supercomp9 Posted May 18, 2005 Share Posted May 18, 2005 dirtypool40 and supercomp9, normal business hours for me are 8 to 8 Monday thru Friday, PST. So finding time to call me should not be a problem. I will even answer the phone on the weekends if I am not out at the range or with the family. If you do not get a person on the phone, leave a message. There is alot of info about my business that is not on my website, so just ask. Emails work too, but if the questions get long, I will not take the time to type out a long response. Usually, your detailed questions will cause me to have questions, and the typing just goes on and on. What do I think about the Docter Sight, and why do I use it? I think it is one of the best "slide mounted red dot sights" we have today, as far as design is concerned. I use it because it can be mounted so low on a 1911 slide, that I can see the top of the slide, the target, and the dot on the target all at the same time. Your draw height between iron sights and the Docter is the same. Unfortantly, Glocks do not have the same barrel lock angle as the 1911, so you will not have the benifit of seeing the top of the slide while aiming, as caspian28r pointed out on his gun." ] Thanks Mr Beven.. your insite and answers to all the questions is what I was looking for... I might take you up on the offer and the phone call when I get all the stuff I need to do the project with... SuperComp9 Jerry K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 Updated the other Docter thread HERE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted May 25, 2005 Author Share Posted May 25, 2005 Well, I am more confused than ever. Paul is telling me not to do it, but a buddy form the Burner course loves them. What to do, what to do? Kinda like the idea, but hate to get into something that will not be competitive. Any more comments by those that have used them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Moore Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 eric, i think if you were going from a cmore to a doctor then you might not like the field of view. however, since you're going from limited to a dot sight which is the same thing i did, i picked up the doctor right away and so will you. granted the field of view is somewhat smaller than other dot sights but if you're planning on switching from limited to open and back then the doctor is the way to go. i do believe shooters have shied away from the doctor because of the earlier issues. the grams method should prove to be an excellent modification. i sort of bullet proof my sights as well with some loctite on the diode screws and a glob of silicon on the flat spring. this method keeps the diode screws from backing out from constant pounding of the slide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 If you're really really dialed in with the gunhandling of your Limited gun, then the Doctersight and Ti comp combination is going to mimic the Ltd gun very closely - for weight, balance, draws, mag changes, transitions, everything. Beven's Docter has been everything I wanted - the field of view is not an issue because I warm up every once in a while with the Limited gun and then just present the Open gun exactly the same way. The hardest part has been reminding myself to keep looking at the targets, don't look back at the gun. Probably a combination of a 2 1/2 year layoff from Open shooting, then the fact that the sight moves [like iron sights move]. As Travis T says on his Max's Choice forum, the dot shows you how the gun is ready to shoot again MUCH MUCH sooner than iron sights tell you that. I think his thread is titled "To Shoot Open." It rings very true for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted May 25, 2005 Author Share Posted May 25, 2005 Thanks guys, this is the stuff I want to hear. I am waiting to hear back from Chuck & Dan. I'll let you know. I am going to be a manly Limited shooter predominantly and will probably never go above about 30-40% Open. that being said, while not a world beater, I don't want to be held back by my choice in gear, so I am nervous. Got the new 1050 in the mail yesterday, so no pressure to shootopen or anything.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 Well, I am more confused than ever. Paul is telling me not to do it, but a buddy form the Burner course loves them. What to do, what to do?Kinda like the idea, but hate to get into something that will not be competitive. Any more comments by those that have used them? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> It's a personal preference thing... and it will definitely be competitive if you train with it (c'mon, dude, you should know that by now). Find someone that's got one and check it out. If no one around has one and you're truly interested in it, just spend the dough. Definitely have Beven bulletproof it and low-mount it. I don't really care for 'em. I like the big field of view of the C-More. However, I have no problems going from my C-More'd STI to my iron-sighted STI to my iron-sighted Glock. As a matter of fact, give me an STI or a Glock and I'm fine... no problems switching to others' guns, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted May 25, 2005 Author Share Posted May 25, 2005 You make good points, for a 300# gorrilla.... Problem is I can't "just try one" I'm down South, and there ain't no such a beast here. Really leaning towards trying one. I almost feel like you guys are double dog daring me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 You make good points, for a 300# gorrilla....Problem is I can't "just try one" I'm down South, and there ain't no such a beast here. Really leaning towards trying one. I almost feel like you guys are double dog daring me. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You just dropped $1500 on a new reloader, might as well do it on a new pistol, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted May 25, 2005 Author Share Posted May 25, 2005 2yr. worth of components for Open and Standard, a new badass bench, a new 1050, a new open gun. Yup, in for a dime in for $5000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 Upfront, I'll say that I've never used a Doctor, so I don't know anything about them. I have shot the older Optima, but I understand the new sight is a lot better than the original. That said - after reading back through the thread, I'm not sure you're looking to solve a problem with money and technology that's really just a training issue?? I generally have found that I can switch between Open and Limited hardware with just a few slow practice draws and indexes to reestablish body alignment. I don't mean a lot of focused dry fire, I mean a couple of minutes worth of time. Well, I have to swap glasses, too, to pick up my cheater tape - and that doesn't account for switching between irons and a dot and gun timing, etc, but does cover the difference in sight heights, etc. Obviously, different strokes, etc. If you try the equipment, and it proves to be superior for you, then use it. But, buying a whole new gun, with technology that you've never used, based on hearsay, just to correct what basically amounts to a training issue??? I'd say - shoot what ya got until the next time you make it back up to the states - then try to shoot one while you're here. Especially if Open isn't going to be your focus - you have a gun that works, and will continue to work for a long time. Why dump *another* $2500+ on a gun?? You won't be able to use one as a backup in a match for the other - in fact, depending on which one you choose, you obsolete the other for your use w/o some gunsmithing (new slide on the C-More gun, new sight on the Doctor gun). Now if only I had your free cash flow...... Just my 2 pesos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted May 25, 2005 Author Share Posted May 25, 2005 worse still I was talking about selling gun #1 to finance gun #2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcoliver Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 I've tried a slide-mounted Optima, a DR on a frame mount, couple of cmores and OKO's. If you look for differences, certainly, you'll find some. But, generally, hardly matter much if you don't. Much less if you put in the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted June 6, 2005 Author Share Posted June 6, 2005 Well, it's beena couple of weeks, and I think for now the decision has been made for me.....financially. Not only am I not buying a new open gun, I may have to sell the one I have to pay for laser surgery. Running the numbers it's also about $400+ more to go DR. if you do it the right way. For now, for me at least, I'm going to heal up and try to learn to shoot the C-more I already have before I go re-inventing things. Thanks to everyone for their inputs and esp. Mr. Grams for his patience in answering all my rookie quesitons. Still interested in playing with one someday, just not in the cards right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted June 6, 2005 Share Posted June 6, 2005 I'd also say that most people who already have a C-More sighted gun are best off just practicing a lot with it. I like the Docter as much as any Open setup I've owned [Aimpoint, PDP2, C-More on 1911s, P9 and Caspian HiCap] and the main reason is it's low to the bore. But it's not top-heavy like a tube sight. And no ejection problems. If you like a low-down dot, probably as good a solution as any is this: LOW C-MORE -- Same 3 reasons. Click on all the photo links, there's 4 pictures in all. The mount looks a lot like the old Dawson V-groove mount for the PDP3 tube sight, but with a C-More. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dean Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 dirtypool, I am here in south florida and have a complete set up in docter by Beven. I have been playing arounfd with it lately and can say it is a lot lighter and faster. Going from c-more the field of view is smaller but the gun presents higher allowing you to never have to worry about the close range due to the c-more dot being much higher than the barrel. With the docter it is point of aim from 1 foot to 50 yards. If you want to try this set up I will be at Franks for the 2nd sunday match so come and try it out.. The gun is sut-up in 9mm so hold on tight....... See you this weekend if you can make it.. Dean makkos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted June 8, 2005 Author Share Posted June 8, 2005 I may just do that. I am headed home on medical leave for a month or so. If I make it to Frank's I'll look you up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulW Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 (Sound of Paul smacking Eric many times) Your as hard headed as I am!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted June 8, 2005 Author Share Posted June 8, 2005 ...no!! Ow! I'm mean just OW!!!! out of curiosi-OW!!!-ty.... I'm Stick-OW!!ing with the C-OW!!-more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulW Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 LMAO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted June 8, 2005 Author Share Posted June 8, 2005 Duuuude, wait a second...... ....... I can see!!!! That's what I needed!!!! Nope, just kidding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gino_aki Posted June 11, 2005 Share Posted June 11, 2005 I sure wished I'd have read through this thread before I decided to go with a slide mounted red dot...ahh well, 20-20 hindsight. Anyway, I got in on the cheap with a FirePoint from eBay to mount on an older Bomar sighted Open single stack since my eyes won't let me use iron sights fast enough for Open anymore...out here in the hinterlands (Maui) a single stack is all you need since we're still limited to ten rounds. You wanna see how things are run in a Democrat controlled state, ya'll just come out here and see...but don't get me started. I'm getting vertical stringing now though, even though the Bomars were fairly right on. (Hope the home drilled ports in the barrel aren't to blame). JP Bomar mount does have a tendency to work loose, but still strings shots even when tight. Just ordered a Docter from Brownells with the EGW mount ( hey, aluminum and three hunnert bucks has got to be better right? duh) to see if it's the sight or the gun. Sure wish I'd known that I'd have to invest another 300 bucks or so (more? ack) to get it mounted properly and bulletproofed. I DO like the cleaner lines of the Firepoint, and don't really lose the dot if I hold the gun properly...the ledge on the AW Custom slide stop really helps there. Plus, no way do I ever hit the mag release on a grab off a table. Like others have mentioned, I think the transition between my hopefully soon to be Grams-magicked Open gun and my trusty old Limited singlestack will be a lot easier. This especially in light of the "multi-division entrant" nature of most of my club's matches. I would have to mention that I don't like C-More's. For me it's a lot easier to index a tube type red dot. I shot an Aimpoint on my old Open gun which now wears a PDP5. I never lose the dot on that gun and being in B means it doesn't really matter if the gun is a little heavier. Plus PDP5's can be gotten fairly cheap on eBay. And no, not the new generation of cheapo Chinese copies, although the thought of having 5 or 6 sighted in and ready- to-go sights in the gun bag for less than the cost of one C-more is intriguing for a shooter on a budget. (And who isn't?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caspian38 Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 OK i can't figure out how to QUOTE ... But If you already have a C-more USE IT !!! and use the extra cash to buy a Marvel 22 for practice ...I have just retired the JP and the Doctor! Both worked well and are a GREAT IDEA! as others have mentioned the field of view SUCKS! I even went so far as to run a Close grip moving the dot closer to my eye. Its not that they are slow or even that they break (Mine worked flawless through thousands of rounds) ... they are just MORE WORK FOR THE SAME RESULTS! I have had the C-more for a while and am Picking up speed And hits!!! If it takes you even a 1000th of a second to re-aquire the dot between shots that's still extra work for NO REASON! best of luck Si Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Since this thread's been bumped, thought I'd add that the cost of the 7MOA Docter and Beven's bullet-proofing has increased. Looking at $625 installed. If you're wealthy and like the low-mounted dot, I'd say go for it, the system works and Beven's dot is very bright. If costs of a new gun are a big concern [for many of us it is] I'd say look at all the options, talk to the gunsmiths you want to work with. You'll have difficulty getting any sort of price break from the package-deal cost of most well-known gunsmiths - a lot of this has to do with the reliability of the C-More and the super-low dealer cost, something like $159 for the Serendipity sight. If you see someone with an Aimpoint on a Springfield or Weigand mount, ask the owner to show it to you. I was surprised how much I like left-to-right target transitions with this setup. Better than a PDP3, better than the Docter for many targets, about as good as the C-More for most targets. It IS top-heavy, I went to a different mag-change because of it, however with the Ice magwell and Guga front pouch, its the fastest reload I've ever had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gino_aki Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Sold the Firepoints and the Docter broke.... Open gun now wears JP Double Ring sights. But now the extractor has gone south. Arggggghhhh...sometimes I think I oughta just stick with surfing and golf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now