Coated lead bullets loading tips?

[robport]

I had an ass-plosion this morning. I had about 90 Acme 147's left and about 85 into shooting them, I heard a boom and the gun almost jumped from my hands. The gun went partially into battery on the next round. I had to use a significant amount of force to get the slide back to remove the next cartridge. On disassembly (after I changed my underwear), I found a thick coating of red epoxy on the front edge of the chamber and some in the first part of the barrel. Nothing would pass a simple plunk test. I took the gun home, cleaned it, got it cycling again, inspected it closely, then went back to the range. It works find now with my Xtremes.

I believe it was due to the buildup of the epoxy in the front of the chamber. The Walther PPQ seems to have a very tight chamber, so I don't think this is the best bullet for it. It was cycling a little slow before it happened but it didn't dawn on me until it went boom. By the way, I found the casing and it wasn't damaged, blown out, cracked or anything...but the primer was missing. I don't think I overstuffed the case, a double=charge is pretty obvious since I'm also running a powder cop.

This morning, I also tried the Zombie bullets. A slight smell, but not bad at all, not like the acrid nose-burning smell I had before with the red ones.

With 3.1 grains of bullseye, they averaged 912 ft/sec with a standard deviation of 21. That's not too bad a range, but I am going to try to drop it 0.1 grains more to see if the spread goes up or down.

Accuracy seemed OK, but I'll play with that more once I get the power factor the way I want it. I had to load them to what I considered unusually short, 1.080, to get them to go into the chamber. They have a rather wide shoulder.

I don't think I'm using the ACME again. I am not too fond of the soft and brittle nature of the coating and the truncated design won't cycle in all my guns. They are probably fine in a reamed chamber for outdoor use.

Those were packaged beautifully in a nice wooden box and came with a little box of candy...very nice touches. They also got here on the third day after I ordered them...fastest of any other company.

[bowenbuilt]

I like the ACME's because of the lack of smell they produce. I found out when I was coating my own bullets that the thinner the coating the more burned wire smell I would get. With the ACME bullets I only get a slight whiff at times but nothing like some of the others. This tells me that you were scraping the coating pretty thin if you were getting a big time burning smell. The big boom most likely came from a set back as the coating gathered in the front of the chamber. I don't know if I would damn the manufacturer because of a component mismatch. The Walther has a fairly tight chamber which was probably doing some heavy scraping on bullets that were just a touch too long because of OAL variance. Blue bullets are not Hy-Tek coated and they are sized at groove diameter which would probably be a better fit to your tight chambered gun. If the Zombie bullets don't work out because of the slightly larger diameter Give the Blues a try, they won't smell and will more closely fit your gun.

[moonman16]

robport,

I just went and checked a CZ-P01 and a CZ-SP-01,

I saw no such buildup I use VV N320 and ACME pills,124 and 147's

147's loaded to 1.075.

LIPSTICK RED HI-TEK, been using them several weeks now,with no issues.

Fast service, love the little boxes, I give the candy away though.

Maybe a bad batch was produced with an UNDER CURED COATING.

The Australian developer and manufacture says if you are self coating

your castings with his product and SMELL an electrical or burning plastic

type odor, the baking/cure time was too short for the type resin/catalyst used.

Edited August 22, 2015 by moonman16

[techj]

Like others have said - check crimp and OAL; make sure it passes the plunk test.

I load mine like regular lead...there is maybe a 10-15fps difference...maybe...if that.

I prefer the Blue Bullets for 9 & 45...will take a little smurf dust while loading vs the smell while shooting. For my 38/357 I use the Bayou SWC as I need to roll crimp into the groove.

I deprime, resize and final clean (ultrasonic) all of my brass so that there is no lube left on the brass and so that I can use all 5 of my stations (Hornady LNL) for loading which is as follows: expand, powder drop, bullet feeder, seat, crimp (FCD). Only wish I had 1 more station so that I could use a powder cop rather than just a visual check - but I'm not going to spend the $$$ at this point to switch presses. I found that expanding during powder drop led to some inconsistencies and prefer to expand by itself.

BTW - love the coated bullets - so much less expensive for the bullet and less powder as well.

[moonman16]

techj,

Some people experience issues with HI-TEK coatings and the use of a Lee FCD.

Bullet fit and not cutting the coating while seating or crimping is very important.

Good Shooting!

[textopcat]

One question, why?

After comparing price for plated, lead and coated bullets - My conslusion for 9mm, is that Extreme plated is as cheap as the other alternatives (considering, tax, shipping, etc)

For .45 ACP I have a local supplier that sells lead 230 gn for $10 per 100 (inc Sales Tax). That is somewhat cheaper than plated Extreme, but not really all that much.

Since, the .45ACP 1911 has standard riffling, I found that shooting lead was OK but certainly more smoke. So, I am still undecided as to if it is worth the difference in price. However, I have not found coated bullets that would provide any price advantage to plated. What have I missed?

[Shmella]

One question, why?

After comparing price for plated, lead and coated bullets - My conslusion for 9mm, is that Extreme plated is as cheap as the other alternatives (considering, tax, shipping, etc)

For .45 ACP I have a local supplier that sells lead 230 gn for $10 per 100 (inc Sales Tax). That is somewhat cheaper than plated Extreme, but not really all that much.

Since, the .45ACP 1911 has standard riffling, I found that shooting lead was OK but certainly more smoke. So, I am still undecided as to if it is worth the difference in price. However, I have not found coated bullets that would provide any price advantage to plated. What have I missed?

Buying bullets by the case is going to save you the most money. Buying coated bullets by the case and they're even cheaper. Blue bullets by the case are the cheapest I can remember seeing and they work good for me so far.

[robport]

Cost per 1000 Total Notes
Coated Black Bullets 90.5
Blue Bullets 89
Bayou 90
Precision 76 Black coating, slick to the touch. No significant smell or smoke when I fired it. Ordered them and got them in three days. Bought 230 for 45's, so no direct comparison. All were 230 on the dot though.
Acme 78.9 Red coating, brittle, reminds me of candy apple coating. Acrid plastic smell (burning feeling in my sinuses, but I may be allergic to it) but no smoke when I fired it. Ordered them and got them in three days
Had a few undersized by diameter. All I weighed were 145. The truncated cone design worked fine in my Walther, but not in my non-ramped 1911. Had to load ta 1.080 OAL to get them to work. Left red debris in forward end of chamber. May have needed to load them even shorter.

Lucky 13 72 Just started to use them. Haven't noticed a smell, but a little more smoke than the others (not more than some commercial ammo though). Still working up a load for them..Had to load ta 1.080 OAL for chambering. Took 10 days after ordering to receive them. Round nose design with wide shoulders. Haven't done accuracy testing yet.

Plated Xtreme 88.13
Berry's 107.28

These were the latest prices I got for 1000 147 grain bullets shipped, with easily located discounts applied.. I understand that some of you buy in a lot more volume, but most of these companies have volume discounts.

Precision, Acme, and Lucky 13 represent, in my opinion, enough of a cost savings to look at them for switching to. Otherwise, I'll stay with the Xtremes. Their ease in loading is a big plus.

I started off with the assumption that I wasn't going to switch to coated if it was more expensive than what I was using, so Black, Blue, and Bayou were out from the time I saw their prices.

I understand that people have their favorites and some people have very impressive brand loyalty (for you guys, please don't take offence). I also understand that some get a discount from being sponsored. I'm just a standard customer though, like most that will buy them and frankly just want the best bang for the buck for something that works for me.

So far, Precision and Lucky13 have potential. The ACME's, while I'm sure are great for many people, are not for me.

All of them make nice little holes in the cardboard.

Edited August 23, 2015 by robport

[danjordan78]

I just did a cost comparison of all the coated bullets out there. Narrowed it down to these 4 brands for a variety of reasons. I looked at every brand I could find including coated, plated, jacketed, etc. Cost wise these are the best bargain. Blue Bullets come in at $0.075 per round.

Xtremes come in around $0.10 per round when ordered in comparable case quantities with shipping (3000/case for 147s). That can jump up even more depending on where you live since they only ship UPS (no idea why they wouldn't use flat rate shipping).

[Yardbird]

I just bought 3000 Acme 115s @ $0.058/rnd.

[JRM83]

Xtremes come in around $0.10 per round when ordered in comparable case quantities with shipping (3000/case for 147s). That can jump up even more depending on where you live since they only ship UPS (no idea why they wouldn't use flat rate shipping).

At $0.10 per bullet I would be loading a premium JHP instead of a plated bullet. Zero 147 JHPs are $104/k if you buy 2k+, or you can get 124/125s from many companies for around $0.10

[robport]

It almost sounds like you are talking about Berry's Bullets at .10 per bullet..

For Xtremes, I have always paid $88 shipped for 1000 (2 500 round boxes.) It goes by pony express and takes 10 days to get here, but I don't wait until the last minute to order. I don't know why 3000 would be more per bullet.

Right now, they are listed at 43.75 for 500 147 RN copper plated. Every two weeks or so, they have a 5% off sale and I use the $5 shipping option. That comes out at $88.12 to my door or .088/bullet.

124's and 115 are both cheaper, of course.

I've never checked out if they have volume discounts.

[robport]

Shot about 80 Lucky 13 bullets this morning. They chrono out at about 130 power factor with a pretty tight range with 3.0 grains of bullseye. That is .2 grains less than the XTreme for the same PF. Some smoke, but very little. A very slight smell that wasn't objectionable (I still think I may be allergic to the heated coating smoke on the ACME by the burning in my nose...not it's fault.) All cycled fine with no noticeable debris left in the chamber. I can use these, at least in my Walther.

Only reason I didn't shoot more is...ahem, I didn't use locktite on my front sight and it started spinning in place. I have had one with way too little diameter so far. I fell all the way into the belled case. It was .354 at the shoulder and as low as .347 below that. I'll have to watch out for more of those.

I'm going to buy more of these.

[b1gcountry]

SNS Gives 15%off for large orders over 50k iirc. One of our club shooters delivers them for us to give us free shipping. That isn't a standard deal for everyone, but it gets me a 125gr for 57.80 per 1k out the door.

I don't really notice any difference between the coated and the plated, and our cowboy range does not allow any plated or jacketed bullets. So the coated stuff makes sense for me in a lot of ways.