Light Primer Strikes with CCI's

[nunez]

Ammo: Atlanta Arms 147gr JHP & their 147gr Reloads (Called and they use CCI Primers)

Guns:

Stock II: PD 12# Hammer Spring, Henning 5 Firing Pin or Stock(Stock seems worse), PD Firing Pin Spring, Titan Hammer, Xtreme Sear, PD Light Trigger Return Spring, CGW Light Plunger Spring, PD Light Sear Spring. PD 10# Recoil Spring, BOLO, Extended Firing Pin Block

Stock II Xtreme: PD 13# Hammer Spring, Henning 5 Firing Pin or Xtreme Stock(Seems better), PD Firing Pin Spring, Titan Hammer, Xtreme Sear, PD Light Trigger Return Spring, CGW Light Plunger Spring, PD Light Sear Spring. PD 10# Recoil Spring, BOLO, Extended Firing Pin Block

All the parts that has ever been mentioned to polish are extensively polished.

Getting mid 6 DA/mid 2 SA on both, the Stock II being slightly less due to 12# Hammer Spring I believe

The Stock II refused to light off CCI primers in DA, 80% in SA, and the Xtreme will light off 80-90% of them in DA and 100% in SA.  

Please help this is getting frustrating. 

[ryridesmotox]

Change out the Henning firing pins. Had a problem not igniting stuff with them. Clipped the firing pin spring... Helped a little. Went back to a heavier firing pin and it is 100% I use Atlantic 124gr reloads. Everything you have and a 13lbs pd hammer spring or a Wolff... Both work.

[emjei]

My .02 cents...... the PD 12# on MY GUN doesnt like CCIs neither. ...... used the 13# and problem fixed.....heavier DA ?? (dont even noticed )

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[emjei]

Good advice from one of the first pioneers of PD aftermarket Tanfo parts. Thanks for your input, MJ!

 

Edit: I can actually elaborate a little more. Stock springs, or "other" after market springs stack. Thats the reason PD came out with better hammer springs; it eliminates the stack.  Stacking is the binding of the coils during compression, which theoretically leads to a harder strike.  If you want a stack-less, smooth trigger pull, you may have to go up to the next highest spring. 

100% agree.....those PD springs are Stack Free and MUCH better than the others...... not to mention the Color Code (that is the best part !!!!)

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[ryridesmotox]

I've only got about 100 of Atlantic down the pipe since I straightened the gun out. But it seems to work fine now

[Edge40]

Heavier main spring perhaps.  CCI primers are just about the hardest of the bunch.

[waktasz]

How does the 12# PD spring compare to the EG light spring? My gun is 100% with the EG light spring and CCI primers, but this last batch of EG hammer springs seem to last only a few thousand rounds before then give up the ghost. 

Edited September 20, 2016 by waktasz

[nunez]

1 hour ago, ryridesmotox said:

Change out the Henning firing pins. Had a problem not igniting stuff with them. Clipped the firing pin spring... Helped a little. Went back to a heavier firing pin and it is 100% I use Atlantic 124gr reloads. Everything you have and a 13lbs pd hammer spring or a Wolff... Both work.

I was having issues with the Henning so I switched today to the Xtreme to try and got better results in the Xtreme. 

[nunez]

1 hour ago, emjei said:

My .02 cents...... the PD 12# on MY GUN doesnt like CCIs neither. ...... used the 13# and problem fixed.....heavier DA ?? (dont even noticed )

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk
 

I have the PD #13 in the Xtreme and still getting 10% light strikes.

[ryridesmotox]

I'm going to order a egw pin. They seem to be slightly better than stock... I also just got in the optimized during pin springs so I may switch around the pins yet again. 

[nunez]

1 hour ago, ARy said:

First I'd remove that reduced plunger spring and put the stock one back in. That's been discussed extensively. Second, I'd run a heavier pin, like the extreme firing pin. Third, run a heavier hammer spring. 

This is something a lot of folks don't get - unless you're reloading your own ammo, you can fault the gun or parts for light strikes. You have to fiddle as ryridesmotox just mentioned. 

At a match, Rys gun had an ungodly amount of light strikes. Another gun w the exact same setup and springs ran double the rounds (500) flawless the same day. Reloaded using Win primers. Ry went back and dialed in what worked with his specific setup, using Atlanta arms. So he'd probably be your best resource for what works with that ammo. 

Edit: Also you say parts are extensively polished. Sand paper, metal polish? Look like this? I have no problem lighting off CCI/Win/sometimes SB/etc with a 12# PD hammer spring. But I take my prep into the abyss, lol. 

 

nni

I'll post a photo of both the guns polishing. Xtreme firing pin did work a bit better for me today instead of the Henning. I'll change the plunger spring. Thanks. 

[36873687]

Cci are the worst for light strikes I've used em all. I just bought a back up 2011 an it was light strikes on stellar an bonnet primers An I think they are better primers than cci. change to a 17 hammer spring problem solved

[johnbu]

I would inspect / correct a few things before going nuclear on springs.  First, inspect the firing pin block and firing pin to see if they are impacting. Can simply run without and see if it's better as a test.  Then inspect the firing pin and block channels. They should allow those elements to slide freely without springs in place. Then inspect the frame gap where the hammer swings. The hammer shouldn't be getting marked up. Burrs on the frame can slow the hammer. Then the strut should be polished and the hammer and strut pins and holes should be polished.  After all that is checked, fitted, polished and lubed up it "should" pop cci with the 12.  If not go to the 14. I prefer reliability over the last oz of trigger pull.  My polished gun is under 6da with the 14 spring, hopefully you'll be too.

 

Haven't tested but, my feeeelings say the 13pd is lighter than the EG light, but hits just as hard. The 14 still feels lighter to my finger, but I haven't gotten bored with that (yet).

 

 

Edited September 20, 2016 by johnbu

[nunez]

2 hours ago, johnbu said:

I would inspect / correct a few things before going nuclear on springs.  First, inspect the firing pin block and firing pin to see if they are impacting. Can simply run without and see if it's better as a test.  Then inspect the firing pin and block channels. They should allow those elements to slide freely without springs in place. Then inspect the frame gap where the hammer swings. The hammer shouldn't be getting marked up. Burrs on the frame can slow the hammer. Then the strut should be polished and the hammer and strut pins and holes should be polished.  After all that is checked, fitted, polished and lubed up it "should" pop cci with the 12.  If not go to the 14. I prefer reliability over the last oz of trigger pull.  My polished gun is under 6da with the 14 spring, hopefully you'll be too.

 

Haven't tested but, my feeeelings say the 13pd is lighter than the EG light, but hits just as hard. The 14 still feels lighter to my finger, but I haven't gotten bored with that (yet).

 

 

What is your process to smooth the frame? I've used a felt tip on all the important places, is that correct?

[nunez]

Stock II: Polished again (because its so much fun), installed a 13# PD hammer spring to test and put back in the Henning Gen5 Firing Pin, installed stock plunger spring. Ordered an Xtreme firing pin, will polish and test once it arrives.  

Going to do the same (keep Xtreme FP) with the Stock II Xtreme tonight, but with a 14# PD hammer spring. 

Polishing looks similar to ARy's wonderful polish job. 

Thanks for all the help gentlemen. 

Edited September 21, 2016 by nunez

[johnbu]

Depends on the place. I've pretty much used any and everything that was a snug fit to the spot that would hold the compound or sand paper.  I have paper up to 5000 grit.

  I use  a 6 inch diameter "rag wheel" on a bench grinder. The larger diameter is easier to keep things flat and it works great.

 

 

 

Edited September 21, 2016 by johnbu

[PatriotDefense]

Just to elaborate a little more on the "lighter" trigger bar plunger springs that are being installed. When this is done you loose upward pressure on the trigger bar contacting the disco which allows it to break from the trigger bar earlier giving you a shorter DA throw. We saw a rash of these locally pop up when somebody in the Houston area recommended it and of course as Tanfo owners it caught like wild fire to chase the absolute lightest trigger (BOLO really does not like this due to its tight fitment). These guys have you going in the right direction, we get a slew of phone calls a day asking what springs work with what primers and unfortunately there are to many variables at play to have a go to answer for that. Parts installed, parts fitment, polishing, and primer seating depth all play a huge part as to what you will be able to consistently light off. 

[waktasz]

if you thin the bolo, vertically, the trigger bar sits up higher in the gun and doesn't drop off as soon. 

[PatriotDefense]

Matt that is correct, however you start getting into increased pre-travel if you dont know exactly what areas to hit. 

[ElMateo487]

Just to elaborate a little more on the "lighter" trigger bar plunger springs that are being installed. When this is done you loose upward pressure on the trigger bar contacting the disco which allows it to break from the trigger bar earlier giving you a shorter DA throw. We saw a rash of these locally pop up when somebody in the Houston area recommended it and of course as Tanfo owners it caught like wild fire to chase the absolute lightest trigger (BOLO really does not like this due to its tight fitment). These guys have you going in the right direction, we get a slew of phone calls a day asking what springs work with what primers and unfortunately there are to many variables at play to have a go to answer for that. Parts installed, parts fitment, polishing, and primer seating depth all play a huge part as to what you will be able to consistently light off. 

So what are the symptoms that the bolo is not working well with a lightened plunger?

[PatriotDefense]

Short stroke/trigger bar slipping under on the DA pull

[nunez]

UPDATE:

Took the Stock II & The Xtreme to the range.

Mods Changed from original post list:

Stock II: Stock Plunger Spring, 13# (from 12#) Hammer Spring, Polished Henning FP Gen5, Polished Again, Removed FP Block

Stock II Xtreme: Stock Plunger Spring, Polished Again, Removed FP Block

Ammo: Atlanta Arms 147gr JHP (Fired 50 in DA, 25 in SA in test each)

Stock II: Light Strikes: 5 DA out of 50rds / 0 SA out of 25rds

Stock II Xtreme Light Strikes: 9 DA out of 50rds / 0 SA out of 25rds

Ammo: Federal American Eagle 147gr FMJ Flat Point

Stock II: Zero Light Primer Strikes, but had 3 failure to extract. Empty brass was still in chamber. 

Stock II Xtreme: Zero Light Primer Strikes. First round didn't go into battery and had to hold slide and slam hand into grip to get it out. Didn't have any issues after that. 

Is this a common problem with Flat Point ammo?

 

[nunez]

On September 20, 2016 at 4:43 PM, ryridesmotox said:

Change out the Henning firing pins. Had a problem not igniting stuff with them. Clipped the firing pin spring... Helped a little. Went back to a heavier firing pin and it is 100% I use Atlantic 124gr reloads. Everything you have and a 13lbs pd hammer spring or a Wolff... Both work.

I put in the Xtreme firing pin back into my Xtreme and got 9/50 light primer strikes in DA. 13# PD Hammer Spring and PD Firing Pin Spring. My regular Stock II I put in a Henning Gen5 FP and got 5/50 Light Strikes in DA. 

[nunez]

6 minutes ago, ARy said:

Did you plunk test that ammo? Obviously it's seeming to be ammo related; esp. primer hardness, seating depth, etc.

American Eagle 147gr FMJ Flat Nose:

Atlanta Arms 147gr JHP:

 

 

[nunez]

On September 20, 2016 at 6:27 PM, ryridesmotox said:

I'm going to order a egw pin. They seem to be slightly better than stock... I also just got in the optimized during pin springs so I may switch around the pins yet again. 

Which one in particular are you planning on trying? Very interested, please keep me updated. Thanks