, so what would you gain in doing this? You're just trying to screw with the system. Enjoy. Ted Edited October 13, 2005 by Ted Murphy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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